The Tank Thread

[KB21]

18 minutes ago, GThawks3 said:

Yes, when we’ve been to the playoffs 10 straight years and never even sniffed the finals, it’s time to try a different route. 

So that different route is committing to losing for several years just to see what happens?

[MaceCase]

 

[GThawks3]

1 hour ago, KB21 said:

So that different route is committing to losing for several years just to see what happens?

Not several years but I would say this year and next year. So in reality 2 years and hope the management picks the right guys at the top of the draft. Risky? Yes but worth it. 

[marco102]

I think the Hawks are trying to get a few great players in the draft (and additional picks) in the next few years and then go after Greak Freak in free agency.  

[KB21]

4 minutes ago, marco102 said:

I think the Hawks are trying to get a few great players in the draft (and additional picks) in the next few years and then go after Greak Freak in free agency.  

[Plainview1981]

3 hours ago, GThawks3 said:

Yes, when we’ve been to the playoffs 10 straight years and never even sniffed the finals, it’s time to try a different route. 

The 60 win season has already became a footnote because nothing in the playoffs was really accomplished. 

[KB21]

1 minute ago, Plainview1981 said:

The 60 win season has already became a footnote because nothing in the playoffs was really accomplished. 

No matter how bad you want to, you cannot erase the fact that the team DID in fact win 60 games and DID IN FACT player for the Eastern Conference Finals.  

[Plainview1981]

1 minute ago, KB21 said:

No matter how bad you want to, you cannot erase the fact that the team DID in fact win 60 games and DID IN FACT player for the Eastern Conference Finals.  

They also got swept by Lebron and role players and that pretty much invalidated the season. I mean, Love and Irving are out and you can't get one damn game? Not one??

Teams that don't have playoff success aren't going to be respected.

Edited April 12, 2018 by Plainview1981

[KB21]

1 minute ago, Plainview1981 said:

They also got swept by Lebron and role players and that pretty much invalidated the season. I mean, Love and Irving are out and you can't get one damn game? Not one??

Teams that don't have playoff success aren't going to be respected.

The team played for the Eastern Conference finals.  That is playoff success.  Nothing was invalidated by losing to Cleveland and the refs.  

[Plainview1981]

1 minute ago, KB21 said:

The team played for the Eastern Conference finals.  That is playoff success.  Nothing was invalidated by losing to Cleveland and the refs.  

They were a pushover when they played the team that mattered.

It's sort of like that year Dallas nearly won 70 games, but lost in the first round... I couldn't remember the year until I looked it up. Nobody cares about that team now even though they won 67 games. Because they bombed. Obviously the Hawks playoff run during the 60 win season wasn't as big of a failure as the Mavs had that year, but you get the idea. If you don't show yourself to be a the real deal in the playoffs people will start to forget the rest of it. The Hawks were lucky to get past Washington in that series due to Wall having an injured hand  I'm not going to spend too long crapping on that season. It was a fun ride while it lasted, but it mostly ended like all the others.

Either way, it's water under the bridge and the team has went with the youth movement now.

[KB21]

7 minutes ago, Plainview1981 said:

They were a pushover when they played the team that mattered.

It's sort of like that year Dallas nearly won 70 games, but lost in the first round... I couldn't remember the year until I looked it up. Nobody cares about that team now even though they won 67 games. Because they bombed. Obviously the Hawks playoff run during the 60 win season wasn't as big of a failure as the Mavs had that year, but you get the idea. If you don't show yourself to be a the real deal in the playoffs people will start to forget the rest of it. The Hawks were lucky to get past Washington in that series due to Wall having an injured hand  I'm not going to spend too long crapping on that season. It was a fun ride while it lasted, but it mostly ended like all the others.

Either way, it's water under the bridge and the team has went with the youth movement now.

This was a playoff caliber team that has committed itself to losing for the foreseeable future.

[AHF]

12 minutes ago, KB21 said:

This was a playoff caliber team that has committed itself to losing for the foreseeable future.

Last year's team easily could have missed the playoffs with their negative point differential.  They were lucky.  If the Hawks this offseason resign THJr and Sap then they are paying the tax for what is a borderline playoff team.  If they pass on THJr and sign Sap they aren't making the playoffs with Sap's injury and 0.7 BPM, 0.8 VORP season (Ilya had more WS this season and WS/48 Sap = Tyler Cavanaugh...sooo bad year for Sap when he was playing).  We'd be in the lottery no matter what this season.

[KB21]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

Last year's team easily could have missed the playoffs with their negative point differential.  They were lucky.  If the Hawks this offseason resign THJr and Sap then they are paying the tax for what is a borderline playoff team.  If they pass on THJr and sign Sap they aren't making the playoffs with Sap's injury and 0.7 BPM, 0.8 VORP season (Ilya had more WS this season and WS/48 Sap = Tyler Cavanaugh...sooo bad year for Sap when he was playing).  We'd be in the lottery no matter what this season.

If they missed the playoffs because of Sap's injury, then at least they attempted to be competitive and do good things.  Instead, what they did was field a G-League team with the intent to lose.

[AHF]

Just now, KB21 said:

If they missed the playoffs because of Sap's injury, then at least they attempted to be competitive and do good things.  Instead, what they did was field a G-League team with the intent to lose.

I understand you think every team should try to max out their wins every season.  For me, that team had given their best shot and was just getting swiftly more expensive with no path to contending and so I was totally fine that ownership decided to cut bait.  I know you think that having the #5 best record in the entire NBA with your core all 23 and younger is not doing well when you built your team through losing seasons in the lottery so there is no result for you that justifies not trying to maximize your wins every year. Agree to disagree there.  

[Peoriabird]

Kinda done with tanking...Just seems like The Hawks are destine to compete the hard way without a superstar player!  This team just can catch a break.  I don't want to sound like a Debbie downer but maybe @KB21 is right for the wrong reasons.  The Ping pong balls are just not going to go our way ever.  The one time it did, we drafted Marvin Williams and the other 2 times we got at least the 3rd pick we traded Pau Gasol and drafted Horford who is a nice player but not that Superstar. 

So from hence forward, I am against tanking!  Even if we get the #1 pick in this year's draft and especially if we are outside the top 3 or 4 picks in the lottery.  At some point you are what you are and the Hawk's ceiling is being a good team not a championship contender. You need a few breaks to go your way to get to that next level and those thing just don't happen to the Hawks.

Hopefully I'm wrong.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

29 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Kinda done with tanking...Just seems like The Hawks are destine to compete the hard way without a superstar player!  This team just can catch a break.  I don't want to sound like a Debbie downer but maybe @KB21 is right for the wrong reasons.  The Ping pong balls are just not going to go our way ever.  The one time it did, we drafted Marvin Williams and the other 2 times we got at least the 3rd pick we traded Pau Gasol and drafted Horford who is a nice player but not that Superstar. 

So from hence forward, I am against tanking!  Even if we get the #1 pick in this year's draft and especially if we are outside the top 3 or 4 picks in the lottery.  At some point you are what you are and the Hawk's ceiling is being a good team not a championship contender. You need a few breaks to go your way to get to that next level and those thing just don't happen to the Hawks.

Hopefully I'm wrong.

[Plainview1981]

40 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Kinda done with tanking...Just seems like The Hawks are destine to compete the hard way without a superstar player!  This team just can catch a break.  I don't want to sound like a Debbie downer but maybe @KB21 is right for the wrong reasons.  The Ping pong balls are just not going to go our way ever.  The one time it did, we drafted Marvin Williams and the other 2 times we got at least the 3rd pick we traded Pau Gasol and drafted Horford who is a nice player but not that Superstar. 

So from hence forward, I am against tanking!  Even if we get the #1 pick in this year's draft and especially if we are outside the top 3 or 4 picks in the lottery.  At some point you are what you are and the Hawk's ceiling is being a good team not a championship contender. You need a few breaks to go your way to get to that next level and those thing just don't happen to the Hawks.

Hopefully I'm wrong.

The one "positive" is that is that it looks to me like the days of the Lebron's and Jordan's are coming to an end... There are fewer and fewer of those players that give a team a punchers chance of winning the title. That superstar that can carry a team appears to be becoming a thing of the past.\

A typical Hawks playoff team would stand a better chance in a post MJ/Kobe/Lebron era.

Edited April 14, 2018 by Plainview1981

[Peoriabird]

3 minutes ago, Plainview1981 said:

The one "positive" is that is that it looks to me like the days of the Lebron's and Jordan's are coming to an end... There are fewer and fewer of those players that give a team a punchers chance of winning the title. That superstar that can carry a team appears to be becoming a thing of the past.

You're probably right which makes tanking obsolete!

[Plainview1981]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

You're probably right which makes tanking obsolete!

The GM probably could have went for more of a retooling (You can't pay Sap what Denver is paying him and Howard needed to go) , game plan, but it is what it is. Changing coaches now probably means a worse record last year. More young players, less experienced vets that help you win extra games and a new coach possibly will lead to a below 20 win season next  year.                                                                                            

[deester11]

6 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

You're probably right which makes tanking obsolete!

Lmbo....sorry to see you go.  I'm in the camp that you can't change the direction so hope great drafting and pray for good FA decisions, otherwise whine about it.  The direction is set.  Nothing we can do about it..and I hate losing but I'm ready to get some direction that the team will go in.  Not seeing the doom...but there is gloom...