Trae vs. Jimmer vs. Nash/Curry?

[vdunkndunk]

So, I’ve been critical of the decision to trade the No. 3 pick for Trae Young regardless of the extra 1st-rounder. My main problem was with a) Trae’s diminutive size, turnovers, defense, and shot selection, plus b) my high belief in Doncic and JJJ.

That said, after watching SL all the way through, Trae’s passing is better than I realized (as long as he’s throwing it to someone inbounds and on his team), and he’s kind of fun to watch. I had a similar fascination with Steph Curry and Jimmer Fredette in college. However, I was sold on Curry, on the fence about Jimmer, and not sold on Trae coming out of school. (Admittedly, I had more time to watch Steph and Jimmer and watched most of their games, but only watched the end of Trae’s college career, which was less than impressive.)

Anyway, just watched Jimmer tear it up in the TBT. 41 points, deep 3s, everything he did in college. Trae’s a better passer, clearly - and he also had success earlier in his college career, which matters, and Trae’s more of a pure PG - but Jimmer is a little bigger and stronger. And lest we forget, Jimmer went No. 10 overall in the NBA draft. TEN OVERALL, which is closer to where most teams had Trae on their boards. And Jimmer had moments that rivaled anything Trae did in college.

So, my question is: Who is Trae Young? Steph/Nash, or Jimmer? I think his career will mirror one side or the other of this coin, but not sure which. Watching Jimmer at the TBT tonight, it’s like he can score 40 on anyone, anywhere...except in the NBA. Can Trae Young find a way to do it in the NBA? His passing gives me a measure of hope, and, presumably, he’ll find a way to hit some 3s, but I’m still skeptical. Trae’s fun to watch, though, when he gets it going....just like Jimmer. But what makes you think Trae willl be playing in the All Star Game in 6 years, rather than in the summer on TBT? Thoughts?

[vdunkndunk]

Sorry, posted it twice by accident. Should you wish to respond, please do so on the other thread with the same subject line. Cheers!

[thecampster]

5 minutes ago, vdunkndunk said:

So, I’ve been critical of the decision to trade the No. 3 pick for Trae Young regardless of the extra 1st-rounder. My main problem was with a) Trae’s diminutive size, turnovers, defense, and shot selection, plus b) my high belief in Doncic and JJJ.

That said, after watching SL all the way through, Trae’s passing is better than I realized (as long as he’s throwing it to someone inbounds and on his team), and he’s kind of fun to watch. I had a similar fascination with Steph Curry and Jimmer Fredette in college. However, I was sold on Curry, on the fence about Jimmer, and not sold on Trae coming out of school. (Admittedly, I had more time to watch Steph and Jimmer and watched most of their games, but only watched the end of Trae’s college career, which was less than impressive.)

Anyway, just watched Jimmer tear it up in the TBT. 41 points, deep 3s, everything he did in college. Trae’s a better passer, clearly - and he also had success earlier in his college career, which matters, and Trae’s more of a pure PG - but Jimmer is a little bigger and stronger. And lest we forget, Jimmer went No. 10 overall in the NBA draft. TEN OVERALL, which is closer to where most teams had Trae on their boards. And Jimmer had moments that rivaled anything Trae did in college.

So, my question is: Who is Trae Young? Steph/Nash, or Jimmer? I think his career will mirror one side or the other of this coin, but not sure which. Watching Jimmer at the TBT tonight, it’s like he can score 40 on anyone, anywhere...except in the NBA. Can Trae Young find a way to do it in the NBA? His passing gives me a measure of hope, and, presumably, he’ll find a way to hit some 3s, but I’m still skeptical. Trae’s fun to watch, though, when he gets it going....just like Jimmer. But what makes you think Trae willl be playing in the All Star Game in 6 years, rather than in the summer on TBT? Thoughts?

He is none of those players. He is a superior passer/play maker than Steph but not as good a scorer.  We talked about this a month or so ago but he really plays like Mike Bibby but a better scorer.  His play style is very similar to Bibby's but with higher usage.  Same height, but Bibby was 10 lbs heavier as a freshman. Trae is a slightly better passer and much better shooter but they are very similar players.  The main difference is Bibby was slightly less of a risk taker and better coached at Arizone (more controlled).

[vdunkndunk]

Sorry, accidentally triple posted this topic, apparently. Should you wish to reply, please follow the advice of Rocky’s trainer, Mic, when told that Rocky was seeing three of ‘em out there: Hit the one in the middle!

[thecampster]

 

[vdunkndunk]

1 minute ago, thecampster said:

He is none of those players. He is a superior passer/play maker than Steph but not as good a scorer.  We talked about this a month or so ago but he really plays like Mike Bibby but a better scorer.  His play style is very similar to Bibby's but with higher usage.  Same height, but Bibby was 10 lbs heavier as a freshman. Trae is a slightly better passer and much better shooter but they are very similar players.  The main difference is Bibby was slightly less of a risk taker and better coached at Arizone (more controlled).

I can see the Bibby comparison in some ways, but hadn’t thought of it myself or seen previous discussion of it. Still not a No. 3 pick-worthy comparison, to my mind, but obviously a solid player.

[vdunkndunk]

What confuses me about Trae Young is his usage rate and the depth of his 3s as a true freshman. If his freshman year had been his senior year, and he’d slowly progressed up to it over the years, I’d say take him in the second round. But I can’t really think of anyone - not Steph or Jimmer or Buddy Heild - who played like Trae as a true freshman .... getting that kind of green light to take those kinds of 3s in the modern game. Is he breaking the mold and pushing the boundaries even further in the post-Steph era? Or is it simply misguided? Can’t tell....

[vdunkndunk]

Also, one problem with the Mike Bibby comparison: Don’t see Trae completing this transition: 

[JTB]

In my kenan & Kel voice “ ahhhhhhhhhhhh here it goes!”

[nathan2331]

If he puts the work in, and improves his finishing in the paint he'll be a really good player. MVP-level, if his high volume shooting becomes efficient otherwise he'll still be a top PG. We need to find him a backcourt partner or forward who can take the pressure off him to create everything for the team and allow him develop his off ball game. I don't to see as much hero ball as we did in summer league, but he won't succeed if he plays like that. I Iike our other picks in Huerter and Spellman because they can both pass pretty well, anf even Prince can develop further to become a secondary playmaker. If we don't draft someone though, I'd expect us to try and trade or sign a SG with the abundance of cap space we'll have next year. We need to spend it before Prince becomes an RFA.

[Buzzard]

I don't get this comparison at all to Fredette. It is like comparing Jeff Teague the point guard to Kent Bazemore the shooting guard.

You do understand Fredette was/is much more of a SG than a PG. Or do you?

You said it yourself. Trae is a outstanding passer with exceptional court vision. I don't recall anyone ever saying that about Fredette. Steve Nash is a close comparison. That has been said before.

[bird_dirt]

Merge! Merge! Merge!

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I think the bigger question is who Trae tries to be?   Nash or Jimmer?

If he tries to be Jimmer, he's going to have a slow transition to the NBA.  The last thing I want to see him doing, is try to be a volume scorer.   If he's named the starter from Day 1, I think he could easily average 7+ assists in 30 minutes of play.  But I don't want to see him trying to jack up 15 shots per game in Year 1.

Jimmer's issue was that he simply wasn't quick enough to get decent shots off the dribble.   He's now much better in getting his shot off, but still can't defend to save his life.

We kind of saw that issue ( with him not being able to get off decent shots off ) with Trae in Summer League . . initially.  The deep threes that Trae takes, is a direct result of him not being able to shoot over top of guys off the dribble, which can lead to his shot being blocked.  So as soon as he's open, he's looking to shoot.

Passing Trae > Shooting Trae . . despite most casual fans wanting to see the 30 foot threes, instead of the great passes.

[AHF]

40 minutes ago, bird_dirt said:

Merge! Merge! Merge!

[thecampster]

42 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

I think the bigger question is who Trae tries to be?   Nash or Jimmer?

If he tries to be Jimmer, he's going to have a slow transition to the NBA.  The last thing I want to see him doing, is try to be a volume scorer.   If he's named the starter from Day 1, I think he could easily average 7+ assists in 30 minutes of play.  But I don't want to see him trying to jack up 15 shots per game in Year 1.

Jimmer's issue was that he simply wasn't quick enough to get decent shots off the dribble.   He's now much better in getting his shot off, but still can't defend to save his life.

We kind of saw that issue ( with him not being able to get off decent shots off ) with Trae in Summer League . . initially.  The deep threes that Trae takes, is a direct result of him not being able to shoot over top of guys off the dribble, which can lead to his shot being blocked.  So as soon as he's open, he's looking to shoot.

Passing Trae > Shooting Trae . . despite most casual fans wanting to see the 30 foot threes, instead of the great passes.

IMHO the 30 foot 3's are acceptable "in moderation".  They do serve some purpose in forcing the defense to pick him up earlier, which creates bigger passing lanes, areas of movement. But as a scoring concept...no!

[hazer]

6 minutes ago, thecampster said:

IMHO the 30 foot 3's are acceptable "in moderation".  They do serve some purpose in forcing the defense to pick him up earlier, which creates bigger passing lanes, areas of movement. But as a scoring concept...no!

Eggzactamundo (eeeeeeyyyyy??). Très will just need to learn, quickly, to pick/choose his spots when to pull that 30’ trigger. Less is more, only use it when you see them cheating off.

[benhillboy]

A more flamboyant Nash is cool but the Steph comparisons need to be tempered.  His career BPM is 5(!) times that of Nash due to a much higher physicality level.

[AHF]

Nash was a really good player but committed some highway robbery taking MVP trophies that belonged to Shaq and LeBron.

[benhillboy]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

Nash was a really good player but committed some highway robbery taking MVP trophies that belonged to Shaq and LeBron.

True.  I’ll take him over the 2 recent winners all day though.  Kobe should’ve had one more in there somewhere.

 

[EazyRoc]

I still maintain that Trae will be a combo of Nash and Curry when it’s all said and done. Not quite the scorer that Curry is, but better than Nash. He’s still got a lot to work on to get there, but the talent is there. He absolutely has to develop deep range at decent efficiency (35%) to open up the floor. He also has to get much more creative with his floaters and when/how to use them. He will come in to the league an above average playmaker IMO. However, he has to be a much more efficient threat to score to really become the MVP caliber player I feel he could be.