Where's the love?

[chillzatl]

As usual it's nothing but a dog pile on Marvin here. So it doesn't surprise me that after all the off season prognostications on how he's not working hard, has no heart and isn't getting better, nobody mentions how so far in the pre-season he is our most consistent player. 19pts in game 1, 17pts in game two, two completely different games for him yet he still produced for his team. C'mon haters, lets hear your excuses for why this is meaningless.

[SmooveTheFuture]

Its preseason means nothing talk to me when he is doing this vs the best players on the court in meaningful games then you might get some reaction. Marvin is going to need alot more of this in meaningful games to get alot of haters off his back he was picked 2nd overall and was taken before alot of really good players so the jury is still out.

[chillzatl]

that's nonsense. You stroke josh smith at every opportunity, even in the pre-season. If he took a crap in June that didn't stink you'd take out an add in the AJC.

At this point where marvin was picked means nothing. If he's producing, he's producing and he should get recognized for that. If he's not, bag on him, but at least have the stones to afford him the same respect you do the other players

[exodus]

of hate. The relentless Marvin bashing just gets ridiculous.

When that story about his summer activities came out the bashing lasted for weeks. When the story about his bad scrimmage came out the bashing started up again.

I would expect that if Marvin plays well this year my post count will probably slow down a lot just because i won't be fighting all of the anti-Marvin nonsense. Funny thing is that i am really not a big fan of his but i am just not willing to write him off.

[Gray Mule]

To some, where a player was picked in the draft means

more than what they accomplish in the season.

Age and experience have nothing to do with it.

Injuries have nothing to do with it.

Produce now or else. Your position you were drafted

demands you produce - NOW!

Personally, I have always believed MW was a long term

project who would grow as this young team grows and

would, when the team matured, then be able to produce

in the manner we needed.

We are now seeing the fruits of our patience. He's

still younger than our two newest Hawks. This is the

season MW begins to show what he is capable of.

No, he's still not there. He will continue to improve

for several years.

GO HAWKS !!!

[thesheedera]

The problem is that the games have only been on the radio so we can't see if his production is a result of a more aggressive approach or not. If it is, then it's logical to think that his game will be improved and a step closer to where it needs to be.

If it isn't, then it's easy to think that his production is a result of meaningless preseason games against watered down competition.

The only things that give me pause from getting really excited are:

1) Sekou's criticism of his first game - which I've said I think is his way of taking off the kiddie gloves with Marv, which I think is great at this time for a lot of reasons. I take his comments with a grain of salt because I think he has a new "agenda" with Marv. Not a harmful one, but one intended to help raise the bar now that the 3rd season is upon us.

2) Woodson's quote about Marvin's play in the 2nd half of the 2nd game being reminiscent of the "Old Marvin" from a year ago. That tells me that maybe he wasn't agressive enough in the 1st 6 quarters of preseason for Woody's liking. This would lend some credibility to the notions that Marv is only aggressive in the absence of JJ,a nd that Marv could be more effective as a 6th man. I don't necessarily agree with those notions, but I can't prove they're wrong.

All in all, though, it's just GREAT seeing the two guys that we've had the most recent debate about (Marv & childress) here putting up solid numbers and getting us wins in the first two games.

Many here expected a Marvin-Smith fued (and I think some wanted one), but they seem to like each other and clearly play well together. Now some seem to want a Childress-Marvin fued, and I really doubt they're gonna get it.

After only two games I'm starting to think this squad could be closer to a .500 club than I thought.

[mountain_jim]

On Marvin from Sekou

http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/index.html

Quote:

---

Hawks are 2-0 in exhibitions

By SEKOU SMITH

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 10/11/07

Miami — Hawks forward Marvin Williams was in the zone this time a year ago.

He came to training camp off of a summer-league experience that saw him named the Most Valuable Player at the Rocky Mountain Revue.

He was playing the best basketball of his life. He was strong as he had ever been. His confidence was soaring.

And in a split second, and the crack of a bone in his left hand, all that flow came to an abrupt end.

That broken finger cost Williams the first 17 games of the season — and the swagger that he is slowly getting back now. And while he isn't all the way back to the confident, attacking small forward he was, Williams is getting closer.

"I saw glimpses of the old Marvin in the second half [of Monday night's win over Orlando], and I expect to see him from here on out," Hawks coach Mike Woodson said before his team's 106-100 overtime win over Miami at AmericanAirlines Arena on Wednesday night, their second consecutive exhibition season win.

"It's so unfortunate for Marvin that his injury happened the way it did last year because when you're at the same stage of development he is right now, every little boost of confidence helps."

Williams might have the toughest assignment of any Hawks player this season while working mostly at small forward. Not only do the Hawks need him to be a competent defender at one of the league's toughest positions, they also need him to be able to go back on offense and score 15-18 points a night, every night.

That's why this exhibition season is so important to Williams, who finished with 17 points and six rebounds Wednesday night. He knows he has to make up for lost time.

"Some people might not take it as serious," he said. "Every second out there for us is a learning experience and a confidence booster. You just want to win as many battles as you can and roll some of that confidence into opening night [of the regular season] against Dallas and then carry it on from there. But every second matters to me. Every second."

If Williams answers the call this season, the Hawks have a chance to chase their lofty goals, which include making the playoffs for the first time in eight years.

"Marv knows what kind of pressure is on all of us this year," said Hawks captain and All-Star Joe Johnson. "And I don't think it's any secret that we need big production from all of our starters and rotation guys. But with him being the No. 2 pick in the draft, and this being his third year and all, people are expecting him to take that next step."

That's a tall order for any player, let alone a 21-year-old just two years removed from his only season of college basketball.

Williams, however, is comfortable with that challenge. And after a trying sophomore season — he did average 13.1 points and 5.3 rebounds while starting in 63 of 64 games last year — he insists he's ready to get back his swashbuckling ways.

"After I broke my hand I went back to the way I played my first year," Williams said. "So for me it's just a matter of being in attack mode at all times. I went to the line a lot the other night and hopefully I can do that again every night, be aggressive at all times."

---

[macdaddy]

I pull for Marvin like I do all the Hawks but I've been unimpressed most of his two years. Not having seen the preseason games I don't know how well he played but it sounds good.

Last year he might score 15 but he still didn't seem like anything more than a bench player on a good team. But toward the end of the year he started getting to the line A LOT. And it seems he's doing it in preseason I think. This to me is great news. No one else on the team seems to have that ability. I'd like to see him develop a fade away and then we're talking.

Marvin doesn't have to worry about haters too much longer though. With Horford here there's another Williams that needs to find his place or he'll be the next victim of squawk hate. Although 4 for 4 last night I think.

[frosgrim]

When MW was selected all acknowledged that he was a long-term project. His 3rd year was the projected year that he would break out.

The two preseason games show that he's getting some swagger. Getting to the line is important for the Hawks. In fact, if he scores 40% of his points at the line, that is awsome. No other Hawk player draws fouls, thus we need a guy that can do that. If MW is that guy, that is great.

For me, barring injury, I want MW to get around 17 a game, while pulling down 6 boards. Those numbers would be sufficeint and in line with what he should be doing at 21 and considering we have JJ and Smoove on the team. W/out JJ I would want more points, by the by.

[exodus]

Quote:

---

"After I broke my hand I went back to the way I played my first year," Williams said. "So for me it's just a matter of being in attack mode at all times. I went to the line a lot the other night and hopefully I can do that again every night, be aggressive at all times."

---

Sounds a little different from the passive player we have seen a lot.

[chillzatl]

You can gleen a good bit from the box score. It doesn't tell the whole story, as box scores never do. But in game one he put up 19 pts and took 17 free throws. That shows some agression. He was drawing fouls left and right on them. Last nights game was different, he didn't get his points all from fouls, yet he stil produced. Two different types of games yet he found a way to produce for his team in both.

Like I said, it doesn't tell the whole story and it doesn't predict the future. What it does do is offer some counter to those who say Marvin doesn't work hard and that he doesn't take any of this seriously. He's out there helping his team win.

[AHF]

Aggression is definitely the name of the game for Marvin. I would like to see a boost in his non-scoring numbers (rebounds, blocks, assists, steals, etc.) that are largely effort stats. I think the scoring will come with time.

[BeeSwatter]

the line:

34 mins 0-5 fg 0-1 3pt 6-8 ft 15 reb 4 ast 5 to 3 blk 6pts

If Marvin had that line last night everyone would be posting about how big of a bust he is.

[AHF]

Quote:

---

the line:

34 mins 0-5 fg 0-1 3pt 6-8 ft 15 reb 4 ast 5 to 3 blk 6pts

If Marvin had that line last night everyone would be posting about how big of a bust he is.

---

The day Marvin gets 15 rebounds, 4 assists and 3 blocks, you will see me praising him for getting physical and stepping up his effort on a night when his shot was not falling. You want more offensively from everyone on the team than a 0-5 night, but for a rough shooting night that isn't a bad line.

[BeeSwatter]

I agree completely, but I would say on this message board if Marvin had that exact line the people would be all over him for not making a field goal.

[AHF]

Quote:

---

I agree completely, but I would say on this message board if Marvin had that exact line the people would be all over him for not making a field goal.

---

I would say that a vocal minority would be all over him. Most would be happy with at least his rebounding and shotblocking.

[BeeSwatter]

Fair enough. My opinion is Marvin is compared to Smith on this board to a fault. They are different, no reason they can't co exist.

[Jdawgflow]

Preach it, brother!

[thesheedera]

Chillz, I here ya completely. But the fact remains that there won't be any "love" from the haters until he really plays great consistently.

When he starts producing night in night out during the regular season we'll hear that it's meaningless until he takes the team to the playoffs, because that's what a #2 pick is supposed to do.

When he plays well in the playoffs we'll hear that it's meaningless because we aren't contenders.

If we're ever contenders, we'll hear that if only Marvin was better we'd have a championship.

Haters hate.

[Zone034life]

First of all let me get something straight. It seems some of you believe people like me who expect more from Marvin than what they have seen as hating and wanting to see him have fueds with his teammates. You couldn't be more wrong. I am a known Hawks fan by my friends, family and coworkers. So ask yourself, why in the He## would I want him to fail? I have spent alot of time defending this team and even trying to persuade others to join the fan base. I would like nothing more than our top draft pick to become a productive player night in and night out. All I have commented on is what I have seen out of the kid so far. Which has not been nearly enough.

Some are more patient than others. Some of you didn't care about his production in his first two years because he wasn't projected as star until year three or later. I say he was a starter on a professional team who needed to give his horrible team(record wise) more production. As for the here and now, two good preseason games are good 2 hear. November 2 is when he will start turning many who think like me into believers. I'll be pulling for him, but I will believe it when I see it. If you look at me holding him to high standards as hating then you don't know the meaning of the word. But I have no reason to hate a guy who I need to produce on my favorite team. I have the right to be dissapointed thus far though.