Let's recognize our franchise player

[macdaddy]

This tweet caught my eye and with all the talk of the draft picks and free agency and trades I wanted to take a moment to recognize the last man standing from the 'core'. The true captain and star of this team right now Al Horford. For all the talk of Al 'not being that good' or not star material I'll take this kind of stat for a half season any day.

Lang Greene @LangGreene

Post All-Star break last season Atlanta Hawks center Al Horford averaged 19.7 points and 11.1 rebounds on 55 percent shooting.

3 minutes ago

Still can't post a tweet. Sorry.

Edited July 22, 2013 by macdaddy

[benhillboy]

I thought of Al as Co-Captain with Bibby around his second month of being a rookie. After Bibby left, it was Al all alone.

[Buzzard]

I thought of Al as Co-Captain with Bibby around his second month of being a rookie. After Bibby left, it was Al all alone.

It should have been Al all alone. Unfortunately we had Josh's ego to deal with. Al will be a monster this year. I have already taken him in a fantasy contract based draft with the 5th pick.

If he gets slotted at PF/C, Al will be a all star ( Coaches pick ) once again this season.

[benhillboy]

Unfortunately we had Josh's ego to deal with.

I heard Rick Mahorn on NBATV saying Josh is the perfect fit for the Pistons (who already struggle mightily from the perimeter and spacing the floor) and he'll help the young guys with their "maturity" and that he and Rasheed would be nice for Monroe's and Drummond's development. I had to wonder does he even know who Josh is? I'm anxious to see if Sheed encourages Josh to shoot threes or actually keep it real with him and tell him the hard, honest truth as if nobody has already. Edited July 22, 2013 by benhillboy

[hazer]

Horf never had enough plays drawn up for him or was the focal point like he probably will be in Bud's system. Pick n roll, pick n pop, the man will average 20+/10+ and return to the all-star lame, errrrrr, game. And eff all that co-captain phooey, Horf is the MAN this year.

Edited July 22, 2013 by hazer

[Buzzard]

I heard Rick Mahorn on NBATV saying Josh is the perfect fit for the Pistons (who already struggle mightily from the perimeter and spacing the floor) and he'll help the young guys with their "maturity" and that he and Rasheed would be nice for Monroe's and Drummond's development. I had to wonder does he even know who Josh is? I'm anxious to see if Sheed encourages Josh to shoot threes or actually keep it real with him and tell him the hard, honest truth as if nobody has already.

Sheed will probably try and help Josh's development as a jump shooter/stretch player.

[hazer]

Sheed will probably try and help Josh's development as a jump shooter/stretch player.

So does the collective "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!" transfer with Josh from ATL to DET?

[ATLSmith]

Should be a good year for Horf.

[IllestPamfilis]

I think Horford has a career year. 20 and 12 all day

[MaceCase]

So does the collective "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!" transfer with Josh from ATL to DET?

No, that's just the sound of the wind blowing through their empty stadium.

[EazyRoc]

With our luck, he will go to Detroit and win a championship like the last headcase PF.

[Guest]

Horford is the man period ...love him. He's a throwback guy, not many like him left, we are lucky to have him.

[thecampster]

I heard Rick Mahorn on NBATV saying Josh is the perfect fit for the Pistons (who already struggle mightily from the perimeter and spacing the floor) and he'll help the young guys with their "maturity" and that he and Rasheed would be nice for Monroe's and Drummond's development. I had to wonder does he even know who Josh is? I'm anxious to see if Sheed encourages Josh to shoot threes or actually keep it real with him and tell him the hard, honest truth as if nobody has already.

[thecampster]

Benhillboy, not picking on you but this is the sheep following the herd mentality that loses us franchise players every year.

Josh Smith missed on average 1.8 3 point attempts last year. He made .8. You guys are beating the dead horse of 1.8 misses. If Josh shot the league respectable 33% from 3 last year that would have equaled 1.7 misses.

That is how ridiculously stupid you guys are being. You are whining and crying and exposing Atlanta for being a very low BBIQ city for crying about .1%.

Assume for a sec Korver took those 3's and hit his normal 45.7% of last year. That would have made 1 point difference in the games. 1 point, that's it. .154 x 1.8 = .83 points.

Now go ahead and tell me how Brand/Millsap/Carroll = Josh like that moronic article the other day tried to do. Those players can't play 1 position all at once. Josh shot 47% last year. at 17 attempts a game...the difference between 50% and 47% is 1 point.

Josh in the rest of his game equaled far more than enough to make up 1 point a game. Just ridiculous. December can't get here fast enough so we can be looking up at Detroit in the standing and everyone on this board is eating crow.

[MaceCase]

Replace 3 pointer with long 2 and that post still wouldn't sound more butt hurt.

[AHF]

The mis-characterization of Josh's bad shot selection in that post is tough to swallow.

Josh shot a .501 TS% for 2012-13 and a .499 TS% for 2011-12. Millsap shots .550 TS% and .545 TS%. Those are huge gaps.

For his career, Josh has shot at a poor .516 TS% while Millsap has shot at a .563 TS%. Again, huge gap in scoring efficiency.

The issue is not the 3's. They are an easy to ID problem but the biggest problem for Josh has been the long 2's. His efficiency on the 3pt shot is bad but not abysmal. His efficiency on the long 2's is astonishingly bad for someone who takes them at as high a rate as Josh does. The fact that Atlanta fans know this is a problem is not a sign of bad BBIQ, it is a sign a good BBIQ.

Now the question then turns to whether the passing, defense, etc. offsets the offense. We'll see but to focus on .1 shot per game is to totally miss the point.

Replace 3 pointer with long 2 and that post still wouldn't sound more butt hurt.

That was shorter and sweeter. Same point.

Edited July 23, 2013 by AHF

[Admin]

Now that was a dignified response Hawksfanatic, well done sir!

[macdaddy]

I'm sure Al is hoping this is the year that discussions of his game don't always end being discussions of Josh Smith. I like Josh and really liked all the things he could do on the court but the eyeball stat told me he took way too many game-losing shots. Maybe we aren't in the game at all if it wasn't for him but still.

I think Al, Milsap, Brand is going to be a great rotation. As far as boring, I think people will get behind guys who hustle, guys who have fun, and guys who try to win at all costs. Lets face it Zaza has been the biggest fan favorite. We've now got some guys who will scrap and have all star level talent.

[thecampster]

The mis-characterization of Josh's bad shot selection in that post is tough to swallow.

Josh shot a .501 TS% for 2012-13 and a .499 TS% for 2011-12. Millsap shots .550 TS% and .545 TS%. Those are huge gaps.

For his career, Josh has shot at a poor .516 TS% while Millsap has shot at a .563 TS%. Again, huge gap in scoring efficiency.

The issue is not the 3's. They are an easy to ID problem but the biggest problem for Josh has been the long 2's. His efficiency on the 3pt shot is bad but not abysmal. His efficiency on the long 2's is astonishingly bad for someone who takes them at as high a rate as Josh does. The fact that Atlanta fans know this is a problem is not a sign of bad BBIQ, it is a sign a good BBIQ.

Now the question then turns to whether the passing, defense, etc. offsets the offense. We'll see but to focus on .1 shot per game is to totally miss the point.

That was shorter and sweeter. Same point.

There is no mischaracterization and you know it. It can't be simpler than one poster says, "shooting 3's" and I point out he missed 1.8 3's a game. That's a legitimate fact.

That's 33% would have been missing 1.7 3's per game is a legitimate fact and when you have to try and trot out advance stats to refute the difference between 1.7 and 1.8 misses a game you have issues. The difference Smith makes will be shown this season when the Pistons make the playoffs and the Hawks are struggling to get in.

I love my Hawks and I hate what I see as you guys being sold a bag of sand.

Let's try to remember this is the same Danny Ferry that drove Cleveland into the ground.

Let's try to remember that this is the same Danny Ferry that was such a Nancy that when drafted with the 2nd overall pick in the draft opted to go to Italy to avoid playing for the LA Clippers. Danny talks about selfish players and primadonnas and he wouldn't play for the Clips.

The guy was never really liked as a player, isn't trusted by the players and our offseason shows that. When your big press releases are that a 34 year old Elton Brand is replacing Zaza, Millsap is replacing Smith and can't convince a real center to come to Atlanta, you're in trouble, real trouble.

[AHF]

Anyone who ignores Josh's long 2s to focus exclusively on his 3's is missing the boat. After 100+ threads discussing Josh's shot selection, I hope everyone is well aware of this.