Nique getting a bit of respect on ESPN

[capstone21]

Curry getting 4 on the all time point guards is a complete crock but Nique getting in the small forward list at  number 10 is good to see 

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarankSFs/ranking-top-10-small-forwards-ever

 

[SalvorMallow]

This list...

[Hawkmoor]

Lot of people will disagree, but Nique is TOP 5 all time at the small forward. The ONLY small forwards on that list that you can make a legit argument about being better than Nique are Bird , maybe Durant and maybe James. Personally, i think James is overrated, but he is the media darling......... I watched Erving play, he aint better than Nique, just has the reputation and was on a better team than Nique.  Durant dont make anybody better around him, a argument that was always thrown at Nique. I feel Nique is better than Durant because of his offensive rebounding. NOBODY could keep Nique off the offensive board. Lebron just has that bullrush to the rim that people cant stop because he as big as a NFL lineman......

Edited January 14, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[HawkItus]

this isn't respect.  Behind Barry, Pippen, and Hav is crazy.  Top 5 would be his due respect. 

[macdaddy]

I really can't compare them but some of these guys seem like they wouldn't have made this list if they spent their career on the Hawks teams that Nique was on.  

[Guest]

1. Bird

2. Julius

3. Lebron

4. Nique

 

hav and pipp were great but individually not on Nique's level...worthy as well

Ps ESPN can suck on deez...since 98

[AHF]

Durant is the biggest unknown.  He is probably near his peak rating at #4 but he couple topple down that list if things don't go well for him.  He'd have to lead multiple championships to get a shot at moving up.

[Jody23]

I think Nique should be higher on the list, but I do agree with LeBron being number 1.

[benhillboy]

I don't have any issue with the list at all except I foolishly thought Havlichek was a 2.

As much as I grew up idolizing Nique and as eye-popping as his averages were for such a long time, the older I get the less I forgive him for being a mediocre defender.  He had the tools to be dominant, yet not a single Defensive Second Team nod?  

That's why I'm cool on Durant unless he has a Dirk-like playoff run and Debo a championship.  I'd take Kawhi's Finals MVP and annual DPOY Candidacy over his scoring titles and MVP all day.  

Barring a few outliers for players who don't have the tools and/or have a once-in-a-generational skillset that carried them to a championship (Bird, Wardell) , players gotta go both ways...

[BigDog90]

Nique is a little low.

[QuantumHawkz]

Til this day,I still don't see what is so special about James. This dude just bull rush at the rim. ( sometimes you could easily call charging) His shot is inconsistent and his defense never been consistent. Nique is a top 5 small forward, the only thing he doesn't have is a ring. 

[Hawkmoor]

11 hours ago, benhillboy said:

I don't have any issue with the list at all except I foolishly thought Havlichek was a 2.

As much as I grew up idolizing Nique and as eye-popping as his averages were for such a long time, the older I get the less I forgive him for being a mediocre defender.  He had the tools to be dominant, yet not a single Defensive Second Team nod?  

That's why I'm cool on Durant unless he has a Dirk-like playoff run and Debo a championship.  I'd take Kawhi's Finals MVP and annual DPOY Candidacy over his scoring titles and MVP all day.  

Barring a few outliers for players who don't have the tools and/or have a once-in-a-generational skillset that carried them to a championship (Bird, Wardell) , players gotta go both ways...

See, thats my problem with people who dont KNOW what the situation with Nique was in Atlanta. Dont take this personally, but you DONT KNOW.  Most people get what they know from the media. First, you are correct about the tools Nique had to be a excellent defender.  When Nique first came into the league, especially his rookie year, he was a MONSTER on the defensive end.  He was blocking shots, along with Dan Roundfield, left and right.  With that leaping ability, he was a BETTER defender than Josh Smith. I saw those games. He was a EXCELLENT on ball defender. Seriously, the ONLY player i saw player as TOUGH and HARD as Nique on both offense and defense was Allen Iverson. They were hustling MACHINES. I know it because thats how I PLAYED THE GAME. I saw it.

Mike Fratello made a conscious decision to INSTRUCT Nique to concentrate more on his offensive game and CARRY THE HAWKS ON OFFENSE.  With that scrub team he played on, the scoring HAD to come from Nique. Red Auerbach was the ONLY coach who set the record straight about Nique when he said that Nique's defense was VASTLY under rated and he never got credit for it.   NOBODY is slamming CarMElo, NOBODY is slamming Durant, and we can go on and on. These players are prima donnas on offense, but nobody slams them about their defense. Honestly, Nique is TOP 3 small forward of all time and top 20 alltime player. He was THAT great. If he had played in Los Angeles, New York, Chicago, etc. it would have NEVER been put up for debate.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 15, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[Hawkmoor]

35 minutes ago, QuantumHawkz said:

Til this day,I still don't see what is so special about James. This dude just bull rush at the rim. ( sometimes you could easily call charging) His shot is inconsistent and his defense never been consistent. Nique is a top 5 small forward, the only thing he doesn't have is a ring. 

EXACTLY. The NBA and media MARKET Lebron. Its all about MONEY......He was crowned King of the NBA BEFORE he ever took his FIRST dribble in the NBA..........Thats one of the MAIN reasons i cant stand the NBA.  Its one step away from WWE wrestling.....

Edited January 15, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[QuantumHawkz]

24 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

EXACTLY. The NBA and media MARKET Lebron. Its all about MONEY......He was crowned King of the NBA BEFORE he ever took his FIRST dribble in the NBA..........Thats one of the MAIN reasons i cant stand the NBA.  Its one step away from WWE wrestling.....

Right, that was/is my problem with him. He was also called "the next Jordan" which just blew my mind. Honestly, I think Curry is the best player in the NBA now. It's very hard to guard someone how can shoot and take you off the dripple. If I had to play James I'll let him shoot all day. The NBA wanted the next Jordan so bad that they picked Lebron. He's not better than Nique when it comes to over all skill.

[Dejay]

1 hour ago, Hawkmoor said:

See, thats my problem with people who dont KNOW what the situation with Nique was in Atlanta. Dont take this personally, but you DONT KNOW.  Most people get what they know from the media. First, you are correct about the tools Nique had to be a excellent defender.  When Nique first came into the league, especially his rookie year, he was a MONSTER on the defensive end.  He was blocking shots, along with Dan Roundfield, left and right.  With that leaping ability, he was a BETTER defender than Josh Smith. I saw those games. He was a EXCELLENT on ball defender. Seriously, the ONLY player i saw player as TOUGH and HARD as Nique on both offense and defense was Allen Iverson. They were hustling MACHINES. I know it because thats how I PLAYED THE GAME. I saw it.

Mike Fratello made a conscious decision to INSTRUCT Nique to concentrate more on his offensive game and CARRY THE HAWKS ON OFFENSE.  With that scrub team he played on, the scoring HAD to come from Nique. Red Auerbach was the ONLY coach who set the record straight about Nique when he said that Nique's defense was VASTLY under rated and he never got credit for it.   NOBODY is slamming CarMElo, NOBODY is slamming Durant, and we can go on and on. These players are prima donnas on offense, but nobody slams them about their defense. Honestly, Nique is TOP 3 small forward of all time and top 20 alltime player. He was THAT great. If he had played in Los Angeles, New York, Chicago, etc. it would have NEVER been put up for debate.

 

 

 

34 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

EXACTLY. The NBA and media MARKET Lebron. Its all about MONEY......He was crowned King of the NBA BEFORE he ever took his FIRST dribble in the NBA..........Thats one of the MAIN reasons i cant stand the NBA.  Its one step away from WWE wrestling.....

Agree and cosign. If Nique and Worthy traded places, Nique would have his rings and Worthy would've begged and held out of camp for a trade three years in from being tired of carrying a mediocre Hawks team to 43-39 seasons. He literally had NO HELP from the teammates Kasten and later, Babs put around him and took them within an inch of the ECFs in an era where getting that far was a far cry from what is today. Just think of what the ESPN and NBA TV folks say about them getting there last year. I remember someone even bringing up that the Hawks have to prove that they can win in the playoffs and not just in the regular season; as if they didn't do that by making the ECFs with half of their roster being injured...

 

 

[benhillboy]

10 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

See, thats my problem with people who dont KNOW what the situation with Nique was in Atlanta. Dont take this personally, but you DONT KNOW.  Most people get what they know from the media. First, you are correct about the tools Nique had to be a excellent defender.  When Nique first came into the league, especially his rookie year, he was a MONSTER on the defensive end.  He was blocking shots, along with Dan Roundfield, left and right.  With that leaping ability, he was a BETTER defender than Josh Smith. I saw those games. He was a EXCELLENT on ball defender. Seriously, the ONLY player i saw player as TOUGH and HARD as Nique on both offense and defense was Allen Iverson. They were hustling MACHINES. I know it because thats how I PLAYED THE GAME. I saw it.

Mike Fratello made a conscious decision to INSTRUCT Nique to concentrate more on his offensive game and CARRY THE HAWKS ON OFFENSE.  With that scrub team he played on, the scoring HAD to come from Nique. Red Auerbach was the ONLY coach who set the record straight about Nique when he said that Nique's defense was VASTLY under rated and he never got credit for it.   NOBODY is slamming CarMElo, NOBODY is slamming Durant, and we can go on and on. These players are prima donnas on offense, but nobody slams them about their defense. Honestly, Nique is TOP 3 small forward of all time and top 20 alltime player. He was THAT great. If he had played in Los Angeles, New York, Chicago, etc. it would have NEVER been put up for debate.

 

 

 

 

 

I'll give you that, I became a Hawks/NBA fan around 87-88, but please know the media doesn't inform any opinions I have.  

Fratello was a defensive-minded coach, I find it hard to believe he instructed Nique to take it easy on defense (not calling you a lie, just saying). Jordan played on scrub teams early and still posted crazy steal, block, and rebound numbers.

I do agree if you swap him for James the Lakers maybe win another while Worthy couldn't have led those Hawks teams to the heights Nique did during the peak.

Kevin Durant actually gained points saying he didn't deserve to be in the top 5.  Then he lost a couple after I just saw Muhammad put him on a poster.

[nathan2331]

Y'all aren't being fair to Lebron. He may not possess a wide range of basketball skills, but he is the best athlete to play basketball. But yeah, Nique is way too low on that list. It's a shame people don't realize how intense of a player he was.

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[Hawkmoor]

Excellent short clip with Fratello talking about Wilkins:

 

http://omnyapp.com/shows/siriusxm-nba/mike-fratello-goes-off-the-dribble-on-appreciating

[Hawkmoor]

On 1/15/2016 at 10:13 AM, QuantumHawkz said:

Right, that was/is my problem with him. He was also called "the next Jordan" which just blew my mind. Honestly, I think Curry is the best player in the NBA now. It's very hard to guard someone how can shoot and take you off the dripple. If I had to play James I'll let him shoot all day. The NBA wanted the next Jordan so bad that they picked Lebron. He's not better than Nique when it comes to over all skill.

One more thing.  What you just said about Lebron, ive always said the same thing, let him shoot the ball.  DONT double team him. When you double team him, he kicks out to the 3 point shooters and Thompson and Mosgov grab the boards. You LET Lebron get his 30 points, and dont let the rest of the team get anything. Then, you bring Cedric Mack into the game just to ELBOW  dellavedova or whatever his name is,   in the mouth and sideline him............lmao

[nathan2331]

On 1/15/2016 at 10:13 AM, QuantumHawkz said:

Right, that was/is my problem with him. He was also called "the next Jordan" which just blew my mind. Honestly, I think Curry is the best player in the NBA now. It's very hard to guard someone how can shoot and take you off the dripple. If I had to play James I'll let him shoot all day. The NBA wanted the next Jordan so bad that they picked Lebron. He's not better than Nique when it comes to over all skill.

One more thing.  What you just said about Lebron, ive always said the same thing, let him shoot the ball.  DONT double team him. When you double team him, he kicks out to the 3 point shooters and Thompson and Mosgov grab the boards. You LET Lebron get his 30 points, and dont let the rest of the team get anything. Then, you bring Cedric Mack into the game just to ELBOW  dellavedova or whatever his name is,   in the mouth and sideline him............lmao

I don't know why this isn't the default method on handling Lebron. I've barely ever seen him kill teams with his outside shooting as his primary offense. But when you double team him, he'll easily kill you with his playmaking ability.

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