Schlenk shopping Collins?

[AHF]

11 minutes ago, sturt said:

My reaction, fwiw...

Get used to it.

We're going to hear Collins name come up over and over again between now and draft week. Schlenk will listen to offers, just like he did for Prince.

 

Here is the difference.  Schlenk didn't view Prince as having a future with the team.  He wanted to deal Prince while he still had value and go into the draft for his replacement.  I don't think that is the case for Collins.  I don't think he is motivated to move Collins - just that he will listen to trade offers for either everyone on the roster or everyone not named "Trae."

[sturt]

6 minutes ago, AHF said:

Here is the difference.  Schlenk didn't view Prince as having a future with the team.  He wanted to deal Prince while he still had value and go into the draft for his replacement.  I don't think that is the case for Collins.  I don't think he is motivated to move Collins - just that he will listen to trade offers for either everyone on the roster or everyone not named "Trae."

First, I tend to agree with all of that.

But... second... actually... if we take Schlenk at his word (?)... C-Viv reported this in early May last year:

"Taurean Prince is eligible for a rookie contract extension in July. Schlenk said he spoke with Prince’s agent on Thursday and talks will increase when a deal is eligible to be made. Schlenk said he considers Prince one of the team’s core players."

https://www.ajc.com/sports/basketball/hawks-notes-schlenk-wouldn-have-problem-carter-returned/ERJYF4jYnOTMIIuZPtflPI/

So, third, history seems to support healthy skepticism... and... again... for us to get used to hearing Collins' name come up.

[AHF]

1 hour ago, sturt said:

First, I tend to agree with all of that.

But... second... actually... if we take Schlenk at his word (?)... C-Viv reported this in early May last year:

"Taurean Prince is eligible for a rookie contract extension in July. Schlenk said he spoke with Prince’s agent on Thursday and talks will increase when a deal is eligible to be made. Schlenk said he considers Prince one of the team’s core players."

https://www.ajc.com/sports/basketball/hawks-notes-schlenk-wouldn-have-problem-carter-returned/ERJYF4jYnOTMIIuZPtflPI/

So, third, history seems to support healthy skepticism... and... again... for us to get used to hearing Collins' name come up.

I don't always take Schlenk at his word.  There is too much incentive to lie about a guy being "core" when you are trying to trade them.  If another team knows the guy isn't core, they will feel they can offer you less and vice versa with higher offers to pry away a piece of someone's core.  I think the writing was on the wall with Prince and Schlenk was just trying to keep his negotiating leverage.  He was already trying to figure out how to get Hunter and Reddish to replace him.

[Buzzard]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

I don't always take Schlenk at his word.  There is too much incentive to lie about a guy being "core" when you are trying to trade them.  If another team knows the guy isn't core, they will feel they can offer you less and vice versa with higher offers to pry away a piece of someone's core.  I think the writing was on the wall with Prince and Schlenk was just trying to keep his negotiating leverage.  He was already trying to figure out how to get Hunter and Reddish to replace him.

I think Prince under achieved in his last season with us and that also had a lot to do with Prince becoming expendable. He was suppose to have a breakout season and be a great 3D player. It did not happen and I understand why Schlenk did not want to risk having to pay him. Even this year, he has not been that worthy of being mentioned as a great 3D player.

Collins on the other hand has been exceptional ever since joining the starting lineup. He may be gettable as most players are; but it will take a lot more than a 1st to get him.

[LastDon]

21 hours ago, BudBall said:

I dont mind trading him in package for a better player. IE KAT

Exactly! If we not Talking KAT KD Booker or some young player of that caliber then I know all this is just talk..No way are the hawks that dumb to give up a future allstar for scraps..

[sturt]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

I think the writing was on the wall with Prince and Schlenk was just trying to keep his negotiating leverage.

I have a different take.

I believe fans, more than Schlenk himself, began to sour on Prince, and once it came out that Schlenk was listening to offers on Prince, that fuse was lit among internet posters.

I believe Schlenk did his due diligence, and I have no problem whatsoever with believing Schlenk felt he was made an offer he couldn't refuse by BRK.

 

[sturt]

1 hour ago, Buzzard said:

It did not happen

We'll agree on that much, but it's just as important in the analysis to recognize the factors that contributed to why.

New coach, mostly new roster, and you're down with an injury for much of the first half of the season... and... just as the starters begin to gel... you show back up and everyone else has begun to form some chemistry, but you don't.... and... it just happens to be the critical season before extension and RFA decisions will be made.

I still believe Prince could be back in ATL before it's all said and done, btw.

[JTB]

There’s a lot of stuff out there saying Schlenk doesn’t want to pay Collins due to defensive liabilities.

[JayBirdHawk]

Seriously, Seriously????? - EVERY Thread hijacked!!!

[AHF]

11 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Seriously, Seriously????? - EVERY Thread hijacked!!!

Should be cleaned up!

[JayBirdHawk]

John Collins' thoughts on seeing his name in trade rumors:

Quote

He said last week his predictive powers about what’s going to happen at the trade deadline normally became true the past two years. Maybe his trade senses aren’t as prescient as he believes because he didn’t expect to click on a story from The Athletic’s Shams Charania and see his name mentioned.

“I was intrigued. I clicked on it and wanted to see what people had to say,” Collins said. “I wanted to see the comments. I wasn’t happy or sad about it. I was just more interested in my name being in talks. It’s fun. I know my value with how I’m playing, and I know what I bring to this team. I’m not really too concerned with my standing with them. I haven’t said anything to them about it. I’m pretty calm on my end.”

He then went on Twitter to see what people were saying about him being involved in talks. He saw overwhelming support from Hawks fans, which gave him comfort knowing how loved he is by a fan base, which mostly stuck by his side after his 25-game suspension earlier this season that instantly cratered any hopes the team had of making the playoffs.

He also saw several different trade structures for teams across the league from fans, which made him laugh because many of the ones he saw couldn’t work because of the salary complications due to the rules of the NBA’s Collective Bargaining Agreement. Yes, he is that in tune with the league as a whole.

This is the first time in his three seasons that he has seen his name mentioned in any reporting surrounding the trade deadline, and he’s neutral about his feelings. Collins believes it can be taken in either a good or bad way with how you choose to view it.

“I must be doing something right if other teams are calling about me,” Collins said. “But there’s no concern on my end with my relationship with the organization. I damn right want to be here. I haven’t gone to them about anything trade-related. I am going to continue my standing with that and keep everything solid and smooth and continue to play good basketball. It’s all about being a professional. I know it comes with the job, especially at this time of the year. All of that is definitely talked about in the basketball world...

Very mature response.

 

 

 

[enrique]

12 hours ago, JTB said:

There’s a lot of stuff out there saying Schlenk doesn’t want to pay Collins due to defensive liabilities.

Here is an article on that topic...

https://www.nbaanalysis.net/2020/02/02/2-huge-reasons-the-atlanta-hawks-should-look-to-trade-john-collins/3/

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, enrique said:

Here is an article on that topic...

https://www.nbaanalysis.net/2020/02/02/2-huge-reasons-the-atlanta-hawks-should-look-to-trade-john-collins/3/

We could very well flip Collin in the next 36 hours. I wouldn’t be completely shocked. 

[enrique]

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

John Collins' thoughts on seeing his name in trade rumors:

Very mature response.

 

 

 

Does anyone have the article from the athletic? I don't have an account...

[turnermx]

22 minutes ago, enrique said:

Does anyone have the article from the athletic? I don't have an account...

 

What a Clint Capela trade could mean for the Hawks and John Collins

By Chris Kirschner Feb 4, 2020 20 

John Collins hasn’t tweeted anything since late October, but he’s on Twitter daily. As a fan of the game, he tries to stay up to date with news across the league and is fascinated with how other teams are trying to build their teams in hopes of getting a championship this year and the years ahead.

He said last week his predictive powers about what’s going to happen at the trade deadline normally became true the past two years. Maybe his trade senses aren’t as prescient as he believes because he didn’t expect to click on a story from The Athletic’s Shams Charania and see his name mentioned.

“I was intrigued. I clicked on it and wanted to see what people had to say,” Collins said. “I wanted to see the comments. I wasn’t happy or sad about it. I was just more interested in my name being in talks. It’s fun. I know my value with how I’m playing, and I know what I bring to this team. I’m not really too concerned with my standing with them. I haven’t said anything to them about it. I’m pretty calm on my end.”

He then went on Twitter to see what people were saying about him being involved in talks. He saw overwhelming support from Hawks fans, which gave him comfort knowing how loved he is by a fan base, which mostly stuck by his side after his 25-game suspension earlier this season that instantly cratered any hopes the team had of making the playoffs.

He also saw several different trade structures for teams across the league from fans, which made him laugh because many of the ones he saw couldn’t work because of the salary complications due to the rules of the NBA’s Collective Bargaining Agreement. Yes, he is that in tune with the league as a whole.

This is the first time in his three seasons that he has seen his name mentioned in any reporting surrounding the trade deadline, and he’s neutral about his feelings. Collins believes it can be taken in either a good or bad way with how you choose to view it.

“I must be doing something right if other teams are calling about me,” Collins said. “But there’s no concern on my end with my relationship with the organization. I damn right want to be here. I haven’t gone to them about anything trade-related. I am going to continue my standing with that and keep everything solid and smooth and continue to play good basketball. It’s all about being a professional. I know it comes with the job, especially at this time of the year. All of that is definitely talked about in the basketball world.”

A league source mentioned Houston and Brooklyn specifically expressing interest in acquiring Collins in the days leading up to the trade deadline. Teams that have had discussions with the Hawks have come under the belief that Atlanta is not interested in moving Collins at this time unless it is blown away by an offer, which doesn’t seem like the case 48 hours to go until the deadline. That same source said Houston wanted Collins to be included in a deal for Capela so it could have a logical and cheaper replacement that offers the team a lob threat it would be losing. Brooklyn’s Spencer Dinwiddie was mentioned in talks, but it’s unclear how advanced those discussions were. It’s known around the league that the Hawks are still trying to figure out the best player to pair with Trae Young in the backcourt as they figure out if Kevin Huerter or Cam Reddish could grow into that role.

The Ringer’s Kevin O’Connor reported late Monday night that the Rockets, Minnesota Timberwolves and Hawks had discussed a package that would have sent Capela to the Hawks, the Brooklyn first-round pick the Hawks own to the Timberwolves and Robert Covington to the Rockets. Evan Turner would have been the expiring salary sent to Minnesota. Those talks ceased late in discussions as the Wolves were trying to go all in for Golden State’s D’Angelo Russell, but the Warriors declined their offer.

Atlanta has been trying to acquire a center ahead of Thursday’s deadline with the Hawks being linked to Detroit’s Andre Drummond, Oklahoma City’s Steven Adams, Sacramento’s Dewayne Dedmon and Capela at certain times during the past month. One league source told The Athletic that Drummond made it clear that if he was traded, Atlanta would have been a preferred destination. The Hawks decided to not part ways with the Brooklyn first-round pick they own to acquire him. They could circle back to Drummond in free agency if he chooses to opt out of his player option and they can’t make a move for any of the centers listed above. A source with knowledge of Oklahoma City’s thinking believes Adams is going to stay put with the Thunder ahead of the deadline.

That leaves Dedmon and Capela as two options for the Hawks. Logistically, Dedmon makes more sense for Atlanta if it considers Collins a long-term option. Dedmon provides rim protection and, critically, can stretch the floor and not get in Collins’ way in the paint. A pairing of Capela and Collins gets a little convoluted on offense for everyone. Both players’ best skill is rolling to the basket, and that would, in turn, create too crowded of a space as Young drives to the basket. It would help the Hawks defensively because while Collins at the 5 works in smaller lineups, it wouldn’t in a matchup with a team that employs a traditional big man like Philadelphia’s Joel Embiid.

“What I’ve noticed about Coach (Lloyd) Pierce is that he gives his bigs a lot of freedom,” said Alykhan Bijani, one of The Athletic’s Rockets writers. “But with Capela, like you said, he’s more of a traditional pick-and-roll center. Will that exclusively put Collins around the perimeter to be more of a pick-and-pop player? Defensively, I think it helps. Collins is likely better defensively at the 4 and helping from the weak-side. Clint can stay around the rim and defend the pick-and-roll as the 5. Clint has been good this season, to me at least, when Houston plays their drop coverage. They’ve wanted to keep him around the rim as much as possible. His rebounding numbers are very good.”

A move for Capela likely wouldn’t hurt the Hawks’ lottery chances this year. Capela has been out with a bruised heel, and as The Athletic’s Kelly Iko reported Monday, Capela is dealing with plantar fasciitis. Because the Hawks are likely not making the playoffs barring something unforeseen, that shouldn’t hinder their plans of acquiring him like it would for a team like Boston, which also has been linked to Capela ahead of the deadline.

When Atlanta does become a playoff team once again, having Capela would help Young when that time comes. The playoffs are more intense and physical. Because of Young’s size, the wear and tear he would undertake in the playoffs could be a concern. He’s already blitzed and double-teamed nearly every game the Hawks play. Having someone like Capela in the middle of the offense could help Young and the Hawks as a team. Capela also helps the Hawks on the other end of the floor because of Young’s defensive limitations. Having a reliable big man at the rim when a guard inevitably gets by Young is what the Hawks need for their long-term future.

“Capela sets wide screens, which is important,” Bijani said. “He has a wide base and is long, so he often doesn’t need more than two steps to get to the rim on rolls. He struggles in short roll situations because he’s inconsistent as a passer, but he’s improved on hitting the corner shooter when teams trap (James) Harden. So since teams have been hedging and trapping Trae more, Clint has shown the ability to make a pass. Where he has been incredibly consistent, but shown flashes, is his aggressiveness attacking the rim on these bounce passes. He is very spry, lengthy and has a great second jump. He struggles around contact but is still shooting a great 60-plus percent around the rim. I personally think he’ll help him a lot in transition with how the (Hawks) play. Clint is very good at quick hitters and actions like what the Hawks run. He is also very fast and gives a lot of traditional center problems because of his speed.”

Capela is only 25 years old and fits the timeline of the other young players the Hawks have in their core. He’s also under contract until the summer of 2023. He makes $14.9 million this season and is owed $51.3 million during the next three seasons.

Collins is eligible for a rookie extension this offseason that wouldn’t kick in until the summer of 2021. He’s expected to ask for a deal that is near or at the max, according to multiple league sources. The Hawks could decide that he’s not worth that price and explore trading him this summer, much like what they did with Taurean Prince last summer. They also could see how a Capela and Collins frontcourt works for the rest of the season when Capela is healthy if they end up getting a deal done by the deadline at 3 p.m. on Thursday. But, to be clear, Collins is not being dangled in any trade discussions from Atlanta before Thursday. Any reporting that suggests otherwise is inaccurate.

Acquiring Capela would be interesting for Collins’ future with Atlanta, however, because Collins essentially would have to evolve his game into more of a pick-and-pop player, as Bijani said, unless the Hawks decided to stagger their minutes. While Collins has the capability to pick-and-pop, as he has shown, it is not his strength. Capela is a non-shooter, so it would be on Collins to play more on the perimeter.

The Hawks want more of a traditional, defensive anchor to protect the rim, which is something they have struggled with this season. Collins has taken a leap forward defensively this season, but the 4 is where he’s likely to have the most success on both ends of the floor. Damian Jones, who the Hawks thought could be that player when they acquired him from Golden State this summer, is not the answer. Alex Len has shown improvement on defense, but he’s more of a spot starter than one who should be relied on nightly.

What is clear as the deadline nears is the Hawks are active and looking to improve their roster now and not wait for free agency even though they are projected to have $66 million in cap space.

[Brotha2ThaNite]

Please don’t tell me you guys on here actually believe this?