Official Optimistic Thread

[AHF]

I think you are overvaluing everyone outside of Horford, Millsap and Lou. And those three are not enough to earn a playoff berth. Let's tank.

I have been beating the tanking drum since we struck out on Dwight. Actually, I was banging the tanking drum for at least the last few weeks on the premise that we needed to go for Wiggins if we missed out on Paul/Dwight. Loudly banging that drum. It isn't the idea of dipping into the lottery that is a problem for me. It is a roster with Horford, Millsap, Korver, Lou, Jenkins, etc. being too good to give yourself high tanking odds and not good enough to be a contender. We seem squarely in the land of mediocrity this season.

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

we have a team full of boring mechanical players. No one is going to see Al shoot elbow hook shots or Milsap turn around jump shots. If y'all actually went to games yall would know that 75% of our fan base are Young working class and professional African Americans. We don't give a rats ass about fundamental basketball. You can't recreate the Spurs model of Euros and unathletic choir boys and expect them to draw. We will continue to have half filled arenas which will discourage free agents. Even if we draft well... which we never have and Ferry never has.... they will be on the first thing smoking when they become FA.

That should be the AAU's slogan...

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

Biggest thing for me is that Ferry is building this thing the right way. I know we are in for a long process and there will piles of "Fire Ferry Now" threads before this team is winning right and considered a contender but for the first time in a while, I believe in the Hawks. I have confidence in our FO. I like our coaching staff. The last thing to get right is the roster and that's the most noticeable part of an NBA organization. Owners, GM's, and coaches can't score points. Once the roster gets right, everyone will be onboard. Just a few blind, ignorant, impatient fans that like to rant and rave about not having All Stars on the roster and Ferry not making blockbuster news every day.

[AHF]

That should be the AAU's slogan...

Johnny was the guy who probably started more "sign Allen Iverson" threads than anyone else on this site. He likes some sizzle.

[benhillboy]

Can all this tanking talk stop? I don't understand all the intricacies of tanking, and don't really try to. I think it's only a remotely viable option if your owner is an egomaniac and he plans to gut his front office and coaching staff to accommodate said tanking prize. That's the opposite of what we're doing. The only thing we all agree on is that a championship under this regime is the ultimate goal. LeBron James is by far a more can't-miss prospect than Wiggins is or Duncan was. LeBron didn't win one for the team that tanked to get him in 7 years, while Duncan did off the bat. There are so many variables and extenuating circumstances around it that it just seems foolish to entertain it. Kobe was ultra-hyped when he came in, and was awful. You telling me anybody forsaw how great he would become? Jerry West is lying if he said he did. Everybody is wired totally different. I would never place such lofty expectations on a kid. What about Greg Oden? He was pegged as a Baby Bill Russell. I guarantee you Bud ain't gonna shoot himself in the foot before he gets his HC feet wet for one unproven player with endless possibilities on both sides of the spectrum. 13 men deep, people. Let Ferry build a solid team that will last longer than the sub 5-year window that y'all want from a All-NBA Free Agent acquisition or highly uncertain window of a child and some ping pong balls.

Edited July 12, 2013 by benhillboy

[NBASupes]

Wiggins can be a better prime T-Mac. Parker could be a better defensive minded Carmelo A. A lot of these guys have franchise player talent. As well all know, that's not enough but damnit, we have none of that on this team aside from Horford.

[Buzzard]

I like what I see so far and agree 100% that Horford, Millsap, Lou, and Korver is way to good a core to tank. God forbid Jenkins, Scott, Muscala, and Schröder come on strong, that would be horrible. Four of our recent draft picks playing well, just the thought makes me want to bring BK back so we can tank and suck the right way ( sarcasm here as I do like our rebuilding process so far ).

[RWF]

we have a team full of boring mechanical players. No one is going to see Al shoot elbow hook shots or Milsap turn around jump shots. If y'all actually went to games yall would know that 75% of our fan base are Young working class and professional African Americans. We don't give a rats ass about fundamental basketball. You can't recreate the Spurs model of Euros and unathletic choir boys and expect them to draw. We will continue to have half filled arenas which will discourage free agents. Even if we draft well... which we never have and Ferry never has.... they will be on the first thing smoking when they become FA.

Finally the real reason some of you all dislike Ferry's moves so far. "We want our Josh Smith back! He draws fans to the arena......I think!".

So fans don't want to go see basketball the way it should be played and actual success? They want to go see low IQ players throwing up brick after brick with a headband on instead? You got to have style when you can't make a shot.

Edited July 12, 2013 by RWF

[TheFuzz]

we have a team full of boring mechanical players. No one is going to see Al shoot elbow hook shots or Milsap turn around jump shots. If y'all actually went to games yall would know that 75% of our fan base are Young working class and professional African Americans. We don't give a rats ass about fundamental basketball. You can't recreate the Spurs model of Euros and unathletic choir boys and expect them to draw. We will continue to have half filled arenas which will discourage free agents. Even if we draft well... which we never have and Ferry never has.... they will be on the first thing smoking when they become FA.

The Spurs DO play exciting basketball. The "boring" myth stems from their earlier years. We'll be playing a fast-paced game with a lot of threes, passing and wide-open dunks and layups around the basket.

[TheFuzz]

I have been beating the tanking drum since we struck out on Dwight. Actually, I was banging the tanking drum for at least the last few weeks on the premise that we needed to go for Wiggins if we missed out on Paul/Dwight. Loudly banging that drum. It isn't the idea of dipping into the lottery that is a problem for me. It is a roster with Horford, Millsap, Korver, Lou, Jenkins, etc. being too good to give yourself high tanking odds and not good enough to be a contender. We seem squarely in the land of mediocrity this season.

I think we'll have a better idea at the deadline. The middle of the pack is much more crowded now in the East. I suspect we'll have some "injuries" and ship off some assets at the deadline for picks.

[Admin]

we have a team full of boring mechanical players. No one is going to see Al shoot elbow hook shots or Milsap turn around jump shots. If y'all actually went to games yall would know that 75% of our fan base are Young working class and professional African Americans. We don't give a rats ass about fundamental basketball. You can't recreate the Spurs model of Euros and unathletic choir boys and expect them to draw. We will continue to have half filled arenas which will discourage free agents. Even if we draft well... which we never have and Ferry never has.... they will be on the first thing smoking when they become FA.

Wow really? You're going to throw an entire group of people under the bus and say they only like 1 type of basketball? I know a lot of African Americans who would strongly disagree with you about them not caring about fundamental basketball.

[Admin]

The Spurs DO play exciting basketball. The "boring" myth stems from their earlier years. We'll be playing a fast-paced game with a lot of threes, passing and wide-open dunks and layups around the basket.

Yeah I'm pretty sure it was mentioned many times during the playoffs this year by announcers that people who still have that old thought about the Spurs being boring haven't watched them play.

[RWF]

Also to add Dennis Schröder looks more athletic than Teague, so that opinion gets thrown out the window right there. Just because Horford and Millsap has more b-ball IQ than previous Hawks players make them "boring"?

I agree that the Spurs are not boring at all. The Heat IMO is the most boring team for me to watch really if we want to go there, and it has everyone's favorite "superstar" on the team.

[Seano]

Also to add Dennis Schröder looks more athletic than Teague, so that opinion gets thrown out the window right there. Just because Horford and Millsap has more b-ball IQ than previous Hawks players make them "boring"?

I agree that the Spurs are not boring at all. The Heat IMO is the most boring team for me to watch really if we want to go there, and it has everyone's favorite "superstar" on the team.

Also to add Dennis Schröder looks more athletic than Teague, so that opinion gets thrown out the window right there. Just because Horford and Millsap has more b-ball IQ than previous Hawks players make them "boring"?

I agree that the Spurs are not boring at all. The Heat IMO is the most boring team for me to watch really if we want to go there, and it has everyone's favorite "superstar" on the team.

Well, the concept of 'boring' of course is an entirely subjective thing, as shown by the fact that while you might find the Miami Heat to be boring to watch, I sure as heck don't. I mean I love to watch a team with two surefire first-ballot Hall of Famers in their prime (along with a highly, highly capable third sidekick), all this made even more spicy and interesting by the fact that they're in our division, and so on top of everything else, I've just got endless reasons to root against them, and those factors for me = a most compelling watch.

And there are those who think the Spurs are boring, while I see a team so fundamentally solid and sound and so completely committed to being so on both ends of the the court, well, I just see in that a style of play that is an absolute joy to watch, and who can argue with the winning, as style aside, can winning ever truly get boring?

Anyhow, back to the topic of the thread, I am optimistic about the Hawks, as I always am going into every season. Hell, if I didn't feel optimism and a sense of hope each and every year, then I'd go follow professional lawn-darts or tiddlywinks or whatever the case might be. If I ever gave in to a sense of hopelessness and despair regarding this team or any other, well than I simply wouldn't bother anymore, as life is far too short.

There is always hope. Until you are dead and fricken buried in the ground, hope lives.

[NBASupes]

Jeff Teague is an extremely boring player to watch when he isn't doing a highlight reel play like Josh Smith is extremely frustrating when he isn't doing a highlight reel play.

Teague is more athletic than Schröder. Schröder is just a much better PG in terms of PG skills even if Teague is likely a better player right now. Schröder just has this extremely high BBIQ and really understands the game well as a PG. I said it in the Hoops Summit thread, he is a mix of Rajon Rondo and a right handed Mike Conley. I like the Conley comparisons more than the Rondo comparisons. Rondo comparison due to his BBIQ, defense approach to the game and they have similar size at the same age. The Conley comparisons because that's who he plays like. His great PnR's. His understanding of how to use his speed and quickness which is top notch. His great pro handles. His ability to score. I love Conley who I think is one of the best players NOT just PG's but players in the NBA.

[ATLSmith]

The reality is if you moved Phillips to a suburb the attendance would be much better. Nobody wants to go into the city on a weekday and only around 700k actually live in the city. Without a solid public transportation system and with the interstate being a nightmare for most people it's not hard to see why fans don't come even when we're winning.

My main point is people that live in the ATL are usually fashion concerned spoiled kids who would rather be seen out at the club than doing anything else. Move the arena to Gwinnett and watch the attendance skyrocket

I agree with some of this. I actually like going into the city for the games but weekday games can be pain with traffic. I think they are hoping that the massive transportation terminal they are building will help some of this and make it more accessable. A revitalization of west Atlanta and the new Falcons stadium will help too. Lots of new infra-structuring going up in that area.... I'll probably still drive to the games though... lol.

So, back on topic. Yea, I'm optimistic about the team. I can't help it. I just wish that we could have gotten some future picks for Smoove (and Teague if we don't sign him). I would have taken some 2nd round picks that we could use to move up or something.... anything.

If you can't hold out some hope that things will turn around then you might as well just save yourself the trouble and stop following sports. Part of the fun is watching the highs and the lows.

Edited July 12, 2013 by ATLSmith

[hazer]

we have a team full of boring mechanical players. No one is going to see Al shoot elbow hook shots or Milsap turn around jump shots. If y'all actually went to games yall would know that 75% of our fan base are Young working class and professional African Americans. We don't give a rats ass about fundamental basketball. You can't recreate the Spurs model of Euros and unathletic choir boys and expect them to draw. We will continue to have half filled arenas which will discourage free agents. Even if we draft well... which we never have and Ferry never has.... they will be on the first thing smoking when they become FA.

Huh? What games are you going to? That's not the demographic I see at all at the games I attend. Maybe I just coincidentally go to all the 50/50 games. Or maybe I just don't look for and/or notice such as that because that's not my mindset. Weird...

[hazer]

The reality is if you moved Phillips to a suburb the attendance would be much better. Nobody wants to go into the city on a weekday and only around 700k actually live in the city. Without a solid public transportation system and with the interstate being a nightmare for most people it's not hard to see why fans don't come even when we're winning.

My main point is people that live in the ATL are usually fashion concerned spoiled kids who would rather be seen out at the club than doing anything else. Move the arena to Gwinnett and watch the attendance skyrocket

True. When I lived up in Alpharetta, went to Gwinnett Arena at least a dozen times a year. Was only 10-15 minutes down State Bridge Road from me. Attendance would definitely shoot up out there. I moved into the city to EAV in 2010, Phillips is only 10-15 minutes away. Catch a lot of Hawks games, but not a lot of the "hipsters" who live in these surrounding in-town hoods attend.

[macdaddy]

I like exciting wing players and I think Korver, Lou, and hopefully Jenkins fit that bill despite not being high flyers.

I'm not as big on exciting rebounders. I prefer the old fashioned, fundamental rebounders who actually end up with the ball rather than try to throw a one handed jam off the iron.

[macdaddy]

I know this isn't the big leagues but I disagree with the Gwinnett theory:

http://thesportseconomist.com/2011/09/02/the-honeymoon-is-already-over-in-gwinnett/