Getting Better Value for Trades

[MCVicious]

Long time lurker here. I don’t post much on here but I figure I break the ice and start a discussion for the first time.  

 

I have long wondered about a our GM’s ability to get the most assets from a deal. Similar to many people here, after the recent trade I was a bit irked by how little Ferry was able to get in return for Lou and Bebe. 

 

I look at a GM like Hinkie who owned 20% of the second round picks this year by flipping scrubs like Evan Turner and Lavoy Allen and wonder how we aren't able to get maximum value. On top of that her was able to swipe Saric while netting a second AND a future first for letting the Magic move up 2 spots for Payton! Other GM’s like Morey and Ainge are seemingly also able to attain maximum value in trades.  

Meanwhile in Atlanta, we can’t get anything for Josh Smith, can’t seem to trade Teague ever for anything good and had to add a first round sweetener for the Raptors to take a reasonable player and contract in Lou. Even in the Joe Johnson deal we weren’t able to get Marshon Brooks and had to settle for swiping firsts (which by the way hope works out for us next year). 

 

Now before you say “why is this dude crying over a couple second round picks ?” Can you imagine what Ferry and Bud could have done with the second rounders the 76ers had? We could probably build a whole overseas farm system with those picks haha. In actuality its not just about the second rounders but our inability as a whole to get better deals.

 

I don’t want to come off as too negative here because I’m very optimistic about the hawks in general and love what Ferry is doing. All I’m saying is it would be nice to see him get more valuable assets in his trades. For once, I want to see the Hawks get the longer end of the stick in a trade, especially for a team that repeatedly gets touted as being the most "flexible" during every Free Agency period.  

 

What are your thoughts? What do you think is dictating our inability to get better deals? Is Ferry just not a great negotiator?

[Gray Mule]

My thoughts is, "If he wants a player gone, he's gone."

 

Sometimes I too wonder why we seem to end up on the short end of the stick.

Usually, however, when he wants a player here, he moves and gets him if

there is a way to do so.

 

Most of the players who are gone, we wished them to be gone.  Sometimes, it

takes a while for us to really want the player or player he brings in, but we

usually end up liking them.

[Diesel]

 

Long time lurker here. I don’t post much on here but I figure I break the ice and start a discussion for the first time.  

 

I have long wondered about a our GM’s ability to get the most assets from a deal. Similar to many people here, after the recent trade I was a bit irked by how little Ferry was able to get in return for Lou and Bebe. 

 

I look at a GM like Hinkie who owned 20% of the second round picks this year by flipping scrubs like Evan Turner and Lavoy Allen and wonder how we aren't able to get maximum value. On top of that her was able to swipe Saric while netting a second AND a future first for letting the Magic move up 2 spots for Payton! Other GM’s like Morey and Ainge are seemingly also able to attain maximum value in trades.  

Meanwhile in Atlanta, we can’t get anything for Josh Smith, can’t seem to trade Teague ever for anything good and had to add a first round sweetener for the Raptors to take a reasonable player and contract in Lou. Even in the Joe Johnson deal we weren’t able to get Marshon Brooks and had to settle for swiping firsts (which by the way hope works out for us next year). 

 

Now before you say “why is this dude crying over a couple second round picks ?” Can you imagine what Ferry and Bud could have done with the second rounders the 76ers had? We could probably build a whole overseas farm system with those picks haha. In actuality its not just about the second rounders but our inability as a whole to get better deals.

 

I don’t want to come off as too negative here because I’m very optimistic about the hawks in general and love what Ferry is doing. All I’m saying is it would be nice to see him get more valuable assets in his trades. For once, I want to see the Hawks get the longer end of the stick in a trade, especially for a team that repeatedly gets touted as being the most "flexible" during every Free Agency period.  

 

What are your thoughts? What do you think is dictating our inability to get better deals? Is Ferry just not a great negotiator?

 

 

Welcome.  Very good first post.

 

I am in agreement about Ferry's mode of action.  I have always said that there is no difference between he and BK expt BK had a plan.

 

In his defense, I think GMing is difficult.  Especially here in Atlanta because of our history with FAs.  Teams that trade with us kinda already know that they have us over a barrel because we're not so good at attracting FAs. Until we change that history, I think we will always be told what the deal is going to be instead of telling others what the deal is going to be.  So  Ferry adopted BK's old motto of "Changing the culture".   It's a great sound bite and goes really far with a lot of people around here but when you open your eyes and look around, you see that Ferry has the same elements that BK had to work with and is severely handicapped until he actually changes the culture.  There are only three ways out:

 

1.  Make good on a traded player or FA.

 

2.  Overpay for a Free Agent.

 

3.  Draft a major talent.

 

 

BK decided before taking over that his plan was #3.  So he firesold the Hawks (just like Ferry did) and he drafted. If we hadn't have picked up Bob Sura (I believe) we'd have had D12 and Smoove and BK would have been executive of the year at least 2 times. Especially if he were still able to get JJ.

 

Ferry seems like he has gotten by on #1.   BK did that also with JJ, but Ferry is doing that with Sap.   The question now is what will he do now.  This offseason, Ferry has no where to hide.  This is the offseason where he builds the house... So let's all sit and watch!!

[TheFuzz]

 

Long time lurker here. I don’t post much on here but I figure I break the ice and start a discussion for the first time.  

 

I have long wondered about a our GM’s ability to get the most assets from a deal. Similar to many people here, after the recent trade I was a bit irked by how little Ferry was able to get in return for Lou and Bebe. 

 

I look at a GM like Hinkie who owned 20% of the second round picks this year by flipping scrubs like Evan Turner and Lavoy Allen and wonder how we aren't able to get maximum value. On top of that her was able to swipe Saric while netting a second AND a future first for letting the Magic move up 2 spots for Payton! Other GM’s like Morey and Ainge are seemingly also able to attain maximum value in trades.  

Meanwhile in Atlanta, we can’t get anything for Josh Smith, can’t seem to trade Teague ever for anything good and had to add a first round sweetener for the Raptors to take a reasonable player and contract in Lou. Even in the Joe Johnson deal we weren’t able to get Marshon Brooks and had to settle for swiping firsts (which by the way hope works out for us next year). 

 

Now before you say “why is this dude crying over a couple second round picks ?” Can you imagine what Ferry and Bud could have done with the second rounders the 76ers had? We could probably build a whole overseas farm system with those picks haha. In actuality its not just about the second rounders but our inability as a whole to get better deals.

 

I don’t want to come off as too negative here because I’m very optimistic about the hawks in general and love what Ferry is doing. All I’m saying is it would be nice to see him get more valuable assets in his trades. For once, I want to see the Hawks get the longer end of the stick in a trade, especially for a team that repeatedly gets touted as being the most "flexible" during every Free Agency period.  

 

What are your thoughts? What do you think is dictating our inability to get better deals? Is Ferry just not a great negotiator?

 

 

Welcome, good first post. I disagree, though. Ferry has won every trade he's done EXCEPT for the Lou deal. I'm not huge on the Lou deal either, but it's the cost of clearing cap space in this free agent market. Outside of this deal, he's done very well.

 

The thing is, Smith was worth a lot more than a second, but the offers we received for Smith were pretty bad from what we know. The Joe deal was ridiculously lopsided in our favor.

[Randy]

Then there was the deal at the trade deadline last year where we got some guy that we waived to give another team a break on their luxury tax.  But the team did make some money off of it.  So, seems like a lot of his deal (maybe all of them) have been more about money than players - the JJ deal being the best example, but the Lou/BeBe deal was another.  He won the JJ deal, and let's not forget the Marvin deal was another winner for us.  But, I guess that's a problem with the NBA and a CBA - cap space comes first, money second and talent last in most deals. 

[LamarHampton]

That deal for Jeremy Tyler was whack. Still don't understand what that was all about. Kid seemed like a decent project and we cut him after 5 mins of PT. Turning into a decent player now. Or we should have at least kept that second round pick. Basically just wasted it. Smh.

Edited July 6, 2014 by LamarHampton

[Afro]

Our ownership loves money. It's also the reason why I laugh at all the "tankers".

The owners are never going to purposefully leave money on the table by missing the playoffs.