2016-2017 Hawks

[Diesel]

 

Already looking ahead.

What about this offseason:  Sign: Horf, Joe, Baze.  Draft: Taureen Prince.

Keep everything else the same until Dec.

 

 

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, Diesel said:

 

Already looking ahead.

What about this offseason:  Sign: Horf, Joe, Baze.  Draft: Taureen Prince.

Keep everything else the same until Dec.

 

 

I still would trade Jeff if the value is there but if it ain't, sit on the roster.

[Diesel]

Just now, NBASupes said:

I still would trade Jeff if the value is there but if it ain't, sit on the roster.

I don't think that we trade Jeff until something knocks our socks off.  Moreover, the throne is not reserved for Dennis either.  

[NBASupes]

Just now, Diesel said:

I don't think that we trade Jeff until something knocks our socks off.  Moreover, the throne is not reserved for Dennis either.  

We completely disagree on Dennis but that's the usual. It's odd we are agreeing with each other. 

[Diesel]

1 minute ago, NBASupes said:

We completely disagree on Dennis but that's the usual. It's odd we are agreeing with each other. 

I was disappointed to see how Mack's season went being that he showed a lot more in the playoffs than Dennis.  I honestly thought they were showing Dennis off as part of a trade.   However, he can run high pick and roll.. most PGs can but his ball pounding may be something for those of you who like Iso ball but I have bought into Budball and I don't see the fit.   Moreover, I don't see him progressing in budball, I see budball regressing back to an Iso game with him at the helm.

If Teague can't be more Tony Parker like then he may not be the answer either.. However, he's more Parkerlike than Dennis wants to be.

 

 

[kurupt]

I seriously wonder what Schröder has done to you, Diesel. It is hard enough to follow your criticism at all, but insinuating that Mack got shafted by Dennis being ahead of him? Are you serious?

Mack is already 25 years old, is a worse shooter than Dennis across the board (FG%, 3pt%, FT%, TS%, you name it), is a worse rebounder, has a much lower AST% etc. The only thing he does better is protecting the ball, which may very well be the case bcause he doesn't risk anything either. I wish him all the best, but if you think there was any doubt who was the 6th/7th man and BU PG of this team after last season, wow...

Same for Teague. You don't seem to realize that he, like Mack, is likely as good as he ever will be, while Schröder will improve over the next 2-3 years (at least). The only question is by how much. And you could argue that his oveall package (especially considering his defense) has reached Teagues level already this season - 5 years earlier.

So if you think about having to pay 28-33 year old Teague 12+ millions (or more) per year or get 23-28 year old Schröder for propably around 6-10 millions a year (depending on how he finishes this season), what would your answer be?

Edited February 26, 2016 by kurupt

[RedDawg#8]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

I was disappointed to see how Mack's season went being that he showed a lot more in the playoffs than Dennis.  I honestly thought they were showing Dennis off as part of a trade.   However, he can run high pick and roll.. most PGs can but his ball pounding may be something for those of you who like Iso ball but I have bought into Budball and I don't see the fit.   Moreover, I don't see him progressing in budball, I see budball regressing back to an Iso game with him at the helm.

If Teague can't be more Tony Parker like then he may not be the answer either.. However, he's more Parkerlike than Dennis wants to be.

 

 

Its not Iso Ball, its called PG play. I get that we haven't seen true point guard play in an Atlanta uniform since the new millineum but if there is one player on the floor that you DO want controlling the ball its the freaking Point Guard. Budball is just that, BUD BALL, if he didn't think Dennis was running it then he wouldn't be playing and Mack would still be here. Moreover, Dennis is almost averaging the same number of assists (4.7) as Teague (5.5) coming off the bench so he isn't anymore selfish than Jeffy, and one could argue that Dennis makes more happen for his teammates with the ball in hands. And heres why.

You conceded that he can run the high pick and roll which he does very well. People forget that the very 1st option of the pick and roll is to spring an open driving lane for the ball handler. Both Teague and Dennis are blazing fast, but only Dennis consistently utilizes this speed coming off of a screen, Dennis blows by the help defender and gets in to the paint where he has an amazing abilty to finish, but yes he can still get better at forcing and absorbing the contact and getting to the foul line. The point is, the  pick and roll doesn't work if there is no threat of the ballhandler driving the lane. That threat then opens up the roll or pop shot (hehe) for the screener, and because Al is such a threat to shoot he usually gets a good look to drive and finish above the rim. This is all a result of aggressive play by the PG. Now, maybe you prefer Jeff who runs the same pick and roll but instead of getting anything going to the rim for himself or the screener it results in him or Al shooting a three pointer or him just giving up the ball to Baze or Korver who have no business trying to create offense. So, while you criticize him for being selfish, understand that Dennis controlling the ball on a team full of guys who cant dribble in the half court is the best thing for the team. His drives are shots at the rim, something we sorely lack, but they also open up shots for everybody else. Spacing doesn't work if the defense never has to collapse on penetration 1st.

Also, Pick and roll is not Iso ball either, its the most effective play in the history of basketball, and our franchise hasn't been good at it in ages. But if you are referring instead to the clear outs when he gets switched on to a slower player, well sir you should criticize Jeff too because that's one of his favorite plays. Its also the right play when you are the fastest guy on the court. 

Yes Dennis still makes his share of mistakes, HEs young, he is supposed too. But you can not deny his ability on the floor. His potential at 22 is FAR greater than Teague at 27. And his natural instinct to attack is not a negative trait. Its better than having to force a guy who has been playing ball his whole to actually play hard night in and night out.

Edited February 26, 2016 by RedDawg#8

[mtnbayou]

Dennis

Hield

Batum

Millsap

Horford 

[BigDog90]

8 hours ago, Diesel said:

 

Already looking ahead.

What about this offseason:  Sign: Horf, Joe, Baze.  Draft: Taureen Prince.

Keep everything else the same until Dec.

 

 

Second maybe 1st round team.

[Diesel]

11 hours ago, kurupt said:

I seriously wonder what Schröder has done to you, Diesel. It is hard enough to follow your criticism at all, but insinuating that Mack got shafted by Dennis being ahead of him? Are you serious?

Mack is already 25 years old, is a worse shooter than Dennis across the board (FG%, 3pt%, FT%, TS%, you name it), is a worse rebounder, has a much lower AST% etc. The only thing he does better is protecting the ball, which may very well be the case bcause he doesn't risk anything either. I wish him all the best, but if you think there was any doubt who was the 6th/7th man and BU PG of this team after last season, wow...

Same for Teague. You don't seem to realize that he, like Mack, is likely as good as he ever will be, while Schröder will improve over the next 2-3 years (at least). The only question is by how much. And you could argue that his oveall package (especially considering his defense) has reached Teagues level already this season - 5 years earlier.

So if you think about having to pay 28-33 year old Teague 12+ millions (or more) per year or get 23-28 year old Schröder for propably around 6-10 millions a year (depending on how he finishes this season), what would your answer be?

Let's just wait to the playoffs.   Again, in the playoffs, watch how Dennis plays when the bright lights are on him.   Last year, Dennis almost lost it for us to Brooklyn.   Mack came in and played steady enough to watch us go to the ECF.  I have never doubted Dennis' skills.   I think he's a skilled guard, I just don't think he's the fit that our offense needs.   People say... wait for him to mature.   OK... Let's take the Marvin approach Again.  My point is he shows us over and over again that he will be what you want for a short time but when given the power, he will go back to what he wants to be.. IsoSchro.

[Lurker]

2 hours ago, Diesel said:

Let's just wait to the playoffs.   Again, in the playoffs, watch how Dennis plays when the bright lights are on him.   Last year, Dennis almost lost it for us to Brooklyn.   Mack came in and played steady enough to watch us go to the ECF.  I have never doubted Dennis' skills.   I think he's a skilled guard, I just don't think he's the fit that our offense needs.   People say... wait for him to mature.   OK... Let's take the Marvin approach Again.  My point is he shows us over and over again that he will be what you want for a short time but when given the power, he will go back to what he wants to be.. IsoSchro.

You're completely misremembering everything. Mack never played a key backup role in any early round that pushed the team to the ecf. In fact, what did so it was playing the starters almost the whole game in game 5. If Mack is the PG backup vs Brooklyn, odds are VERY VERY good the team gets upset vs them. His offensive analytics for the playoffs were flat out terrible.

 

The whole bench was. Mike Scott was terrible when he played, Bazemore had trouble getting going at first, Antić was only decent in round 1, and we know the PG situation, it would have been EXACTLY the same with Mack getting the mins, PERIOD.

[Hawkmoor]

keep Horford, Sap, Teague, Dennis, Scott, Moose, THJ, Patterson, Thabo, Tavares, Heinrich

sign Joe, Howard, lottery pick small forward ( if they fall into lottery),, trade Teague or Dennis for value at small forward if they dont fall into lottery.

bounce Korver, Baze, Splitter, 

Im running a big lineup until the Hawks can develop the lottery pick or trade Teague or Dennis.

teague

johnson

Milsap

Horford

Howard

Edited February 26, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[Lurker]

Millsap is too slow to guard most SFs lmao. That lineup is never happening.

[macdaddy]

I love Teague but we need to trade him to get some much needed help at other positions.   Although if Dennis can bring more we could do that too but one of them will have to go unless we can figure a way to add a wing and a big without trading them.    Splitter needs to go but i don't know how.    If we can keep Horford and bring in Mozgov or Mahimi for the bench that would be awesome.    If we could get Derozan, Durant, or Beal that would be a dream.    

 

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I love Teague but we need to trade him to get some much needed help at other positions.   Although if Dennis can bring more we could do that too but one of them will have to go unless we can figure a way to add a wing and a big without trading them.    Splitter needs to go but i don't know how.    If we can keep Horford and bring in Mozgov or Mahimi for the bench that would be awesome.    If we could get Derozan, Durant, or Beal that would be a dream.    

 

It's weird a couple of years ago I didn't want Derozan, now I'd love to have him on the Hawks.

[Hawkmoor]

57 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Millsap is too slow to guard most SFs lmao. That lineup is never happening.

True, but other small forwards are too small to guard Sap.  It works both ways.  Only a few teams have the PERFECT lineup.  Hawks have to do what they can do.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Hawkmoor

[Hawkmoor]

18 hours ago, Diesel said:

 

Already looking ahead.

What about this offseason:  Sign: Horf, Joe, Baze.  Draft: Taureen Prince.

Keep everything else the same until Dec.

 

 

Thats a good look on Taureen Prince. I looked him up. Game is VERY similar to DMC, with appears to be more upside because he can post up. Good look.  Currently projected to go around number 28. I would take that pick at that spot.

 

Edited February 26, 2016 by Hawkmoor