Changing of the guard: Should the younger TH,Jr. be starting over the older Korver?

[hawks774]

Kyle has done a lot of good things over the years for the Hawks,but there are too many games that Korver is shut down and is a total non-factor. There are games at AGE 35 that he plays more minutes than Jeff Teague and Al Horford and this goes back to last year in the playoffs.

Kyle spreads the floor, but TH,Jr. can do that too, right. Plus, Hardaway is also able to put the ball on the floor and attack the basket and draw fouls from opposing players.

Bud has slowly integrated TH, Jr. into the lineup, but he needs to be starting and averaging 28 to 32 minutes a game.  

[AHF]

I'm still for a mix of these guys.  THJr cannot remotely spread the floor like Korver.

THJr sits at a 32.4% 3pt%. - which is very subpar.  He had a great March and has been at 25.9% or lower every other month of the season.

Korver sits at a 39.8% 3pt% (with 5 months at .400 or higher including Feb-April).  That is a HUGE difference.

 

They bring about the same impact for defense, rebounding, steals, etc. but THJr is a much better driver and gets to the line more which helps him enjoy a still substantial but lesser gap in terms of TS%.  Because they offer different skills, they should be mixed with each other depending on what Bud needs from the lineup.   I trust Bud to make that call.

[macdaddy]

I'm a fan of Tim and all but until he starts actually driving a lot vs. jacking shots i think he'll be somewhat limited.   I agree though that Korver plays too much.   It's going to affect his shooting in the playoffs i think.   As AHF said though, Korver is still more of a threat on offense than Tim.  Whether it's just a perceived threat or not doesn't matter that much.  

[Hawkmoor]

Been time to bench Kyle.........It would be better for HIS game also. 

[capstone21]

No ... what people are missing  is that even when Kyle is missing  his shots the opposing team is still absolutely respecting him and has a man on him.  

There is a reason he is never left open.  THjr does not even remotely get that kind of respect.

Kyle acting as a decoy is extremely effective for us.   One of the big reasons he misses his shots is that there is a defender in his grill.  He does not need to get 10 points to have an impact for us.

[Guest]

It just won't happen this year.

I would really love to add a player or have THJR develop enough to limit Korver's court time.

THJr doesn't spread the floor like Korver, he has a different skillset and Bud shouldn't force that on him. 

 Would love to see him drive the ball more. To me He's more Bazemore than Korver, but with a better handle and more control on drives. He just  doesn't do it enough.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, capstone21 said:

No ... what people are missing  is that even when Kyle is missing  his shots the opposing team is still absolutely respecting him and has a man on him.  

There is a reason he is never left open.  THjr does not even remotely get that kind of respect.

Kyle acting as a decoy is extremely effective for us.   One of the big reasons he misses his shots is that there is a defender in his grill.  He does not need to get 10 points to have an impact for us.

I can understand that but then if Kyke isn't even attempting shots and nobody else is scoring it's ineffective.

If Kyle is being guarded so tight, coming off screens etc..what's the counter move?

[NBASupes]

Next season, this is probably more tough but Kyle for now

[AHF]

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

If Kyle is being guarded so tight, coming off screens etc..what's the counter move?

The ideal is that being guarded so tight means the defense loses its shape and it creates opportunities for others.  That is certainly the key to his +/- success.  If he is being guarded that tight and no one else can score either, time to change it up.  That is Bud's job to mix and match to the best effect.

[Lurker]

If Korver is starting next year, we need to start wondering if he has some incriminating photos.

This season I won't comment but it will not make much sense at all if he begins the playoffs by playing 36-38 mins, like last season. I mean it, especially against a team like Boston where I'd be surprised if he saw the light of day more than 3 times per game.

It'll make even less sense if we see a game plan of "Only worry about getting Kyle Korver going early in this game".

 

ETA: And the only team in which it would really actually HELP Korver's offense if he came off the bench is against Charlotte. Boston has lockdown defenders in the starting lineup and bench on the perimeter, same as Miami. If Miami/Boston makes Korver a priority on the perimeter, he's not seeing the light of day in either series, even if he comes off the bench. 

Edited April 12, 2016 by Lurker

[Guest]

This season Kyle for sure, he spreads it nicely...(stop laughing @kg01)... Lol...next year Timmayyyyy.

[bumpyphish1]

11 hours ago, hawks774 said:

Kyle has done a lot of good things over the years for the Hawks,but there are too many games that Korver is shut down and is a total non-factor. There are games at AGE 35 that he plays more minutes than Jeff Teague and Al Horford and this goes back to last year in the playoffs.

Kyle spreads the floor, but TH,Jr. can do that too, right. Plus, Hardaway is also able to put the ball on the floor and attack the basket and draw fouls from opposing players.

Bud has slowly integrated TH, Jr. into the lineup, but he needs to be starting and averaging 28 to 32 minutes a game.  

Simply put, no way in h3ll.

[hawks774]

5 hours ago, Lurker said:

If Korver is starting next year, we need to start wondering if he has some incriminating photos.

This season I won't comment but it will not make much sense at all if he begins the playoffs by playing 36-38 mins, like last season. I mean it, especially against a team like Boston where I'd be surprised if he saw the light of day more than 3 times per game.

It'll make even less sense if we see a game plan of "Only worry about getting Kyle Korver going early in this game".

 

ETA: And the only team in which it would really actually HELP Korver's offense if he came off the bench is against Charlotte. Boston has lockdown defenders in the starting lineup and bench on the perimeter, same as Miami. If Miami/Boston makes Korver a priority on the perimeter, he's not seeing the light of day in either series, even if he comes off the bench. 

Korver should be playing in a more limited role, but receiving starting minutes at age 35 is something that should not be happening. HOW MANY WINNING TEAMS HAVE A 35 year old shooting guard STARTING? (D-Wade in Miami is only exception) 

At times Korver has trouble getting a shot off, and if you couple that with Schröder on the floor for extended minutes who has been inconsistent shooting the ball and turning the ball over is not a good combination. Boston is a solid defensive team and among the league leaders in steals.  Miami is a tough defensive team as well especially on the perimeter. Teague should be leading the team in total minutes and Tim Hardaway needs to be out on the floor more often along with Thabo Sefalosha. Tim played 28 minutes in a home win over Toronto, and Thabo played 30 minutes in a home win over Boston. Hardaway's ability to attack the basket along with shooting the three is an asset. Thabo is not a great shooter, but he is the best perimeter defender on this team. Korver is too one-dimensional at this point of his career and opposing teams such as Toronto, Boston, Miami or Cleveland believe they can limit or shut down Korver and  stay out of foul trouble. 

 

[BigDog90]

12 hours ago, hawks774 said:

Kyle has done a lot of good things over the years for the Hawks,but there are too many games that Korver is shut down and is a total non-factor. There are games at AGE 35 that he plays more minutes than Jeff Teague and Al Horford and this goes back to last year in the playoffs.

Kyle spreads the floor, but TH,Jr. can do that too, right. Plus, Hardaway is also able to put the ball on the floor and attack the basket and draw fouls from opposing players.

Bud has slowly integrated TH, Jr. into the lineup, but he needs to be starting and averaging 28 to 32 minutes a game.  

It's too late into the season to do that, maybe for next season. 

 

[BigDog90]

9 hours ago, capstone21 said:

No ... what people are missing  is that even when Kyle is missing  his shots the opposing team is still absolutely respecting him and has a man on him.  

There is a reason he is never left open.  THjr does not even remotely get that kind of respect.

Kyle acting as a decoy is extremely effective for us.   One of the big reasons he misses his shots is that there is a defender in his grill.  He does not need to get 10 points to have an impact for us.

That is true.  

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Biggest game of the season, and our starting wings go 2 - 11 FG for 7 pts in 50 minutes total of play

THj goes 4 - 7 FG ( 3 - 3 3FG ) for 13 pts in 16 minutes.

Horrible.

[Plainview1981]

1 hour ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Biggest game of the season, and our starting wings go 2 - 11 FG for 7 pts in 50 minutes total of play

THj goes 4 - 7 FG ( 3 - 3 3FG ) for 13 pts in 16 minutes.

Horrible.

Kyle Korver is finished. I'm not sure I even want him off the bench anymore. He is just a bad player now.

[AHF]

Supposedly THJr is hurt.  This is the kind of game where you otherwise give him more run.

[hazer]

Not yet. Soon though...