Can Smoove bring us a legit center?

[Jody23]

My mistake. I meant, sf is not a problem

I respectfully disagree and this first quarter tonight is showing why.

[Jody23]

Completely agree. It's about matchups. The last time the Hawks played the Magic, Collins played significant minutes. The result? He defended Howard better than Horford and Smoove combined ever have. Sure Howard got his points, but Collins had the size to defend him single coverage. This had a big impact because Howard's prescense didn't allow the Magic's perimeter guys to get open looks the way they usually do against the Hawks. Also, the Hawks outrebounded the Magic and had a legitimate shot to win the game. When's the last time that happened? You can't just look at the numbers of an individual player because they don't tell the whole story. It's more about matchups and how they impact the game.

And again, Collins is showing the effect of having legit size defensively at the 5. He was the difference in the first quarter.

[Atlantaholic]

And again, Collins is showing the effect of having legit size defensively at the 5. He was the difference in the first quarter.

He has helped defensively. The difference is Horford and Josh cleaning up on the glass, with almost 20 rebounds in the first half.

[Jody23]

He has helped defensively. The difference is Horford and Josh cleaning up on the glass, with almost 20 rebounds in the first half.

True, but Collins has freed them up to do so.

[Joker]

Josh Smith does it again, we get pissed and he starts looking like a MVP player.

[terrell]

Would a trade having Smoove for Gortat work? And maybe one of their small forwards or even point guards for Bibby or Teague (I know they won't give up Nelson, but I'd take Duhon over Bibby). I would tray Smoove for Gortat in a second, and I believe Orlando would like to have a PF. Plus Dwight and Smoove are buddies.

Duhon over Bibby? Smoove for Gortat? Glad your're not the GM.

[DJlaysitup]

Would a trade having Smoove for Gortat work? And maybe one of their small forwards or even point guards for Bibby or Teague (I know they won't give up Nelson, but I'd take Duhon over Bibby). I would tray Smoove for Gortat in a second, and I believe Orlando would like to have a PF. Plus Dwight and Smoove are buddies.

OMG..OMG..OMG - well of course it would work! It would work GREAT for them :no-no: Giving up one of your best and most dynamic players who should have been an allstar last year and likely will be one this year for a slow tall guy that isn't any better than Zaza would suit ORL just fine.

It could put them in the championship and put us in the lottery.

OK...maybe not the lottery - but it would be an insane trade - no matter the peripherals.

Edited December 7, 2010 by DJlaysitup

[RT3]

lol guess you guys are big Bibby fans. We need a big at center who is going to get offensive/defensive rebounds, and be a presence in the middle. Gortat actually plays very well, and would be a great starting center on many teams. it's just that he plays under the best center in the league. He's way better than Zaza, and much longer, so I'm not sure how you can even compare the two. This would also allow Al to move to the 4. I have had NBA league pass the past 2 years so I have been able to follow the Magic play. Gortat plays hard whenever he is in there, and doesn't complain. He does a nice job of both defense, and rebounding, and he is quick for his size. Josh is great at times, yes, but he inconsistent and affects the team with his attitude. I still am not convinced he is a good fit for this offense. This team isn't going to make it past the first or second round with this line up, and we need to mix it up a bit. I'd take Gortat over Josh right now to fill part of the void we have at Center, especially against the bigger teams.

Duhon wouldn't be our PG for the future, but in my opinion he is still an upgrade over Bibby who cannot penetrate, or play any defense. Yes Bibby hits some nice shots tonight, but he is exposed many other nights on defense by quicker guards, switches, and good defensive guards that don't allow him to bring the ball up to midcourt.

Edited December 7, 2010 by RT3

[DJlaysitup]

...I'd take Gortat over Josh right now to fill part of the void we have at Center, especially against the bigger teams....

That's cool RT3...we just agree to disagree on that point :kickcan:

That said - I agree that it would be a plus to get Horford to the PF position...just not at that cost.

Edited December 7, 2010 by DJlaysitup

[Bawse]

Kaman would be the allstar center that would probably be an option for Josh Smith.

I see no reason the Clippers would be interested, they have the beast Blake Griffin.

[AHF]

I want no part of guys like Gortat, Heyward, etc. and would have to see some serious sweetner in the deal before I would consider a deal centered around someone like Kaman for Josh. I don't think guys like Kaman are real difference makers so I am in the school of "let's take our shots at getting a center later in the draft unless we can hit a homerun in a deal...which we probably can't."

[tremor]

I call bulls**t, no way in hell can Josh score efficiently. Can you honestly, without leaving a bad taste in your mouth, say, "Josh Smith is an efficient scorer."

Come on, I applaud Josh for being ferocious on D, but he is completely lost on offense. With his size and athleticism, he should be able to score in the post at will, but that can't be farther than the truth. He has one of the worst post games I've ever seen, and his jumper doesn't help him any. If he's not catching a lob, or receiving a pass towards the lane, you cannot rely on him to score.

Not very efficient, but shooting close to 50% and over 40% for three is OK in my book although I understand your sentiment - it could be better with better shot selection.

But here's something I don't understand - Jamal shoots with much poorer percentage, doesn't do anything much else and yet I see squawkers criticizing and willing to trade Smoove mostly because of his mental issues manifested in his shot selection.

[coachx]

A strange thought.

Smoove for Darko, Flynn and a protected 1st?

Before you go saying no no no.. Do the research and come back. Darko gives us 7 foot 250 finally reaching some of that potential.

Darko is a mental midgit who plays like a SF.

[macdaddy]

We should get this guy. Check out these stats:

15 ppg on 48% shooting. 43% from three

9 rpg (7 defensive)

4 apg

Maybe Josh could bring us this guy. Oh wait these are Josh's stats for the year.

Plus averaging a 1.5 steals and over 2 blocks per game

[Swatguy]

All of this talk of trading Josh is idiotic. Josh is overall the best player on the team.

I'll say it again, Trade the disappointments, Joe and Marvin. I'll give Marvin a pass if he be the backup 3. Move Joe for Thabeet and OJ.

[macdaddy]

All of this talk of trading Josh is idiotic. Josh is overall the best player on the team.

I'll say it again, Trade the disappointments, Joe and Marvin. I'll give Marvin a pass if he be the backup 3. Move Joe for Thabeet and OJ.

On moving Joe, Dallas is looking really good but they have to know that they aren't winning it all without another scorer. Cuban will spend money and bringing in Joe would be huge for them because he's also a good defender. Now I don't really want to trade Joe and I'm not sure they have much to offer us but in a three way I could see them wanting him. With as good as they are playing and Kidd and Dirk getting older Cuban is going for broke (which he does every year anyway).

Between Marvin and Mo our SF rotation is really weak. It may be the weakest in the league with Joe not logging minutes there. If Marvin is going to continue to shoot so laughably awful as he did last night then I don't see Wilkins not taking a lot more SF minutes.

[lethalweapon3]

Probably too much to ask, but for the perennial "Trade X for a Legit Center!" threads, can posters:

(a) Identify what this wondrous pool of Legit Centers includes;

(b) For each proposed Legit Center, what dire situation his team is in that would cause them to consider parting ways with him;

(c ) For each team cited, identify precisely how Player(s) X will improve their dire situation

(d) Assuming Player X cannot be masqueraded as a Legit Center himself, how each team will compensate for the loss of his presence in the middle

Otherwise, in my opinion, the answer to "Can we trade ((insert players that, for the moment, we're sick of)) for a real, true, big, legit center?" will continue to lean toward "no."

~lw3

Edited December 7, 2010 by lethalweapon3

[AHF]

Probably too much to ask, but for the perennial "Trade X for a Legit Center!" threads, can posters:

(a) Identify what this wondrous pool of Legit Centers includes;

(b) For each proposed Legit Center, what dire situation his team is in that would cause them to consider parting ways with him;

(c ) For each team cited, identify precisely how Player(s) X will improve their dire situation

(d) Assuming Player X cannot be masqueraded as a Legit Center himself, how each team will compensate for the loss of his presence in the middle

Otherwise, in my opinion, the answer to "Can we trade ((insert players that, for the moment, we're sick of)) for a real, true, big, legit center?" will continue to lean toward "no."

~lw3

+1

[tbhawksfan]

May not be able to get A center in a one on one deal for Smoove, but there are many possibilities of getting a pretty good starting C and another nice player for him. Get creative and add Bibby or Teague and there are many more possibilities.

I would never trade Smoove str8 up for Kaman. Smoove is a near top talent, but I would look into some possible deals.

[AHF]

May not be able to get A center in a one on one deal for Smoove, but there are many possibilities of getting a pretty good starting C and another nice player for him. Get creative and add Bibby or Teague and there are many more possibilities.

I would never trade Smoove str8 up for Kaman. Smoove is a near top talent, but I would look into some possible deals.

It is one thing to say there are "many possibilities" of realistic trade combinations that would benefit our team in a trade for Josh Smith. It is another to give examples of those and put meat on that bone.

That comment isn't specific to you, but is echoing the general idea that statements about easy trades, etc. is cheap when you don't actually have to put realistic packages together to discuss. That is often the case on this board when discussing centers.

Edited December 8, 2010 by AHF