The Tank Thread

[Lurker]

Someone tell me, what are the stats of the teams that were in the 5-8 slot but won the finals, on teams that didn't have Hakeem?

[hazer]

27 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Someone tell me, what are the stats of the teams that were in the 5-8 slot but won the finals, on teams that didn't have Hakeem?

 

[AHF]

5 hours ago, KB21 said:

Only 1 team wins a championship in a given year, and to do that, you have to actually be a playoff team.

That is true but being a playoff team is not a meaningful criteria for identifying championship level teams.  You need to be able to win games past the first and second rounds.  You need that MVP talent.  Being the Memphis Grizzlies doesn't give you meaningfully better odds of winning a championship than the Hawks have this year.  

[KB21]

13 minutes ago, AHF said:

That is true but being a playoff team is not a meaningful criteria for identifying championship level teams.  You need to be able to win games past the first and second rounds.  You need that MVP talent.  Being the Memphis Grizzlies doesn't give you meaningfully better odds of winning a championship than the Hawks have this year.  

How does it not?  It defies logic to even suggest that a team in the lottery has a better chance of winning a championship than a playoff team.

[Diesel]

On 11/19/2017 at 7:06 PM, noble said:

You can have a winning culture and not get free agents to get you over the hump to be a championship contender too. I think we all know a team like that.

If you can't get free agents, then you don't have a winning culture.  You're just a team that wins games. 

Winning Cultures attract free agents. 

[Diesel]

23 hours ago, MaceCase said:

Curious.  So 15 games into a season is enough to solidify a losing culture but 10 years in the playoffs....did what exactly?

Probably moved us 10 years back... like it did last time. 

[Diesel]

8 hours ago, Sothron said:

If only could you trade in token playoff appearances for one actual title. Like 10 playoff trips = one title. It works in games. Trade in copper and silver for gold. Why not the NBA? Maybe then the pursuit of playoff mediocrity would have ANY F'ING MEANING WHATSOEVER.

You have to crawl and walk before you run.   Too many Hawks fans want to go from a crawl to a sprint. 

[MaceCase]

6 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Probably moved us 10 years back... like it did last time. 

Which answers the question.  Just making the playoffs doesn't establish a "winning culture" if that can so easily be undone by a bad season....so what exactly is the argument claiming it as the far superior option to rebuilding?

[hazer]

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

You have to crawl and walk before you run.   Too many Hawks fans want to go from a crawl to a sprint. 

Hawks have been lightly jogging in the rear middle of the pack for a decade...

[Diesel]

6 hours ago, Lurker said:

Someone tell me, what are the stats of the teams that were in the 5-8 slot but won the finals, on teams that didn't have Hakeem?

In 2014, when we were in the 8th spot losing to Indy in the first round, That same year, GS was losing to the Clipps in the first round of the playoffs.   The difference...  A culture of winning. 

[Diesel]

8 minutes ago, MaceCase said:

Which answers the question.  Just making the playoffs doesn't establish a "winning culture" if that can so easily be undone by a bad season....so what exactly is the argument claiming it as the far superior option to rebuilding?

Winning games and winning culture are two different things.   Winning games are born out of a winning culture but just because you win games don't mean that you have a winning culture. 

Moreover, You don't get a winning culture by having a firesale.  A firesale is a sure fire way to began a losing culture.   Show me a team that has had a firesale and have won a championship.

[Lurker]

4 minutes ago, Diesel said:

In 2014, when we were in the 8th spot losing to Indy in the first round, That same year, GS was losing to the Clipps in the first round of the playoffs.   The difference...  A culture of winning. 

The difference....Stephen Curry being a transcendent shooting talent...

We could have kept that team, and it would have progressed to...no where in particular. 

[Diesel]

4 minutes ago, Lurker said:

The difference....Stephen Curry being a transcendent shooting talent...

We could have kept that team, and it would have progressed to...no where in particular. 

No no my friend... Steph, Klay, Draymond, Harrison, and Iguodala were on that team that lost to the Clipps.   Steph led them in scoring.  The Culture wasn't a winning culture. 

[Peoriabird]

I just don't understand how certain posters can watch this team play and see Philadelphia of 5 years ago.  Dennis and Dedmon are already pretty good...Collins and Princes are potential stars.

[Lurker]

7 minutes ago, Diesel said:

No no my friend... Steph, Klay, Draymond, Harrison, and Iguodala were on that team that lost to the Clipps.   Steph led them in scoring.  The Culture wasn't a winning culture. 

I'm not your friend. 

[MaceCase]

25 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Winning games and winning culture are two different things.   Winning games are born out of a winning culture but just because you win games don't mean that you have a winning culture. 

Moreover, You don't get a winning culture by having a firesale.  A firesale is a sure fire way to began a losing culture.   Show me a team that has had a firesale and have won a championship.

So let me get this straight:

 

Winning games =/= Winning culture

                      but

Losing games = Losing culture

 

Oh that makes PERFECT sense.

[Lurker]

It makes about as much sense as the other poster:

38-44, missed playoffs: "They suck! They'll never break through because they didn't make the playoffs!"
38-44, made playoffs: "They're doing it the right way! They'll be very good soon because they battled it out and made the playoffs!"

[noble]

1 hour ago, Diesel said:

If you can't get free agents, then you don't have a winning culture.  You're just a team that wins games. 

Winning Cultures attract free agents. 

Exactly, so we didn't have a winning culture when we made the playoffs the last ten years? So what is the difference if we try a rebuild vs the path we were on?

[jy23]

Why are we even arguing this? 

[Sothron]

You guys know neither Diesel or KB21 will ever admit they were wrong about anything. I mean, if you like tilting at windmills than I'll be  your Sancho Panza but as your Sancho I feel it necessary to point out those ARE windmills you are tilting at.