Is Smoove Regressing under Drew?

[DrReality]

It doesn't look like Smoove has bought into the new offense. Glad to see him on the bench.

[coachx]

Smoove's shot selection was horrible early but his defense was excellence.

This is his 7th season now.........wish he would start playing like it on offense. The Hawks are depserate for inside scoring. Thank goodness ZaZa gave them that last night with Horford in foul trouble.

Smoove is acting like a kid testing his new 2nd grade teacher on the 1st day of school. The teacher may have to start discipling the student. Once you mess with his minutes (he only got 24 min last night) Drew may get his attention. Its ashame this is the way it is with a player so physically talented. Powell loked solid in his 20 min of playing time. Drew has something Woody did not. A backup PF who can hold down the fort when Smoove gets out of control.

Edited October 28, 2010 by coachx

[JackB1]

Smoove's shot selection was horrible early but his defense was excellence.

This is his 7th season now.........wish he would start playing like it on offense. The Hawks are depserate for inside scoring. Thank goodness ZaZa gave them that last night with Horford in foul trouble.

Smoove is acting like a kid testing his new 2nd grade teacher on the 1st day of school. The teacher may have to start discipling the student. Once you mess with his minutes Drew may get his attention. Its ashame this is the way it is with a player so physically talented.

With Zaza playing so well, Drew can move Horf to the 4 and put Josh's butt on the pine when he doesn't do what he should. Every interview I have seen with Josh so far, he makes some negative comment about the new offence Drew is implementing. He seems to be fighting it, instead of

embracing it the way the rest of the team seems to be. It will be interesting to see how Drew handles these situations when we aren't winning.

[hawkman]

With Zaza playing so well, Drew can move Horf to the 4 and put Josh's butt on the pine when he doesn't do what he should. Every interview I have seen with Josh so far, he makes some negative comment about the new offence Drew is implementing. He seems to be fighting it, instead of

embracing it the way the rest of the team seems to be. It will be interesting to see how Drew handles these situations when we aren't winning.

Now that's just not true. C'mon man. Smoove seems excited by the coaching change to be honest. I actually thought Smoove played well last night. Every shot he took was a wide open shot and he played awesome defense. Everything cant be all or nothing. JJ goes one on one 2-3 times during the game and people complain. Smoove takes a few jumpers during the game and people complain. Why can't there be a good mix? Smoove is going to have to learn to make the midrange jumper consistently to be an authentic threat in this offense.

Edited October 28, 2010 by hawkman

[macdaddy]

Now that's just not true. C'mon man. Smoove seems excited by the coaching change to be honest. I actually thought Smoove played well last night. Every shot he took was a wide open shot and he played awesome defense. Everything cant be all or nothing. JJ goes one on one 2-3 times during the game and people complain. Smoove takes a few jumpers during the game and people complain. Why can't there be a good mix? Smoove is going to have to learn to make the midrange jumper consistently to be an authentic threat in this offense.

Absolutely true and if you noticed on one play he took a 15 footer when he was wide open (he might have even made it). On the very next play he caught the ball in the same spot, the defender actually came out to defend and he took it to the hole. That's why you take jumpers when you're a PF. So he's not an idiot who just wants to shoot jumpers. He knows that's how he'll open up the lane.

I don't want him shooting long jumpers either but the dude had 5 blocks last night in like 23 minutes. That's some serious contribution to leave on the bench for a few missed shots.

[JackB1]

Smoove is going to have to learn to make the midrange jumper consistently to be an authentic threat in this offense.

So how much longer do we give him?

We don't need him to make the jumpers to help the team. Just play great D,

block shots, rebound and play on the elbow and near the rim. We have enough jump shooters on this team. We

don't need Josh to make jumpers. It's not even like he's "close" to being a decent shooter. Josh shoots more

"bricks" than almost anyone I have ever seen, I bet you Zaza would beat him in a jump shooting contest.

[lethalweapon3]

Smoove 'n Larry will have their tete-a-tetes for a little while, but let's see if Smoove's offensive positioning and decision-making has evolved into something resembling a PF by mid-season. No reason to rush things.

Actually, I suspect Smoove shooting 2.999-pointers is not as verboten under Larryball as it was under Woodyball last year. I expect he'll get one or two looks per game, usually after the initially designed play has broken down. If he improves his instinct to look for cutters before going up for the shot it will help matters, as will the other Hawks crashing the boards for the likely offensive-rebounding opportunity.

~lw3

[coachx]

Smoove 'n Larry will have their tete-a-tetes for a little while, but let's see if Smoove's offensive positioning and decision-making has evolved into something resembling a PF by mid-season. No reason to rush things.~lw3

Why should a 6 year NBA veteran have till mid-season to "evolve into something resembling a PF" on offense ?

Sorry but that doesn't cut it when we are only talking about positioning and shot selection. The coach should demand more. This should not take till-mid season to fix. Its not like he has to learn how to do anything different. He simply had to stop doing what is biggest weakness is.

Smoove shooting 3's and 2.9999's is as stupid as posting up Bibby on the block.....and we all know Smoove is not coached to shoot from there. It is all on him. Drew has given Smoove the message and once again he is showing he has not changed his hard headed ways. Drew has 2 choices: 1.) Live with it 2.) Take some minutes in hopes he gets the message.

Edited October 28, 2010 by coachx

[AHF]

Absolutely true and if you noticed on one play he took a 15 footer when he was wide open (he might have even made it). On the very next play he caught the ball in the same spot, the defender actually came out to defend and he took it to the hole. That's why you take jumpers when you're a PF. So he's not an idiot who just wants to shoot jumpers. He knows that's how he'll open up the lane. .

The idiot is any defender who opens up the lane by stepping out to defend him on the perimeter. The defense should sag off him and encourage him to shoot jumpers early and often. That is what I would do if I were defending him. If he gets hot and beats you, too bad. The numbers show you will a lot of success with that technique.

[lethalweapon3]

Why should a 6 year NBA veteran have till mid-season to "evolve into something resembling a PF" on offense ?

First, because this six-year NBA veteran has been groomed over more than four years to play Smoove Forward and not Power Forward. Second, because this six-year NBA veteran knows, regardless of the consequences of his decisions, he's not going anywhere (unless "the bench" counts as somewhere of significance to him). Third, because this six-year NBA veteran's antics on this end of the floor are not playing us out of playoff contention -- not yet anyway.

Sorry but that doesn't cut it when we are only talking about positioning and shot selection. The coach should demand more. This should not take till-mid season to fix. Its not like he has to learn how to do anything different. He simply had to stop doing what is biggest weakness is.

Smoove shooting 3's and 2.9999's is as stupid as posting up Bibby on the block.....and we all know Smoove is not coached to shoot from there. It is all on him. Drew has given Smoove the message and once again he is showing he has not changed his hard headed ways.

We're pretty much in agreement, excepting our expectations of how quickly Smoove's head softens. It's beyond the "STOP doing THAT" part... it's the "STOP doing THAT AND START doing THIS instead" that will take more time than you or I would like. He really IS learning to do something different. Smoove needs to get comfortable with swift low-post moves and precise high-post passes (on a team not familiar with either in its recent history) in a real-time environment against high-caliber NBA talent (apologies to Josh Powell). If that takes one more regular season game to set in for life, hats off to him! I don't expect it to happen right away, though. That's why I say, let's see where Smoove is in March heading toward the playoffs (Mr. Mora, I'm not talking to you), instead of October.

And I'm not certain that the "messages" Drew is issuing to Smoove is equivalent to the one Woody gave him about those 2.9999-point shots. Instead of, "If you vow not to take any stupid shots, I'll shave my eyebrows or something!" I'm guessing it's more like, "If you insist that taking those stupid shots is the best option, we can fix that, but meanwhile, could you at least have the decency to go a step back behind the line?"

Drew has 2 choices: 1.) Live with it 2.) Take some minutes in hopes he gets the message.

Choice-wise, Drew is doing a hybrid of (1) and (2), he's living with it, and benching occasionally, with the expectation that he'll see improvement as the season progresses.

~lw3

[JackB1]

Smoove shooting 3's and 2.9999's is as stupid as posting up Bibby on the block.....and we all know Smoove is not coached to shoot from there. It is all on him. Drew has given Smoove the message and once again he is showing he has not changed his hard headed ways. Drew has 2 choices: 1.) Live with it

2.) Take some minutes in hopes he gets the message.

Agreed. It's funny how everyone is so willing to give Smoove slack here, because he also blocks shots and does spectacular dunks. Would we tolerate other players purposely playing to their weaknesses so easily?

I dont think so.

This is not rocket science people. Smoove is among the worst long range jump shooters in the entire NBA. He shouldn't be taking any shots over 15 feet...ever...period! What is EVERY player decided to do this and was allowed to

get away with it? What kind of team would we be then?

[lethalweapon3]

Smoove is among the worst long range jump shooters in the entire NBA. He shouldn't be taking any shots over 15 feet...ever...period! What is EVERY player decided to do this and was allowed to

get away with it? What kind of team would we be then?

~lw3

Edited October 28, 2010 by lethalweapon3

[exodus]

First, because this six-year NBA veteran has been groomed over more than four years to play Smoove Forward and not Power Forward.

That is revisionist history. Smith has been starting at the 4 since the 06/07 season. He played the 2 in his rookie year, the 3 in his second year. he played some minutes at the 3 in his 3rd year and hardly any minutes there since then.

He continues to shoot jumpers because he is an idiot. Simple as that. The only way he will stop shooting them is if the coach repeatedly rips him a new one.

Edited October 28, 2010 by exodus

[BusBoyIsBack]

People always have to rip someone, now it's Smoove's turn I guess, even though the guy shot 50% from the field, blocked 5 shots, etc

Edited October 28, 2010 by BusBoyIsBack

[lethalweapon3]

That is revisionist history. Smith has been starting at the 4 since the 06/07 season. He played the 2 in his rookie year, the 3 in his second year. he played some minutes at the 3 in his 3rd year and hardly any minutes there since then.

Yep. Starting at the 4 and actually playing like one (instead of "Smoove Forward") are two different things. Hopefully by season's end the twain shall meet.

~lw3

[exodus]

Yep. Starting at the 4 and actually playing like one (instead of "Smoove Forward") are two different things. Hopefully by season's end the twain shall meet.

~lw3

When Smith spent the summer of '07 working with Hakeem what do you think they were working on, jacking up long jumpers?

[lethalweapon3]

When Smith spent the summer of '07 working with Hakeem what do you think they were working on, jacking up long jumpers?

Hakeem probably should've offered some tips. One season the Dream shot 42% from three! lol

But really, they worked on moving Smoove's play from a 3 to "something resembling a 4" (the team's minute-share for Smoove at the 4 jumped from 19% in '06-'07 to 66%; Smoove's share at the 3 went from 43% to 0%). Maybe if we had signed the Dream to the staff instead of paying for Summer Vacation Camp, Smoove would be playing like the 4 we expect instead of the 3.333 that we see now. Of course, we don't have Hakeem money like Orlando does (P.Ewing). Hello, Tyrone Hill!

~lw3

[DrReality]

I'm inclined to say that he isn't regressing but its the same old Smoove but a different coach. He needs to adapt to the system and I don't know if he can.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I've pointed out many times on this site that Josh was not only a bad shooter, he's one of the worst shooters in the league PERIOD, outside of strictly low post playing centers.

I repeat . . . HE'S ONE OF THE WORST SHOOTERS IN THE LEAGUE

And it's really not even a debate.

Yet, people almost defend his "right" to take long jumpers, just because he does other things well.

Question . . what is wrong with Josh just catching the ball and go hard to the hole, instead of settling for a 21 footer?

The issue is that Drew's offense is made for guys who can shoot, and guys who cut hard toward the basket. We all know Josh can't shoot, so why doesn't he move more toward the paint without the ball?

On the flip side, I have no problem with Josh getting the ball on the outside, if he's looking to make a play for someone else. One thing he can do in Drew's offense, is rack up the assists. He's a good passing big man that is a willing passer at times.

People may not want to see/hear this, but it's like I've always said on here . . . Woody did a lot more to develop Josh's offensive game than people give him credit for

- he moved Josh to the 4 after Harrington left, instead of starting Marvin at the 4 or even Shelden at the 4.

- he encouraged Josh to work on his pot game, even calling ISO plays for him to work in the post.

- he encouraged Josh, when he caught the ball from 15 feet and out, to take his man off the dribble to score or draw a foul.

The ISO offense actually helped Josh become more of a threat on offense. But keep in mind that Josh has always been an early offense ( i.e. - a transition offense type scorer ). His points need to come on the break, and not necessarily within the halfcourt offense.

The other thing that people aren't talking about, is Josh's rebounding. To me, that's always been the area in which he can become a much better player. His role in Drew's offense can also be that of an offensive rebounder who puts the ball in the hole.

But he has to be around the rim to be in position to do that. Can't do that when he's 21 feet from the basket.

If the dude simply plays closer to the rim, his FG% may be around 55%, and he'd easily make the All-Star team.

Like I've also always said . . . he wants to be more like Rasheed Wallace, than Shawn Kemp.

He needs to KILL "Smoove" . . and become "Smash".

[exodus]

Hakeem probably should've offered some tips. One season the Dream shot 42% from three! lol

But really, they worked on moving Smoove's play from a 3 to "something resembling a 4" (the team's minute-share for Smoove at the 4 jumped from 19% in '06-'07 to 66%; Smoove's share at the 3 went from 43% to 0%). Maybe if we had signed the Dream to the staff instead of paying for Summer Vacation Camp, Smoove would be playing like the 4 we expect instead of the 3.333 that we see now. Of course, we don't have Hakeem money like Orlando does (P.Ewing). Hello, Tyrone Hill!

~lw3

Nonsense. Smith is just a dumbass. He takes jumpers because he is too dumb to realize that he is a lousy shooter and the defense wants him to take jumpers. it isn't the coaching staffs fault or the cheerleaders fault or the weatherman's fault.

He has had plenty of success inside whether driving, posting up or hitting the offensive glass. He just doesn't do it enough because he wants to show that he can be a perimeter threat. unfortunately he is only a threat to his own team when he is on the perimeter.

Horford plays in the same offense and is a far better shooter but he isn't out there jacking up 20 footers.