The ultimate curse of Knight isn't Chris Paul...

[Cwell]

I don't think anyone, including the people who hated the Shelden pick, thought he would be as bad as he has been. I didn't like the pick but at least expected him to be a Udonis Haslem type player (obviously that does not justify using a high lottery pick on him).

There is plenty of room for undersized power forwards in the league (at least in back-up roles) that it really makes you wonder why Shelden can't at least be as effective as guys like Milsap, Craig Smith, Leon Powe, Haslem, etc.

those guys are the reason u don't waste 2nd round picks. U can always find some decent PF's in the 2nd round for your bench. I wanted Milsap in 06,I was pissed when we picked Solo,right after being about to break stuff for picking Shelden. The 2nd round is where u find those relentless bangers.

[exodus]

Uhm... Trace... Roy won't be an allstar this year...

I can give you 6 guards out of the west that will make that team before Roy's name comes up:

Kobe, Billups, Nash, Deron, Paul, Parker, and Kmart...

and if he don't watch out, he will get squeaked out by Jason the Jet Terry.

Nice call

[Diesel]

Nice call

Yeah, He should send thank you cards to Al Jefferson, Kevin Martin, Stephen Jackson, and Jason Terry.

[Packfill]

Nice call

Sadly, BK's incompetence remains on display and will likely haunt the Hawks at least as long as Woody remains coach.

You know, except for recently, the Hawks backcourt has been their strength - and is the product of BK's two big trades to land JJ and Bibby.

The sad thing is, if BK skipped the trades and just drafted Paul and Roy the Hawks would have a better, younger backcourt.

[exodus]

Yeah, He should send thank you cards to Al Jefferson, Kevin Martin, Stephen Jackson, and Jason Terry.

LOL

Jackson is shooting 39.5%, 32.3% from 3 on a crap team. Jefferson is a center, also on a crap team. KMart plays on a team that is 27 games under .500.

Roys numbers are also decisively better than Terry's.

[atlien]

Roy is quickly becoming one of the best players in the league. This season he has been a more-consistent version of JJ.

[Diesel]

LOL

Jackson is shooting 39.5%, 32.3% from 3 on a crap team. Jefferson is a center, also on a crap team. KMart plays on a team that is 27 games under .500.

Roys numbers are also decisively better than Terry's.

Poor Stephen Jackson... Unlike AL Jefferson who is just a beast and getting no love... Jackson is putting up the best numbers of his career 20/6/5 and getting no love.

I forgot to mention Kevin Durant...Durant is averaging 27.7 points (over 49% shooting from the floor and 88% FT), 8.7 rebounds, 3.7 assists, and 1.4 steals.

I forgot to mention Paul Milsap... 17.8 points (on 57% shooting), 11.3 rebounds, 1.3 steals, and 1.1 blocks.

Yeah, I think David West and Brandon Roy ought to send thank you cards to these guys.

[exodus]

Poor Stephen Jackson... Unlike AL Jefferson who is just a beast and getting no love... Jackson is putting up the best numbers of his career 20/6/5 and getting no love.

I forgot to mention Kevin Durant...Durant is averaging 27.7 points (over 49% shooting from the floor and 88% FT), 8.7 rebounds, 3.7 assists, and 1.4 steals.

I forgot to mention Paul Milsap... 17.8 points (on 57% shooting), 11.3 rebounds, 1.3 steals, and 1.1 blocks.

Yeah, I think David West and Brandon Roy ought to send thank you cards to these guys.

You do realize there is a difference between a forward and a guard, right?

Roy is averaging 22.4/5.1/4.7 shooting 46.9%, 35.6% from 3. His numbers are better than Jackson's and even JJ's.

[Plainview1981]

Is Brandon Roy a triple double threat everytime he takes the floor?

[HawksBalla]

Paul is the best PG in the game but Roy is a weak duplication of NOBODY. That kid can play and he will be an All Star every year for quite some time.

Jerrywest posed the question would you take Paul and Shelden or Roy and Marvin. I'd take Paul (who cares about Shelden) but it is damn close. Would we be better with:

Paul

JJ

Smoove

Horford

Shelden

or

Roy

JJ

Marvin

Smoove

Horford

Good question.

The problem with those lineups is that you arent accounting for the fact that drafting Paul would have lowered our pick past #5,and there is no way we would have kept our pick that drafted Horford because we wouldnt have been so terrible. And you have to assume that if we drafted Roy, again we wouldnt have been so bad as to keep our pick of Horford. I think more like lineups would have been:

Paul

JJ

Chills

Smoove

Zaza

vs

Roy

JJ

Marvin

Smoove

Zaza

Imagine that second lineup with Chills dropping Marvin to pf and Smoove to center. They would run teams off the court. Still though I've got to go with Paul. If we had drafted Paul, Smoove would have been an all-star last year, averaging 20 points a game. Smoove would have joined Paul and JJ at the all-star game, and we'd have one of the most lethal "Big 3" combos in the league. I think we would have been good enough to win 50 games last year.

But instead of either of those lineups, we keep treating to a constant stream of Iso-Joe plays.

[Diesel]

You do realize there is a difference between a forward and a guard, right?

Roy is averaging 22.4/5.1/4.7 shooting 46.9%, 35.6% from 3. His numbers are better than Jackson's and even JJ's.

I will start realizing that (for the purpose of the allstar game) when the allstar committee starts realizing that.

Moreover, about your weak "team record" argument... What's Granger and Bosh doing on the allstar team?

The truth is.... Durant, Jefferson, Milsap, D Will, Jackson all deserved to be at the allstar game. There are some guys on the West squad that I have no earthly idea of why they are there.

[jerrywest]

Paul >>> Roy + Marvin.

That clearly proves which was the more catastrophic decision.

We were so close to getting Howard+Paul+Smoove+mid/late 1st runder(06,07,08)+ Rondo's pick + Acie's pick. Free agents would line up to play with us.

Dynasty lost.

Mr. Bobby Sura helped us get Chillz instead of Howard, and Mr. Chillz (not Deng/Iggy) helped us win the lottery, a lottery we needed to lose, which prompted us to get one of the near unanimous top 2 pick.

Then Chillz convinced BK to draft Selim instead of Ellis. Ouch.

Chillz was a disaster in so many ways.

Edited January 31, 2009 by jerrywest

[exodus]

I will start realizing that (for the purpose of the allstar game) when the allstar committee starts realizing that.

Moreover, about your weak "team record" argument... What's Granger and Bosh doing on the allstar team?

The truth is.... Durant, Jefferson, Milsap, D Will, Jackson all deserved to be at the allstar game. There are some guys on the West squad that I have no earthly idea of why they are there.

The All-Star committe recognizes it. You don't. Bringing up guys like Jefferson and Milsap is just a joke.

If you don't think a teams record plays a roll in All-Star selections then you are even more clueless than i thought. If Vince was on the Hawks and JJ was on the Nets there is no way JJ makes it. Vince would make it for sure.

Granger and Bosh have had huge years and their teams are only 3 games behind the 8th seed.

The reason why you "have no earthly idea" why some guys are on the west team is because you don't realize that the record matters.

[DrReality]

It is for all of the above reasons. One, two, three strikes you out at the old ball game.

[AHF]

And you have to assume that if we drafted Roy, again we wouldnt have been so bad as to keep our pick of Horford.

Portland drafted Roy, finished with a better record and got their choice of Greg Oden, Kevin Durant and Al Horford. Maybe we should assume the Hawks would have gotten Roy and Oden! ;)

That does, however, just endorse your original point that we don't know how everything would have shaken out.

[Diesel]

The All-Star committe recognizes it. You don't. Bringing up guys like Jefferson and Milsap is just a joke.

If you don't think a teams record plays a roll in All-Star selections then you are even more clueless than i thought. If Vince was on the Hawks and JJ was on the Nets there is no way JJ makes it. Vince would make it for sure.

Granger and Bosh have had huge years and their teams are only 3 games behind the 8th seed.

The reason why you "have no earthly idea" why some guys are on the west team is because you don't realize that the record matters.

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth there Ex... Not unusual...

Toronto = 19-29 14th place in the East.

Indy = 19-28... 12th place in the East.

and you say they had "huge years"...

What would you call Kevin Durant's year???

What would you call Milsapp's year?

My God, what would you call Jefferson's Year????

Jefferson's year makes Shaq year look like a scared Kidd.

Durant's year... is asking David West's year... What the hell R U Doing here??

Keep giving us the jibba jabba Ex... It's almost entertaining seeing you argue both sides.

[exodus]

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth there Ex... Not unusual...

Toronto = 19-29 14th place in the East.

Indy = 19-28... 12th place in the East.

and you say they had "huge years"...

What would you call Kevin Durant's year???

What would you call Milsapp's year?

My God, what would you call Jefferson's Year????

Jefferson's year makes Shaq year look like a scared Kidd.

Durant's year... is asking David West's year... What the hell R U Doing here??

Keep giving us the jibba jabba Ex... It's almost entertaining seeing you argue both sides.

Jefferson, Milsap and Durant are FORWARDS. You still don't seem to understand that they have no relevance to Roy.

The coaches picked 3 guards for the West and 3 guards for the East. It isn't complicated. Roy is a guard. He was only in competition with other guards.

Granger is 5th in the NBA in scoring and he is shooting the same percentage from 3 that SJax is shooting overall. Who in the east could be picked ahead of him?

Bosh is averaging 23/10 shooting 50%. Again who in the East could be picked over him?

If you paid attention you would know it is harder for young guys to make the All-Star team. Lebron and Paul didn't make it in their rookie years. It took Melo several years to make it. They aren't going to vote in a 2nd year player on an 11 win team.

It is to make your first All-Star Game than it is subsequent All-Star games. There is a veteran bias as well as a bias towards players on winning teams.