How well did we play without Horford?

[hazer]

28 minutes ago, pimp said:

LOL, i like that he's trying,  but this only reminds me of Josh Smith every summer. MidRange shawty part deux

It will take an Angels in the outfield situation for Dwight to improve his shooting.

Hawks University flipped Bazemore from a 60% FT shooter to an 82% FT shooter in a single year...

[pimp]

8 minutes ago, txsting said:

60% is truly all that is necessary, that's 1.2 points per possession if you're playing hack a dwight. We can live with that, and earlier in D12s career he achieved numbers close to that.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

Adam Silver is "supposed to be making changes to the hack-a-howard thing this summer.
http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2016/story/_/id/15913971/2016-nba-playoffs-adam-silver-seek-end-hack-shaq-cites-surge
 

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  Brian WindhorstESPN Senior Writer

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OAKLAND, Calif. -- NBA commissioner Adam Silver said he would use his "bully pulpit" to try to force through reform to eliminate the intentional fouling of poor free throw shooters, also known as the Hack-a-Shaq strategy.

Silver was speaking in his annual address before Game 1 of the NBA Finals. In the same room at Oracle Arena a year ago, Silver said he was "on the fence" about the issue.

But there's a two-and-a-half times increase in such fouls this season over last. Silver said the NBA's research showed a 16-fold increase in such fouls over the past five years.

"Not only is that something that is bad for our network partners, but for all of the fan research we have shows that the fans hate it," Silver said. "There may be a compromise in there where we can cut it down significantly."

Without naming them, Adam Silver said the intentional fouling of poor free throw shooters primarily affects three players -- Dwight Howard, DeAndre Jordan and Andre Drummond -- and that he will have to lobby some owners for a rule change. Bob Donnan/USA TODAY Sports

One option is to make an intentional foul penalty one shot plus the ball -- as it is currently in the final two minutes of games.

The NBA competition committee can recommend rule changes this summer, but it must pass a two-thirds majority vote of owners.

Without naming them, Silver said these fouls primarily affect three players --Dwight Howard, DeAndre Jordan and Andre Drummond -- and that he will have to lobby some owners.

Some do not believe a rule change that favors a few teams' star players is fair.

"If Adam wants to get rid of Hack-a-Shaq, he's wrong. Dead wrong," Dallas Mavericks owner Mark Cuban said in April. "Absolutely 100 percent wrong."

Several other issues Silver addressed Thursday:

• Silver said the league would need to have a final decision on the 2017 All-Star Game set for Charlotte, North Carolina, by the end of the summer. He visited Charlotte recently and spoke with lawmakers and business leaders there. The league has called on the state to repeal a law that limits protection on gender discrimination.

 

EDITOR'S PICKS

• Silver: Reports show refs 90 percent correct

  Adam Silver says the NBA wants to be as transparent as possible in determining whether refs are making the right key calls despite the fact they get them right a "vast majority of the time."

 

Silver said the league has investigated options in case the game needed to be moved, but he believes a compromise to keep it in North Carolina is possible.

"There is no line in the sand and intentionally we didn't want to draw a line in the sand," Silver said. "The discussions are ongoing. ... I'd say there is absolutely strong interest in trying to work something out."

• Silver continued to strongly defend the league's officials and the use of its "Last Two Minute" reports to increase transparency. He said the league's studies showed officials get about 90 percent of calls correct, and Silver was satisfied with that number, though the league is always hoping to improve. He said a team recently suggested the speed and changing spacial patterns in the game might make adding a fourth official an option. Silver said he would study the idea.

• In the wake of Draymond Green receiving scrutiny for flailing his legs and making contact with opponents, Silver said the league may take measures to further penalize players for that type of play.

"We're seeing a lot more late kicks and, frankly, players flailing their [legs and] arms. It's clear what they're doing," Silver said. "They're trying to sell calls. They're trying to make contact. They're trying to demonstrate that they're getting fouled on particular plays. It's not something new in the league, but as we track it, it's becoming more prevalent. It's not something we want to see."

[TheNorthCydeRises]

10 hours ago, thecampster said:

In the 11-12 season....the Hawks were 6-4 with Horford on the floor, 38-34 without.

2011-12 was the strike season which only went 66 games.  Horford played 10 full games with the Hawks going 6 - 4.   He got hurt early in Game 11 vs the Pacers, so we won't count that game toward Horford ( which was a loss )

So in those next 56 games, the Hawks went 34 - 22.

Josh Smith really became more assertive as an offensive player with Horford gone.  He actually had more 20+ point games than JJ. ( 29 to 24 ).  He and JJ took turns having big offensive games for the Hawks.

Zaza was solid in the middle, averaging right at 8.5 points and rebounds a game in Horford's absence.

The biggest thing is that the Hawks became a very good defensive team.  Finished 6th in the league on defense.  And a good deal of that had to do with the bench holding their own.  Guys like T-Mac, Willie Green and Janerro Pargo really helped to stabilize the team, and had decent games themselves.

Moving Marvin to the bench in place of Kirk Hinrich helped a little too.  Marvin played better coming off the bench.

Oh ... I forgot one guy.  A journeyman overseas player who the Hawks found out of nowhere, who would become a fan favorite and one of the hardest workers on the team.

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

And props to Teague in 2011-12.  That was his first year as the starter.  13 points - 5 assists - and 48% FG that season.

[hazer]

23 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

And props to Teague in 2011-12.  That was his first year as the starter.  13 points - 5 assists - and 48% FG that season.

In the the spirit of this thread and the "How Well Did We Play Without" line of thinking: Shredder will best 13/5 in his first year with the reins. The limb I'm going out on? 15/7 with a similar FG%.

[pimp]

9 minutes ago, hazer said:

In the the spirit of this thread and the "How Well Did We Play Without" line of thinking: Shredder will best 13/5 in his first year with the reins. The limb I'm going out on? 15/7 with a similar FG%.

He will  definitely put up better assist numbers than Teague did , but i think his FG% will be under 45%

Edited July 5, 2016 by pimp

[TheNorthCydeRises]

2 minutes ago, hazer said:

In the the spirit of this thread and the "How Well Did We Play Without" line of thinking: Shredder will best 13/5 in his first year with the reins. The limb I'm going out on? 15/7 with a similar FG%.

I don't know if Dennis will shoot that high of a percentage, but I agree that he's aggressive enough to be a 15 ppg - 7 assist guy.  

If he's being forced to score more, that may be a bad sign for us as a team.  I'd much rather see his assist number go up than his ppg total.

 

[hazer]

1 minute ago, pimp said:

He will  definitely put up better assist numbers than Teague did , but i think FG% will be under 45%

Hawks University though

[hazer]

4 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

I don't know if Dennis will shoot that high of a percentage, but I agree that he's aggressive enough to be a 15 ppg - 7 assist guy.  

If he's being forced to score more, that may be a bad sign for us as a team.  I'd much rather see his assist number go up than his ppg total.

 

Agreed. Then again, scoring PGs working out pretty good for the Warriors, Cavs, and Thunder. I'd also be thrilled with Shredder at 45%, but his aggression may have him hovering lower in the 40s.

[terrell]

11 hours ago, BigDog90 said:

I agree. Hawks have a good system in place. I wonder how it'll change though since Dwight and Al have different skillsets. I really hope Bud doesn't  try to use Dwight the same way he uses Al.

You mean hanging out at the 3 point line? I doubt it.....

[DarnShadyRefs]

5 hours ago, hazer said:

As long as he's never out beyond the arc (no 3s D12!), improved FTs/jumpers from Dwight is a very GOOD thing.

I agree. I just don't want the physicality and rebounding prowess of his to be affected. It also seems our staff don't care about teaching our bigs post moves. I don't want Dwight to start looking like Horford in the physicality and rebounding department is all I'm saying.

Hope I'm worrying over nothing.

[benhillboy]

8 hours ago, Thomas said:

The most vivid recent memory for me is not when he was hurt but when he went to the bench against the Cavs and the journeyman Humph came in and we were better. A short snapshot no doubt but very telling because it was on a big stage. 

Casual fans can see PFs throwing their body around like they're supposed to and cheer for them.  Hump got a rowdier applause than Al ever had.  

But it takes hardcore fans like us to see when a guy isn't putting his body on the line.  Celtics fans will see soon enough.

[Thomas]

1 minute ago, benhillboy said:

Casual fans can see PFs throwing their body around like they're supposed to and cheer for them.  Hump got a rowdier applause than Al ever had.  

But it takes hardcore fans like us to see when a guy isn't putting his body on the line.  Celtics fans will see soon enough.

Don't know if Humph gets signed by us or not but he showed on the same stage LeBron was on that he does make a big difference. A lot of heart and hustle lost if we aren't able to sign him. 

[hazer]

34 minutes ago, DarnShadyRefs said:

I agree. I just don't want the physicality and rebounding prowess of his to be affected. It also seems our staff don't care about teaching our bigs post moves. I don't want Dwight to start looking like Horford in the physicality and rebounding department is all I'm saying.

Hope I'm worrying over nothing.

We are talking Dwight Howard here, rest assured you're worrying over nothing. Pick-n-roll, lob-n-dunk, pick-n-pop, lob-n-dunk. Improving FTs will help when they hack-a-Dwight, improving the jumper will help with the pick-n-pop. D12 will be a physical presence on the glass, Bud will flex the plan to fit that. Don't forget his years with Duncan in San Antonio.

[BigDog90]

5 hours ago, terrell said:

You mean hanging out at the 3 point line? I doubt it.....

Yeah! I would love it if they run the true Spurs offense.

[Thomas]

6 minutes ago, BigDog90 said:

Yeah! I would love it if they run the true Spurs offense.

With adapting D12 into our own system I think it will definitely look a lot like the Spurs plays they ran when Duncan was closer to the basket. Should help balance our offense out a bit more. 

[DarnShadyRefs]

2 hours ago, hazer said:

We are talking Dwight Howard here, rest assured you're worrying over nothing. Pick-n-roll, lob-n-dunk, pick-n-pop, lob-n-dunk. Improving FTs will help when they hack-a-Dwight, improving the jumper will help with the pick-n-pop. D12 will be a physical presence on the glass, Bud will flex the plan to fit that. Don't forget his years with Duncan in San Antonio.

Thats what I'm hoping for as well.  I like how Coach Quinn and Bud are being allowed to put their fingerprints on the team through this years to rebuild the team their way.  I can't wait to see the end result once these 2 coaches get rolling the way they want.  I know it's tougher to acquire the pieces in the nba due to dearth of talent in both the draft and FA unlike the nfl.  Acquiring Dwight is a huge step in breaking our curse in even getting opportunity to be considered as an option by talented free agents.  Yes he might not be the Dwight of old but even this 2nd stage Dwight is somebody our past front offices didn't even have a chance at before.