I've been watching the 2024 NBA Draft class and it's been... weaker than usual

[Final_quest]

Well, I disagree at least that every RFA shops themselves to get their deal done.  Many/most negotiate their agreement directly with the team.  It's getting extremely rare for guys to sign with another team or even let other teams set their value. You are signaling to a guy that they are not a priority to the team if you let other teams set their market. 

A difference between TS and Fields is under TS the team was seen as a contender and there was a different level of spending during free agency a couple years ago.  Fields took over a play in team with no cap and a free agency market where teams are getting tighter with spending.  I'm not convinced Landry Fields is some kind of deal shark at a higher level than TS.  

 

[AHF]

17 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

Well, I disagree at least that every RFA shops themselves to get their deal done. 
 

So do I which is why I never said that every RFA shops themselves.  Many do exactly what OO did and either strike a deal before they even can shop themselves or strike one when they can but before doing so.

The point is that a team should never overpay a player without forcing them to do so.

Quote

Many/most negotiate their agreement directly with the team.  It's getting extremely rare for guys to sign with another team or even let other teams set their value. You are signaling to a guy that they are not a priority to the team if you let other teams set their market. 
 

Right.  This is why you offer them a contract that is less than they would get as an UFA and one that should add value to the team due to how competitively paid that player is compared to higher paid peers.  This is what we did with OO and what teams like Phoenix did with Mikal Bridges who got less than DeAndre Hunter.

It is only when the player insists on being overpaid that you need to reach for the lever of making them establish their value in the market.

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A difference between TS and Fields is under TS the team was seen as a contender and there was a different level of spending during free agency a couple years ago.  Fields took over a play in team with no cap and a free agency market where teams are getting tighter with spending.  I'm not convinced Landry Fields is some kind of deal shark at a higher level than TS.  

It is critically important for contenders to manage their dollars just like it is for any other team.  The Bulls, for example, were notorious for tightening the screws on their own players but it was one reason they were able to get as much talent on the roster as they enjoyed over the 8 year window where they were winning championships.

TS dropped the ball with his negotiations with RFAs.  (I'm not someone who bemoans everything he did as he led the best drafting the Hawks have done in my lifetime whether you see that as high praise or a backhanded compliment given that Stan Kasten, Pete Babcock, Billy Knight, Danny Ferry are who you are comparing against).

[KB21]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

Fields has done a much better job with the DJM and OO extensions than TS did with the JC and DH ones.

It's why I have hope in him if Ressler would get out of the way.  

[NBASupes]

Not speaking for the Hawks, just the NBA in general, this is how I feel about this draft

This is a PG class but scouts will be all over the place. Workouts will decide everything. That said, this is the best PG class in regards to TALENT since 2009. 

Castle, Collier, and McCain will be big risers. Once projections for 3-4 years come plus the workout results, these guys will shoot up the board. At the end of the day, all three are legit NBA talents. They aren't ready yet but they are all physically impressive and athletically sound. Don't be shocked if all three end up in the top 10.

Sheppard will be someone teams have all over the place after workouts. Some will have him in the top 5, some, top 25. It just takes one team. 

Topic will be the big faller. Teams will see him like a less athlete, better playmaking Markelle Fultz after the issue and just not want a PG who can't shoot 3s like that. While his at the rim % is high, everyone going under could really be tough for him. While he's high on my board, if the Spurs pass on him in the top 10, I think he maybe the Cam Whitmore of this class and fall into the 20s. PHX will probably be his floor.

Is it me or does Dillingham have a lot of Brandon Jennings in his game? That kid is insanely wicked with a screen and UK don't even set good ones either. I am not sure if I'll take him in the top 5 but he's a top 10 pick for sure. He might be the only top 10 pick at PG that could start next year. Shepp, Castle, Collier, and McCain will all need to be backups for a year. Their projection is long-term. If he's mentally right and wants it BAD, he can be a guy in this league for a long time to come. When he's patient, he's insane. While I think he would be lucky if he could fall to Utah or Chicago.

Big movers have been Devin Carter (son of former Atlanta raised, Anthony Carter) - He's been a big mover on my BB. Tyler Kolek who I am still trying to figure out what the hell is he, and K.J. Simpson who might be underrated a lot. This is definitely a PG class. No question about it. Even some of the players have shades or even comps of players from that class. 

SG position is fairly weak. Walter has a great prototype but he's far from reaching it right now. I was high on Furphy but he's just as raw as Walter. Knecht and Shannon Jr. are the best SGs are a very good players but they won't get picked till late lottery to the 20s due to their age. I think Shannon is better than Knecht for the NBA. Both are going to be top end SGs which is already a weak position in the NBA outside of the top 3. https://tankathon.com/players/compare?players=dalton-knecht--terrence-shannon-jr

Kevin McCullar is a risky pick. He's good but he has flaws and is 23 on draft night. Add the fact that he's 210 which is good but not great, and backup seems to be the peak with him.

SF position is Risacher then not one good player. Just upside and need prayers.
Williams has the insane upside but you must bring him in. You need to check his growth plates, see his psyche and body comp, under what drives him and have a tremendous development plan in place. He's too small to me and just saying he will have size because his brother does with age isn't a fact. Cody looks lanky. Jalen does and didn't even when he was much smaller. 

Holland, Buzelis, Salaun, and Klintman is all prayers and upside. You could hit but you will likely miss. At least two of these guys will be lottery picks, maybe all 4 and there is a chance all could bust. Buzelis is the most likely one to be good at some point and that's because I think being a big wing or even a 4 is possible for Matas.

The PF position is even less promising than SF. Filipowski and Sarr are clearly the likely locks for the top 10. Smith is a hope and a prayer, Oso is a legit NBA player who needs to land somewhere a legit vision for him, and guys like Almansa and Chomche are a Hail Mary. I am not high on Sarr. I like Flip more but Sarr upside is very intriguing and I believe he really is best suited to be a big wing which really could give him a chance to be a top 50 player and a high-impact guy at a much later stage in his development but it wouldn't shock me if he's worse than James Wiseman. 

The C position is very strong. Clingan will be a big raiser, wouldn't be shocked if he's a top 5 pick, then you have a draft range with Edey, Missi, and Ware in the 11-24 range. All are unique. Clingan is a high-end movement kid who got some shot creation, is extremely athletic for his size, a good overall defender who specializes in the drop, but he has injury and stamina concerns.

The biggest issue with this class is the two best centers are clearly drop coverage guys and some teams don't have those types on the board till the 2nd round. They just don't play defense that way. Whereas others may have them high up. Then you got Ware who is modern, but has injury, effort, and motor concerns and that scares the shit out of teams as recent bust like Mo Bamba have been crippled by those three items. Missi is raw as hell and still hasn't reached his MAN body yet. Reminds me of a mix of Capela as a prospect and Jalen Duren but not a best of and I think he's further away from being NBA ready than either of those two.

Obviously, this class might not be strong if you are looking for modern NBA centers. Modern NBA centers aren't common. In 2022, Duren, Williams, and Kessler weren't modern NBA centers but all three are good rotation centers. Chet is a modern NBA center and went in the top 3. Good modern NBA centers aren't going to be found outside of the top 3. So if you want a high-end center, it's likely going to be a traditional one. 

Missi is a talented prospect who's a couple of years away but could be a top-15 center in 3-4 years, then again, he might be in the Gleague as well. Ware has a unique skill set. He's been compared to Bamba and Jarrett Allen. Edey is an excellent hooper who's ready to help a team with games right now even if it's only as a reserve. Obviously, for the Hawks, I think he's the best prospect on the board for Trae which also means, the team by a mile. There is a bigger gap between the best prospect for the Hawks with Edey to Risacher than Wemby for Scoot or Miller. Wemby is a superior prospect to Edey for everyone including me. Obviously, those who don't like him will say the same for the Hawks as well. Extreme comp but I am that confident in this fit, especially knowing both games extremely well, especially, Trae. 

Overall, this is a solid draft class which has been common recently. The prize of this class for me is the seniors. Also, I expect this draft will look a lot different than any of our boards. The workouts, combine, and interviews will mean more in this draft, than any previously, and don't be shocked when five guys climb into the lottery that aren't on anyone's radar right now. This is the type of draft, where you will see terms take risks for upside or for floor. 

[KB21]

 

[KB21]

 

[KB21]

I'll go with:

1. Ware
2. Filipowski
3. Clingan

[bird_dirt]

Dilligham is good, but he doesn’t even start. I have a hard time confidently projecting him. He’s a microwave off the bench who often has pretty quiet games until the last eight minutes or less of the game. He turns it on when it counts the most. 
SG-wise, Antonio Reeves is a walking bucket. His age will go against him in the draft, but he will be a great SG/OG off the bench for someone. Not a starting PG, but can be a secondary ball handler. He will get you points. 

[aali34]

I've only watched a couple highlights and interviews, but Ware doesn't give me good vibes. His energy on the court combined with his personality isn't what I would like out of a center prospect. I sense no tenacity or edge.

Flipowski is alright, but I don't know if he fixes the major problems we have in the front court, but he does bring in talent, versatility and offense. They say he's 7ft, doesn't look like it to me.

Clingan doesn't really wow me much. He's big, but doesn't do anything that grabs my attention.

Zvonimir Ivisic is my favorite center prospect just from an eye test, but he hasn't produced much. 

[NBASupes]

20 hours ago, bird_dirt said:

Dilligham is good, but he doesn’t even start. I have a hard time confidently projecting him. He’s a microwave off the bench who often has pretty quiet games until the last eight minutes or less of the game. He turns it on when it counts the most. 
SG-wise, Antonio Reeves is a walking bucket. His age will go against him in the draft, but he will be a great SG/OG off the bench for someone. Not a starting PG, but can be a secondary ball handler. He will get you points. 

Reed doesn't start either 

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, aali34 said:

I've only watched a couple highlights and interviews, but Ware doesn't give me good vibes. His energy on the court combined with his personality isn't what I would like out of a center prospect. I sense no tenacity or edge.

Flipowski is alright, but I don't know if he fixes the major problems we have in the front court, but he does bring in talent, versatility and offense. They say he's 7ft, doesn't look like it to me.

Clingan doesn't really wow me much. He's big, but doesn't do anything that grabs my attention.

Zvonimir Ivisic is my favorite center prospect just from an eye test, but he hasn't produced much. 

You are miles away on this and all of  this is a fairly good assessment 

Ware has motor, effort, and injury concerns

Filp is legit 7ft 248 but plays a lot smaller because he doesn't really have a typical big man's game and his wingspan and athleticism is lacking. He definitely can't fix our size issue or even play the 5 at all but he definitely fixes our backup 4 issues for sure. So he can fix issues, just not our starting center issue which is killing us.

I like Clingan but he's not for everyone. There has been big boards, he's in the 40s behind Edey and there are big boards where he's in the top 10. He's in my top 10. At the end of the day, drop coverage 5s ain't for everyone but they are damn sure for the Hawks. As long as we got Trae, probably the only type of defense we can play since we need a paint protector on the court with him at all times. 

Ivisic needs to return back to Kentucky with Bradshaw. Both of them aren't good for college and would take years just to breakout of the Gleague. They both got a nice skill-set which makes them appealing to modern NBA fans looking for Centers but they aren't close to Gleague ready yet. 

Edited March 16 by NBASupes

[bird_dirt]

2 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Reed doesn't start either 

No, but I guess I can see Reed’s impact much more consistently when he’s on the floor than I do with Dillingham. 

[h4wkfan]

The only true 5 I would want in the draft is Clingan, but I will always avoid big men with injury histories. Clingan when he plays is fantastic. All the other 5s … meh  

 

id trade both of our picks to get Castle if I could. He just makes winning plays. And man, he has so much untapped potential. 
 

I could watch hours on loop of him working through picks on defense. I wish our current roster would too

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, h4wkfan said:

The only true 5 I would want in the draft is Clingan, but I will always avoid big men with injury histories. Clingan when he plays is fantastic. 

 

id trade both of our picks to get Castle if I could. He just makes winning plays. And man, he has so much untapped potential. 
 

I could watch hours on loop of him working through picks on defense. I wish our current roster would too

Castle is unique as we really don't know his long term position yet, we just know he's a solid player and for his age and his prototype, he's insanely intriguing  

Clingan injury history will be a question because it's likely, he will always be dealing with injuries. Major foot injuries aren't easy to deal with, especially for someone who gives as much effort as he does. 

Edited March 17 by NBASupes

[NBASupes]

Clingan had his best offensive night of the season today based on what others are saying. I'll watch it possession by possession tomorrow. Can't wait to see it. 

[NBASupes]

Edey

Shannon Jr. 

Knecht 

Come away with two of these three players, you significantly improve your squad and Trae's chances to win a championship in Atlanta. Don't overthink this shit. Do the obvious shit. Don't get cute, don't listen to the media or idiots that will convince you Marvin Williams is better than Chris Paul and Deron Williams. Do the obvious shit. The metrics clearly don't lie. Don't f*** this up.

Edited March 17 by NBASupes

[AHF]

I remember being of the phone with my brother during that lottery.  When we got the *2 pick, I told my brother “ok, we get Chris Paul.”  Then draft madness took over.  You are right that sometimes people over complicate things to their detriment. 

[KB21]

Sam Vecenie in his mock this AM has Atlanta taking Tidjane Salaun at 10 and Tyler Smith at 20.  

[Packfill]

1 hour ago, KB21 said:

Sam Vecenie in his mock this AM has Atlanta taking Tidjane Salaun at 10 and Tyler Smith at 20.  

Both of those guys are interesting.  I think both guys have a chance but each will need some time to further develop - so I would not draft either expecting any significant contributions in year one (though with Quinn and his approach with rookies in the ATL they may not get the time no matter their level of readiness).  Not sure I would draft two such players if I were the Hawks GM - I would likely lean into making one of those picks someone who can contribute soon.

I still think the Hawks need to make a real effort to move Murray in the off-season to bring in a better long term fit next to Trae.  The return on that trade would have a big impact on how these picks should be used.

[bird_dirt]

4 hours ago, KB21 said:

Sam Vecenie in his mock this AM has Atlanta taking Tidjane Salaun at 10 and Tyler Smith at 20.  

Both guys who hustle. Both probably 2-3 year projects before reaching a top 9 rotation on the roster though.