The hopes of a franchise are heavy.

[MaceCase]

I don't see your argument. I just stated the first deal was horrible and contractualy bloated. What ever happened with Kaman and Gordon is inconsequential because they were not binding considerations in the deal. Kaman was a FA. Gordon was a FA. Money was owed to every member of the that first deal except Goran Dragic. Whatever your point it was a bad deal.

Alright......

If you are going to quote me responding to somebody then you better understand the context of my statement.

This is the quote that I responded to

LOL @ saying that Stern wasn't interested in receiving talent, when they got Eric Gordon, Chris Kaman, an expiring contract, and a 1st round pick. He got a decent center, an potential All-Star combo guard, and because they were still sorry, ended up getting the #1 pick in the draft in Anthony Davis.

Very clearly he is touting the merits of the Clipper trade on talent and not contractual considerations. If you are going to make the argument that a trade was made on talent then you must understand that they turned down a deal for superior talent, hindsight be damned. That is the argument because it's very clear Northcyde is a man painfully averse to cap space so surely you do not think he's wasting his time arguing for the merits of a deal expressely clearing space......yet here you are thinking that that is the crux that I'm somehow against.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Alright......

If you are going to quote me responding to somebody then you better understand the context of my statement.

This is the quote that I responded to

Very clearly he is touting the merits of the Clipper trade on talent and not contractual considerations. If you are going to make the argument that a trade was made on talent then you must understand that they turned down a deal for superior talent, hindsight be damned. That is the argument because it's very clear Northcyde is a man painfully averse to cap space so surely you do not think he's wasting his time arguing for the merits of a deal expressely clearing space......yet here you are thinking that that is the crux that I'm somehow against.

Northcyde simply tells the facts.

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/7333285/los-angeles-lakers-deal-acquire-chris-paul-off

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ys-nba_dan_gilbert_email_lakers_hornets_trade_120811

No sense in telling lies about the situation.

[ATLscrubLove]

Had no idea this post would start an argument.

[MaceCase]

Northcyde simply tells the facts.

http://espn.go.com/l...-chris-paul-off

http://sports.yahoo....ts_trade_120811

No sense in telling lies about the situation.

Northcyde doesn't know how to read.

"It's not true that the owners killed the deal," NBA spokesman Mike Bass said. "The deal was never discussed at the Board of Governors meeting and the league office declined to make the trade for basketball reasons."

Dan Gilbert is a singular owner butthurt that Lebron left him high and dry. He does not speak for all or any of the owners but himself.

Had no idea this post would start an argument.

Some people just can't let their loved ones go and hope for the future.....like Dan Gilbert. Edited October 16, 2012 by MaceCase

[TheNorthCydeRises]

And what were the "basketball reasons" again? And go ahead and dismiss the power that gilbert's e-mail may have had on Stern, when he accurately laid out the reason why the Lakers were going to make out like fat cats once again in a lopsided trade. Gilbert was one of the main ringleaders in the owner's lockout of the players. That dude had major pull amongst the rest of the league's owners.So Stern is going to undercut his own GM in New Orleans, and kill all the work the Rockets and Lakers did, because the deal was unfavorable to the Hornets?Even you're not that dang gullible.Just because the league didn't have a formal vote on the trade, doesn't mean that they didn't hear the cries of the owners loud and clear. But go ahead and believe some generic statement from the league, when everyone else knows the truth.

Edited October 16, 2012 by northcyde

[MaceCase]

Yes, the truth was the Hornets were for sale. Good luck dancing around that fact and its implications.

[IllestPamfilis]

Athletes LOVE the city of Atlanta. As said before, I think our biggest problem was the ownership and the thought that they were satisfied with mediocrity. Now that Danny Ferry is here, I think it'll all change. We have management that WANTS TO WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS. 2013-2014 is the beginning of a new era.

[macdaddy]

Had no idea this post would start an argument.

Way to go man. Way to go...

[AHF]

The NBA did the right thing from a talent acquisition standpoint by going with the Clippers instead of the Lakers' offer. They screwed the pooch from a conflict of interest angle. Rather than looking at "revisionist" anything, here was my view immediately after the veto and Clipper deal was announced:

This was a big upgrade from the Hornets' perspective. You can also add in the real factor that if they would have acquired Odom, Martin and Scola these guys would not have garnered much future value so that rebuilding would be even more difficult. It would be tough to flip them for real assets (for example, the best the Lakers got for Odom was a pure salary dump due to his age and salary) and the fact that the Hornets would have finished 7th-11th in the West would have prevented them from getting a franchise changing star in the draft this year. Instead, they pick up Aminu, future All-Star Gordon, the Minny pick (which could be huge and at least should come with useful talent on the board given the talent in this draft), and the prospect of sucking worse in the short term and reaping more young talent for the future with their own pick this year. There is no doubt in my mind that this was a huge upgrade as far as the assets ultimately received.

The fact that Gordon was hurt for the year does nothing to change my view that it was the right thing to do purely from a basketball perspective.

[Diesel]

True but if you see where the Hawks will be next year in terms of money, they are in a good situation. Hawks are one of few teams who are able to sign more than one superstar/all-star. Sometimes players are more for exposure, which is why D12 will probably stay in LA. But if the Hawks somehow manage to lure CP3 we will start seeing pieces fall into our laps. Obviously luring stars here is one on the toughest obstacles we face, but sometimes superstars just wanna play together somewhere. So we do have that going for us next year, especially now that Ferry wants to start a generation of winning. Either way this team is in a great situation next season. This franchise is on the up and up under Ferry and will have the $$$ to spend. That's always the recipe for success.

Lure? You must have missed the Deron Williams interview. He said that he would have never resigned had he had to go back to NJ. They were very smart in getting him knowing that they were moving the franchise. Atlanta holds a similar reputation. We are not some hotbed for FAs. Look at our history. We got Joe because of his loyalty to us. When the ownership situation broke down, Joe could have walked and never been a Hawk but he was loyal. Capspace is meaningless without a draw.

[Diesel]

Athletes LOVE the city of Atlanta. As said before, I think our biggest problem was the ownership and the thought that they were satisfied with mediocrity. Now that Danny Ferry is here, I think it'll all change.

Not likely. Here's why.. Mediocrity is still the status quo... 1. Coach = Same. 2. Trade 6 time all star... Keep 3 pt shooting (29%) PF. 3. Make draft mistake in not getting Perry Jones. 4. In trade of 6 time allstar, you fail to get Marshon Brooks or a future first. 5. Don't address the C position. 6. Don't address the SF position. I mean, you picked up Korver, but is there a better way to say mediocrity than Korver? 7. You overaddressed PG with OGs. Danny Ferry didn't make San Antonio. Danny Ferry was invited and worked there. Danny Ferry didn't do anything great in Cleveland. Some blame him for the failure of Cleveland and the lost of Lebron. Players have always liked Atlanta for our weather, strip clubs, and cheap houses... but do they want to play here.... NOPE.

[Jody23]

Lure? You must have missed the Deron Williams interview. He said that he would have never resigned had he had to go back to NJ. They were very smart in getting him knowing that they were moving the franchise. Atlanta holds a similar reputation. We are not some hotbed for FAs. Look at our history. We got Joe because of his loyalty to us. When the ownership situation broke down, Joe could have walked and never been a Hawk but he was loyal. Capspace is meaningless without a draw.

Not seeing where loyalty had anything to do with the acquisition of Joe as there was nothing for him to be loyal too. If I remember correctly, Joe bolted Phoenix in part because he felt disrespected by them offering a contract to Quentin Richardson before him and because Phoenix (and no other team) was going to match the amount of money the Hawks were going to pay him. He waited for the ownership situation to settle because if Belkin lost (which he did) he was going to get a huge pay day. If JJ was loyal to anything in that situation, it was the money.

[AHawks89]

Is it just me or does it seem like all the HUGE Joe Johnson fans are the ones saying we won't have a bright future ahead of us? Are they still upset? Or is it just a coincidence. Hmmm...

Edited October 16, 2012 by AHawks89

[HawkItus]

Is it just me or does it seem like all the HUGE Joe Johnson fans are the ones saying we won't have a bright future ahead of us? Are they still upset? Or is it just a coincidence. Hmmm...

Not true. Huge JJ fan and I think our future is bright. But, I do think we stopped short of making the complete change we needed. Josh should be traded as well.

[AHF]

Not true. Huge JJ fan and I think our future is bright. But, I do think we stopped short of making the complete change we needed. Josh should be traded as well.

There are still a lot of moving parts. I wouldn't consider that outside the realm of possibility for this season. I do think there are some legit concerns about our path as well, even though what we did was necessary. Can we attract top free agents and avoiding repeating with an upper middle of the pack team? How do we get that elite player? Is Ferry really a great personnel guy (don't count me as impressed with his Cleveland years)? Plenty of questions that only time will truly answer.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Is it just me or does it seem like all the HUGE Joe Johnson fans are the ones saying we won't have a bright future ahead of us? Are they still upset? Or is it just a coincidence.

Hmmm...

You may have a point. Or maybe the huge Joe Johnson fans see this going into next summer

Major free agents in 2013 that will be highly sought after next year

- Dwight Howard ( unrestricted )

- Chris Paul ( unrestricted )

- Andrew Bynum ( unrestricted )

- Josh Smith ( unrestricted )

- Al Jefferson ( unrestricted )

- Andre Iguodala ( early termination option )

- Monta Ellis ( early termination option )

- Stephen Curry ( restricted )

- Tyreke Evans ( restricted )

- Ty Lawson ( restricted )

- James Harden ( restricted )

- Brandon Jennings ( restricted )

The players in RED are guys that I see getting a MAX contract from somebody.

Hawks under contract in 2013

- Al Horford

- Lou Williams

- John Jenkins

Outside of the current team all of these players are on, here are the teams with "cap space" that the Hawks will be competing against:

- Charlotte

- Cleveland

- Dallas

- Detroit

- Houston

- Milwaukee

- Minnesota

- San Antonio

- Utah

If you're Danny Ferry, what is your sales pitch to entice 2 of these guys to come ( or stay in Josh Smith's case ) to Atlanta, and not stay with his current team, or go to one of the teams listed above?

Edited October 16, 2012 by northcyde

[macdaddy]

Not likely. Here's why.. Mediocrity is still the status quo... 1. Coach = Same. 2. Trade 6 time all star... Keep 3 pt shooting (29%) PF. 3. Make draft mistake in not getting Perry Jones. 4. In trade of 6 time allstar, you fail to get Marshon Brooks or a future first. 5. Don't address the C position. 6. Don't address the SF position. I mean, you picked up Korver, but is there a better way to say mediocrity than Korver? 7. You overaddressed PG with OGs. Danny Ferry didn't make San Antonio. Danny Ferry was invited and worked there. Danny Ferry didn't do anything great in Cleveland. Some blame him for the failure of Cleveland and the lost of Lebron. Players have always liked Atlanta for our weather, strip clubs, and cheap houses... but do they want to play here.... NOPE.

What are these talking points for the Ferry bashers? Most of this can't be evaluated yet and most of it are concerns only shared by a few folks here. Last I checked Cleveland won a boatload of games with Ferry's teams. Sure no title but Lebron just recently learned not to choke when it counted and I for one think Mike Brown is a terrible coach. Maybe that's Ferry's fault for not firing him but who knows. Plus are really calling Jenkins a draft mistake in pre-season when no one has done anything? Are we really believing that Ferry could have forced the Nets to trade Brooks? Please. Its easy to pull off great trades...on a message board. Much harder in real life. My Ferry statue is still in the front yard. We are undefeated in the regular season with his team.

[ATLscrubLove]

My mind is blown... :|

[Guest]

My mind is blown... :|

You and me both. I like how some are acting like the team we have now is what the team will be for years to come. Like we are stuck with all these players for the next 4 years. We now have options going forward. Wether it works out or not only time will tell.....enjoy the ride. Edited October 16, 2012 by JayBirdHawk

[BrazilianHawk]

Not true. Huge JJ fan and I think our future is bright. But, I do think we stopped short of making the complete change we needed. Josh should be traded as well.

Exactly my thoughts. I don't see DF building a real contender while having Josh as the go-to guy.