Is the prejudice on YI starting to lift??

[AHF]

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Just to clarify, AHF... I don't think any person, hypothetical or not, who has ever played the game or knows anything about it, could say honestly that Yi has no upside.

Unless they knew of him personally, this would be garbage. The only thing that could stop Yi, is Yi. Who knows what's going on in his head? I don't. I do know he is easily the 3rd best talent available.

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I don't think a reasonable person could look at the big picture and conclude that Yi has no upside. However, they could do it without being prejudiced based on race.

I do think someone could conclude something like "Anyone who gets abused by Wang Zhi Zhi has no upside. I have seen Wang Zhi Zhi and he sucks. Yi let Wang Zhi Zhi ring up 20 and 10 on you over and over on him in the CBA playoffs and therefore has no upside" without resorting to prejudice or stereotyping against Yi based on race.

I would disagree without that person and tell them to look at a bigger picture but I could see some hypothetical person doing that.

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totally off topic, but he did pretty good against Wang. Remember, Wang is older, thicker, probably a little smarter, and he plays center full time. I think it is a plus that he has experience guarding the post a little. I see him as a 4 / sometimes 3. He's not great down there but not afraid to do it. My friends shut me down more than the average guy at the park, too. They have been on the same team for years and Wang probably knows how to get him. Wang might abuse a lot of Sf's. Would they put up the numbers Yi did on Wang? I think not.

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I think your reading on the Wang/Yi matchup is totally reasonable. I just don't think that someone who looks at the situation and conludes Yi must be a bum because Wang did so well aginst him must be prejudiced against Yi.

We see a lot of comments on this site that are not well thought out. That doesn't mean they are the result of prejudice, though.

That is what I was trying to get at.

[exodus]

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if Yi has the exact same game

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There is nothing to suggest that Yi is as good as Durant. He doesn't have Durants range and he is 3 years older. He didn't exactly dominate as his season came to a close. People who watched his games had mixed reviews.

I haven't seen any mixed reviews on Durant.

If we draft Yi then someone (and probably more than one) of our forwards have to be traded and we will probably be stuck trading them for lesser value.

[Diesel]

Again.

My first mention of Yao was to bring up lack of exposure.

Other's used Yao to bring up a comparison of players.

In my mind, the only reason that they would do that is because they were stereotyping Yi. The same is true for those who say that Yi is tne next Yao. The only reason that this stereotyping exists is because they're both from china.

This Yao diversion was definitely not the original prejudice I was talking about.

The original prejudice was a difference of Durant vs. Yi... based on exposure.

I found it interesting that people would say we don't need a Sf, we don't need another Sf.. unless it's Durant. I didn't approach this from Durant is American, Yi is Chinese... So that's not racism. I said prejudice because Durant is on TV every weekend and ever other monday and we havn't see YI on TV.

[exodus]

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Diesel's twisted and turned more times than is healthy, and he's gonna need to rest for a while.

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Best line of the thread.

Now i will answer my own question again. At the top of the page i asked "Who said Yi has no upside?".

The answer, obviously, is nobody.

[Joker]

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If you read that in context to mean that I believe that Yi has no upside rather than as saying that a hypothetical person could conclude Yi does not have upside based on something other than race then I don't know what to tell you. I can't imagine how you find this confusing.

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I'm just saying that your hypothetical person could not exist. No reasonable person, with any knowledge, could say what your hypothetical person is saying.

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How is it impossible that someone could read that Yi just got repeatedly abused by a scrub that couldn't last as long in the NBA as Mark Pope and then conlude that Yi lacked upside based on this? (this was originally written poorly so it has been editted)

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It's not impossible, I just would not pay them any attention. Diesel's Stanley Roberts/Shaq analogy comes to mind. When you know someone better than most of the world, it takes those kinds of conclusions and throw them in the garbage.

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WOW, Diesel has said some dumb things but this one take the cake.

1. Stanley Roberts was never the prospect Shaq was, sure he was better in the college stats wise but so is Hansbrough to B. Wright and in reality they aren't even that close.

2. Stanley Roberts was on drugs, even if he wasn't he wasn't going to be better then Shaq, it was two different games, and college you can be big, unathletic, slow and dominate, but in the NBA, you have be faster, strong for your position, smart, and a really good athlete just to be solid.

3. Don't ever use something with so little logic again, your making a fool out of yourself.

[Diesel]

NSS, it's embarrassing what you just posted. It's totally out of context and it shows that you just comment on stuff that you don't read?

[TexasPete]

Troy, I know a guy that is 7'1 in my bowling league. The guy is a great bowler, over a 200 average and is 37 years old. The first time I met him I asked him if he has ever played basketball because he had the great height for it. He said all his life people have asked him that question and when he was young every coach he came across asked him to play.

He said he had never picked up a ball his entire life, that basketball never had appeal to him. My point?

Height is a nice thing to have but there are a lot of other factors. My bowling friend had no desire. Some guys don't have the skills for the NBA. You ask how a reasonable person could not see some upside in Yi and I ask why??? Because he is 7 feet? If he was only 6'9 would that matter?

This Yi stuff drives me crazy. I can list a bunch of 7 footers who were drafted because they were the magic height and who sucked.

How can anyone trump up Yi when the info on him is so lacking right now? The reports have a lot of negative stuff on him as well as the positive. And the negative is some serious stuff against him.

People aren't thinking logically because the jury is out. At this point if you predict him to be a superstar and it came true you wouldn't be more or less an expert. You would have been lucky because to base an opinion on the data available now is to be foolish.

My problem with him has nothing to do with his game. Unless we make a trade we don't need another forward period.

[Sothron]

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In fact, I believe to bring it up is some type of stereotyping. In fact, let me say this... The only reason you compare the two is because they are both from China.

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YOU'RE THE ONE WHO BROUGHT YAO UP!!!!

I compared Yi to Yao because you introduced Yao into the thread. YOU COMPARED THEIR SITUATIONS, I EXPLAINED WHY I THOUGHT THEIR SITUATIONS ARE DIFFERENT, AND IT IS BECAUSE WHAT I READ ABOUT YAO THEN SAID "CENTER", AND WHAT I READ ABOUT YI NOW SAYS "PROBABLY NOT A CENTER."

How am I prejudiced or steroetyping when I'm only responding to you bringing Yao into the discussion?

You're stretching even beyond your own bounds with this.

Scouts say he's a forward, random internet poster reads scouting report, random internet poster repeats that scout thinks he's a forward, random internet poster is therefore some kind fo a racist?

When have I ever stated that he's not a center? I've only said that from what I understand, he isn;t a center. I;ve never seen him play live!!!

And furthermore, I wouldn't mind us getting him whether he plays center or not,a nd I wouldn;t mind us trading Marvin to make room from him and get back a PG or C if it was necessary.

But I guess somehow I'm prejudiced against the Chinese.

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I think you owe an apology on the racism accusations here Diesel. Those are serious allegations to throw around and there is no absolutely base for them with respect to thesheedera as far as I can see.

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Why should he apologize? I've been personally attacked several times over my religion because I called someone a "bozo" and no action was taken nor was an apology ever given. What makes this any different?

[TexasPete]

I think both are lousy and reflect poorly on the people who do it.

[AHF]

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In fact, I believe to bring it up is some type of stereotyping. In fact, let me say this... The only reason you compare the two is because they are both from China.

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YOU'RE THE ONE WHO BROUGHT YAO UP!!!!

I compared Yi to Yao because you introduced Yao into the thread. YOU COMPARED THEIR SITUATIONS, I EXPLAINED WHY I THOUGHT THEIR SITUATIONS ARE DIFFERENT, AND IT IS BECAUSE WHAT I READ ABOUT YAO THEN SAID "CENTER", AND WHAT I READ ABOUT YI NOW SAYS "PROBABLY NOT A CENTER."

How am I prejudiced or steroetyping when I'm only responding to you bringing Yao into the discussion?

You're stretching even beyond your own bounds with this.

Scouts say he's a forward, random internet poster reads scouting report, random internet poster repeats that scout thinks he's a forward, random internet poster is therefore some kind fo a racist?

When have I ever stated that he's not a center? I've only said that from what I understand, he isn;t a center. I;ve never seen him play live!!!

And furthermore, I wouldn't mind us getting him whether he plays center or not,a nd I wouldn;t mind us trading Marvin to make room from him and get back a PG or C if it was necessary.

But I guess somehow I'm prejudiced against the Chinese.

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I think you owe an apology on the racism accusations here Diesel. Those are serious allegations to throw around and there is no absolutely base for them with respect to thesheedera as far as I can see.

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Why should he apologize? I've been personally attacked several times over my religion because I called someone a "bozo" and no action was taken nor was an apology ever given. What makes this any different?

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No one should attack you because of your religion either. Anyone who attacks someone personally like that without basis should apologize out of basic decency.

[oiatlhawksfan]

Wow, LOL..this is not about basketball.

[TexasPete]

Oi, some of your stuff isn't much about ball either. Ouch!

[BusBoyIsBack]

Tell me, how many of you honestly knew about Kevin Durant before this season?

I mean be honest.

Now I knew he was going to be interesting when I saw he was 6'10 with comparisons to McGrady. I thought to myself, well that ought to be interesting to see. But I surely didn't know anything about him.

Do you know Yi Jianlian's name has been around SINCE 2002. That's just as long as Greg Oden!

So from that standpoint he's just as big of a homerun threat as these guys.

Nothing is guaranteed in life except death and taxes. Durant could be no better than Rashard Lewis, Oden could be no better than Okafor. And Yi could be no better than Stromile Swift.

But the bottomline is that just like Oden and Durant, Yi Jianlian is a physical freak of nature. He's been a highly decorated guy for a long time.

So I say treat him like we would have treated the Durant pick as far as the line of thinking that he's too good to pass up on.

Because it's not everyday that there are 7 footers who are as athletic as Yi Jianlian. In fact there may not be a more athletic 7 footer in the NBA right now.

So perhaps from that perspective, his abilities are just as rare if not more rare than those of Durant.

[thesheedera]

Anyone who has any interest at all in college basketball recruiting has known Durant for the last 3 years.

Now very few expected him to blow up like he did this season. Maybe no one, anywhere. He was a top 5 guy coming into college, but no one could have predicted his freshman seson of absolute dominance.

[BusBoyIsBack]

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Anyone who has any interest at all in college basketball recruiting has known Durant for the last 3 years.

Now very few expected him to blow up like he did this season. Maybe no one, anywhere. He was a top 5 guy coming into college, but no one could have predicted his freshman seson of absolute dominance.

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Well but the average basketball fan didn't know who this guy was and all of a sudden these people are convinced that no one on the planet is on his or Oden's level even though they've only heard of these guys for less than a year.

Just goes to show you how powerful a tool the media really is.

Im just saying if Yi's name has been around since 2002, his name as been around just as long as these guys.

The guy was going for his FOURTH title in the CBAs. It actually says on one of his scouting reports that the guy looks disinterested because he's ready for the next level.

He knows he's ready for the NBA.

Ignoring his competition, you could see he makes NBA-like moves on the floor.

You can't focus too much on the competition because it's about evaluating the individual player. For instance, people who evaluate the competition too much would see Adam Morrison or JJ Redick's numbers put up in NCAA and be blown away.

But if you actually look at the individual players you would see that Adam Morrison was an atrocious defender, so bad his team had to hide his defense in zone coverage.

JJ Redick was in a system designed for him to succeed shooting off of all these back screens and rolls. He wasn't dribbling to create space between he and the defender and he didn't have the size to play the 3 or the quickness to play the 2.

You could notice these things if you focused on the players instead of their numbers.

I don't care about Yi's numbers against his competition. Im evaluating him as a NBA prospect. He has size, and he has remarkable athleticism.

That's how players should be evaluated. That's how HS players are evaluated. You don't pick Amare or Dwight or KG because of the competition they are playing against. YOu pick them because they are physical freaks of nature.

Yi is one of those physical freaks of nature.

[thesheedera]

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Yi is one of those physical freaks of nature.

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I agree completely - I like Yi and everything I'm hearing/reading about him. I was just giving you some background on Durant. Without the NBA rule he would have been a high pick last year. He didn't come out of nowhere. This kid has serious game and has for a very long time. As a freshman he took it to a legendary level. We honestly may never see a freshman do what he did this season again.

Yi could certainly be better than Durant once they're both established in the NBA, but if my job were on the line knowing what I know right now, there's no chance in hell I'm passing on Durant in favor of Yi.

[AHF]

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Yi is one of those physical freaks of nature.

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I agree completely - I like Yi and everything I'm hearing/reading about him. I was just giving you some background on Durant. Without the NBA rule he would have been a high pick last year. He didn't come out of nowhere. This kid has serious game and has for a very long time. As a freshman he took it to a legendary level. We honestly may never see a freshman do what he did this season again.

Yi could certainly be better than Durant once they're both established in the NBA, but if my job were on the line knowing what I know right now, there's no chance in hell I'm passing on Durant in favor of Yi.

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I'll just add that no one since Lebron has been nearly as highly regarded as Oden. He probably would have been the top pick in the draft 3-4 years ago had he been eligible.

[Diesel]

Naw.

Last year, he was parade's all american #2.. but most other places didn't recognize him so highly.

In fact, other places recognized:

Oden, Mayo,Lawson and the rest... Yes his teammate Lawson was ranked higher than he most of the time..

3 yrs ago, he wasn't on the radar.

Hell, OJ Mayo has been on the Radar since before Chandler came out. But Durant hasn't. Durant was another good Oak Hill player. And when you say Oak Hill, that's not unusual.

Which makes me wonder... Did Durant and Josh Smith overlap?? They should have.

[Guest Walter]

Because I see him playing the position like Dirk plays it.

Watching the videos, while Yi likes facing his man and getting past him, his interior turnaround is unstoppable and effective. As good as any other post move you'll see. Reproducable anywhere on the court, he turns both right and left to work it, and his soft touch allows him to finish it with a very high percentage.

W

[oiatlhawksfan]

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Oi, some of your stuff isn't much about ball either. Ouch!

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Like when?