The Bulls and Nets Series Should Teach Us Something.

[yungsta]

Character should be a very high priority when we rebuild this team and evaluate free agents this offseason. You cant just put together a bunch of talented losers and expect to win big.

What I saw in the nets this season is exactly what I saw in the hawks for the past couple of years. A talented team that underachieves because they dont work hard, have no passion or desire and A coach that is afraid of benching his highest paid players.

The bulls were battling the flu, missing about half their roster, yet they out hustled the nets nearly every game even in the losses but couldnt pull out some of them because they nets were just too talented.

That is what this organization has been missing for the last decade is HIGH CHARACTER PEOPLE.

That is all.

[cam1218]

Best friends playing together?I'd take Horf/Noah over Dwight/Josh..Character..

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I wouldn't call it "high character" guys. What the Bulls have is an IDENTITY. And their coach is the one that pushes that identity on a 24 hour basis.

The organization brings certain types of players into that mix. Players who don't mind playing tough, and have some mental toughness in them. They're a team that's not going to mix "soft" with "tough".

Guys like Hinrich and Robinson may not have the most talent in the world, but they're not going to back down from people. A guy like Marco Bellenelli isn't just going to sit outside and shoot 3s. If he has to, he'll take it hard to the hole. And every guy on that frontline will battle you to the death, if need be.

Chicago is a mirror image of what Boston was 4 years ago ( minus that superstar ). It didn't matter who was hurt on that Celtics team, they had some guy who was going to step up and raise his level of play. Chicago has that. We definitely don't.

A guy like Ivan could play on the Bulls, because he has that mentally tough mindset that they look for in players. As long as they constantly move the ball, and have people who can occasionally create and make their own shot, the Bulls will always be a tough out in the playoffs.

They'll definitely take a game, maybe 2 games, from the Heat. They really need Deng back to guard Lebron though.

[Guest]

This series tells me one thing - coaching matters.

[MaceCase]

The Bulls have had the same demeanor through Skiles, Del Negro and now Thibs so spare me on coaching being the key for them. They draft and sign tough players and competitors. Guys who don't just get by on skill or ability but strive to be greater than what they are. These are guys already willing to run through walls, all their coaches do is point at which wall and when they get through them they tell the players to do it over again.

TNT branded the Nets with the same criticism that they placed on us over the past few years in that they are a "cool" team. Guys more worried about looking good than hustling and playing hard. It was still true for us and it's true for them. Avery Johnson was a tough coach but the cool guys weren't having it and had him fired.

[frizzledizzle]

This series tells me one thing - coaching matters.

That's what I was thinking.

Lose your MVP and battle injuries through the season - 5th season

Lose your second best player(Deng), your only point guard big enough to guard D-Will(Hinrich), your third best player plays through plantar fiicitis(Noah) and your back up big man plays through being dinged up and the flu(Gibson) - Advance to 2nd round

Tom Thibodeau is like Popovich.

[frizzledizzle]

The Bulls have had the same demeanor through Skiles, Del Negro and now Thibs so spare me on coaching being the key for them. They draft and sign tough players and competitors. Guys who don't just get by on skill or ability but strive to be greater than what they are. These are guys already willing to run through walls, all their coaches do is point at which wall and when they get through them they tell the players to do it over again.

TNT branded the Nets with the same criticism that they placed on us over the past few years in that they are a "cool" team. Guys more worried about looking good than hustling and playing hard. It was still true for us and it's true for them. Avery Johnson was a tough coach but the cool guys weren't having it and had him fired.

Nah, it's coaching.

And them drafting tough players is a contradiction when their star player has been able to return for months and still hasn't and their second best player sat out because of the flu.

Toughness isn't what makes them good, it's coaching. They can continue plugging players away and it doesn't matter. Their best player is a 5'9 midget making the league minimum. They win because Thibodeau's system and it's why back to back years they were #1 in the league only to get smacked in the playoffs by the Heat and Sixers. And it's why they finished 5th without their MVP and so many injuries. Thibodeau preaches defense and the system gets them through the season before teams turn on the jets in the playoffs. The Bulls are terrible at scoring but if you don't let them score, you're going to win more than you lose.

You can say it's because the Bulls have tough players and heart if you want but that's like saying Greg Popovich or Bill Belichick win because they get those type of players. They win because of their system and Thibodeau is another guy who does the same. Example... Tom Brady a guy who was benched back and forth in college and almost went drafted is now considered one of the greatest QB's ever. He gets injured and another player, Matt Cassel, couldn't get off the bench in college at USC and sat on the bench behind Brady. He comes in and the Patriots don't skip a beat going something like 11-5. They trade him to the Chiefs and he's useless. There is a reason these guys were getting benched in college, flourished under Belichick and then Cassel went back to stinking with the Chiefs. The system puts you in position to win more than the players. Player after player goes down on the Bulls and they still continue winning. They plug in Nate Robinson after Hinrich got injured, Nazr Mohammad after Noah/Gibson got injured, whatever shooting guard after RIP got injured etc. For being a team of nobodies that can't get by Miami with a league MVP, sure is impressive a combination of their back ups can get the 5th seed and get out of the 1st round. Even the Celtics took Miami to 7 and the Pacers were up 2-1 on Miami. The Bulls are a system team and their success is based on great coaching.

[gurpilo]

The difference is the organization, look how they are constructed

Rose/Hinrich/Robinson/Teague

Hamilton/Bellinelli/Cook

Deng/Butler

Boozer/Gibson

Noah/Mohammed

All are NBA worthy players, well, you can remove Teague and Cook, althought Cook I think could have a chance here, but you have NBA players at all positions.

Hawks only have Teague, Harris, Korver, Smith, Horford, Johnson, that is 2 PG, on wing that cannot defend and 3 PF.... the team is not built as a balanced team, the Bulls are a balanced team.

Look at the draft, they have drafted, they nearly didn't fail in any of them.

2012 Round 1 Pick 29 Marquis Teague Kentucky 2011 Round 1 Pick 28 Norris Cole Cleveland State Round 1 Pick 30 Jimmy Butler Marquette Round 2 Pick 13 Malcolm Lee UCLA 2010 Round 1 Pick 17 Kevin Seraphin France (Cholet Basket) (foreign) 2009 Round 1 Pick 16 James Johnson Wake Forest Round 1 Pick 26 Taj Gibson USC 2008 Round 1 Pick 1 Derrick Rose Memphis Round 2 Pick 9 Sonny Weems Arkansas 2007 Round 1 Pick 9 Joakim Noah Florida Round 2 Pick 19 Aaron Gray Pittsburgh Round 2 Pick 21 JamesOn Curry Oklahoma State

They have been able to draft solid contributors like Butler, Gibson and I believe Teague will be one of them, an all-star center at pick 9 and a top 5 player. They have even a very good player waiting to come, Mirotic. Butler is an absolute steal at 30 and Gibson is another one althought his contract is not that good now. They selected Deng after we took Childress, that's the difference between both teams.

They are able to sign proven players and always build a balance team offensively and defensively, that's the difference: the organization.

[gurpilo]

I forgot about L. Williams and Zaza that could be considered NBA worthy players, but been honest, Williams is a 6'1" SG, a liability on defense, and Zaza is a Center without good defense and post moves and athleticism, probably 2 players the Bulls would never sign.

[benhillboy]

Thibs is the man obviously. His players know the consequences will come swiftly if they don't play to the exact specifications he's set for that particular player. The Celtics defense has had some good years since he left, but no championship editions like the one he spearheaded. Noah could've been a Spartan Warrior, but I think my favorite on that squad is 48 Minute Jimmy Butler. Drives well, takes good shots, and defends like a damn dog. Basically a more athletic Deng with less length. Or how about Tony Allen with a little more offense. Wade will have his work cut out facing him. Then he'll turn around and check LeBron if Wade and Deng are sitting. Pretty damn good value out of a rook.

Edited May 5, 2013 by benhillboy

[capstone21]

It's about player accepting their roles and it's about effort.

[DrReality]

It's about player accepting their roles and it's about effort.

And that has a lot to do with coaching. Think Ferry gets that. This summer we'll get a better idea of his master plan/

Would love to see Horf and Noah together. Not likely

[MaceCase]

Nah, it's coaching.

And them drafting tough players is a contradiction when their star player has been able to return for months and still hasn't and their second best player sat out because of the flu.

Toughness isn't what makes them good, it's coaching. They can continue plugging players away and it doesn't matter. Their best player is a 5'9 midget making the league minimum. They win because Thibodeau's system and it's why back to back years they were #1 in the league only to get smacked in the playoffs by the Heat and Sixers. And it's why they finished 5th without their MVP and so many injuries. Thibodeau preaches defense and the system gets them through the season before teams turn on the jets in the playoffs. The Bulls are terrible at scoring but if you don't let them score, you're going to win more than you lose.

You can say it's because the Bulls have tough players and heart if you want but that's like saying Greg Popovich or Bill Belichick win because they get those type of players. They win because of their system and Thibodeau is another guy who does the same. Example... Tom Brady a guy who was benched back and forth in college and almost went drafted is now considered one of the greatest QB's ever. He gets injured and another player, Matt Cassel, couldn't get off the bench in college at USC and sat on the bench behind Brady. He comes in and the Patriots don't skip a beat going something like 11-5. They trade him to the Chiefs and he's useless. There is a reason these guys were getting benched in college, flourished under Belichick and then Cassel went back to stinking with the Chiefs. The system puts you in position to win more than the players. Player after player goes down on the Bulls and they still continue winning. They plug in Nate Robinson after Hinrich got injured, Nazr Mohammad after Noah/Gibson got injured, whatever shooting guard after RIP got injured etc. For being a team of nobodies that can't get by Miami with a league MVP, sure is impressive a combination of their back ups can get the 5th seed and get out of the 1st round. Even the Celtics took Miami to 7 and the Pacers were up 2-1 on Miami. The Bulls are a system team and their success is based on great coaching.

No, your response is a contradiction. Those systems don't work unless you get players to fit them thus if you don't have a "Belichick player" you can't run a Belichick system and thusly you can't just plug "Belichick players" into a non Belichick system and expect the same results. It's a give and take between personnel and coaching but then.....there have been 3 different systems by 3 different coaches for the Bulls with a few of the mainstay core members still around and throughout the decade the Bulls have always been mentioned as a tough overachieving team that always pushed more talented and even championship teams to the brink.

You are also talking about it not being the players yet you mention a 5'9" midget being their best player........because he plays beyond his stature is why. He doesn't care that the guy guarding him has a foot and 50lbs on him, he goes out there and gets it and if some opposing player thinks he can punk him he'll body him into the stanchion (see Smith, JR). Deng sat because NO ONE knows what he has. You don't get spinal taps for the flu, my friend. Go ask your local doctor just how comfortable that procedure is and then Rose for whatever his reasons sitting out is still mentioned amongst one of the humblest and hardest working players in the league. Ever wonder how and why he hasn't been killed in the media similar to how say a Carmelo would if he sat out? Because he's built that clout in how he's perceived.

Thibs is a good captain but he's also inherited a tough bunch that has already seen their fair share of battles. You can't say you could give D'Antoni the Bad Boy Pistons and expect the same results the same way you can't say Thibs would get the Doug Moe Nuggets into the Finals. He's the right coach for the right job but this is and will forever be a players league.

[AHawks89]

It definitely has to do with coaching. There is no coincidence that Thibs helped the Rockets rank among top 5 in the NBA in scoring defense and FG % from 2004-2007, as well as finishing top 10 in defense in the league 15 times. Also became the fastest coach to 100 wins. Every team he has coached has outstanding defense. The guy knows how to coach and it's showed last night with them being short of many key players.

[MrMeltdown]

Tells me we dont have a single player worth putting on the pedestal that Teague, Horford, and Smith have been put on from time to time.

[TheFuzz]

Agree with most of the things being said. Yes, Thibs is a better coach than Drew. But Noah and Deng will bust their tails no matter what. Honestly, not even Horford plays anywhere near as hard as they do.

It also helps that they have a much deeper and more balanced team than we do. Deng/Boozer/Noah is a nice frontline. Then you add Rose to the mix...

Who do we have? Well. Horford. And I guess Smith. Our starting SF played off the bench for them.

[Diesel]

Character should be a very high priority when we rebuild this team and evaluate free agents this offseason. You cant just put together a bunch of talented losers and expect to win big.

What I saw in the nets this season is exactly what I saw in the hawks for the past couple of years. A talented team that underachieves because they dont work hard, have no passion or desire and A coach that is afraid of benching his highest paid players.

The bulls were battling the flu, missing about half their roster, yet they out hustled the nets nearly every game even in the losses but couldnt pull out some of them because they nets were just too talented.

That is what this organization has been missing for the last decade is HIGH CHARACTER PEOPLE.

That is all.

I have to call BS on this.

Kobe Shaq won championship.

Even characterless Lebron has a ring.

What happened with the Nets wasn't about character, it was about coaching.

Their offense was very predictable and it gave Chicago a chance to take advantage of them. Their defense didn't adjust quickly and it gave Chicago the chance to take advantage of them. The old adage is still true. IN basketball, talent wins. But you must have talent on the court and off.