Do You Hear What I Hear?

[Sothron]

I have to say Bamba has been growing on me. I think he and Collins could work very well together.

[hazer]

14 minutes ago, Sothron said:

I have to say Bamba has been growing on me. I think he and Collins could work very well together.

My favorites are Bagley, Bamba, and Young. For sheer star potential.

[Spud2nique]

37 minutes ago, hazer said:

My favorites are Bagley, Bamba, and Young. For sheer star potential.

Add Porter-channeling my inner @kg01..

In order..

Assuming Ayton and Doncic are gone..

 

1. Bagley

2. Bamba

3. Young

4. Porter

[Spud2nique]

55 minutes ago, Sothron said:

I have to say Bamba has been growing on me. I think he and Collins could work very well together.

Soth you love centers huh..

 

KAT

Jokic

Bamba

i believe Horford as well.. ?

You

likey the

big boys eh ?

[thecampster]

 

2 hours ago, hazer said:

My favorites are Bagley, Bamba, and Young. For sheer star potential.

One of the problems with evaluating college talent every year is the best talent leaves yearly.  The new crop of freshman are being compared to people who are/were inferior and that is why they are still there.  Bagley isn't playing against Collins because Collins went pro last year. "Potential" is the right word because we really don't know who will pan out.  History tells us that 3 of the top 10 players taken this year will never be reliable NBA rotational players.  Consider Jimmy Fredette. In his 5 year NBA career, he had averages of 6, 1, 1.4.  He was taken 10th overall.

Consider these players, all taken in the top 10 the last 4 years.

Noah Vonleh, Dante Exum, Mario Hezonja, Justise Winslow, Dragan Bender, Marquese Chriss, Jakob Poltl, Thon Maker, Markelle Fultz, Frank Ntilikina, Zach Collins.  

What do they all have in common?  None have average 10 ppg in a season yet. A few still have potential but all were taken in the top 10 and none as of yet are "stars".  I would argue that maybe only Ntilikina and Fultz have showed that potential yet.

[kg01]

5 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

Add Porter-channeling my inner @kg01..

In order..

Assuming Ayton and Doncic are gone..

 

1. Bagley

2. Bamba

3. Young

4. Porter

We're like 2 ships passing in the night since Porter and I seem to be growing apart.  I'm sorry (not sorry), Michael 

The kg-brand list is as follows:

1. #ParaBailarLaBamba

2. #Ayton2A_Town

.

.

3. #TheMPorter_Jr

4. #BaDonkaDoncic

5.  #TYoung&TheRestless

[Buzzard]

Next weeks workouts will determine if we are willing to slide back. If Schlenk and company see most of these players as equal but with different skill sets; trading down and grabbing another good asset makes sense. We are far from needing just one. On the other hand, if someone's work out is off the chart, he may stay put and not risk losing the chance to grab him.

Schlenk said there were 3 or 4 guys on our short list and we have Young, Jackson, Bagley, and Bamba on our workout list next week. Smoke screens all day as Doncic has to be a consideration as well!

 

[Buzzard]

I still want to stand pat and take Doncic or Bagley. I expect both Collins and Prince to improve over last season and both Bagley and Doncic are described as NBA ready. To me they are the best of both worlds. Ready to contribute with plenty of room to grow and improve. I hope Schlenk is just blowing smoke and he knows his choices will be between those two.

 

[kg01]

6 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I still want to stand pat and take Doncic or Bagley. I expect both Collins and Prince to improve over last season and both Bagley and Doncic are described as NBA ready. To me they are the best of both worlds. Ready to contribute with plenty of room to grow and improve. I hope Schlenk is just blowing smoke and he knows his choices will be between those two.

 

I don't like Bagley.  I think he'll put up nimbers but not impact winning.

Only issue I have on Doncic (aka whiteEvan Turner) is he appears to be an excellent 2nd or 3rd guy.  Basically a SF version of Alice.  Can't be a 1st option but is an excellent support player.  At this point, if we take Doncic, we'd need him to be 'the guy'.  Another in a long line of instances of us trying to force a guy to be something he's not.

Doesn't mean he's not a good player.  Just means it'd only work here if we proceed with the knowledge that we're still in need of the guy.

[Sothron]

7 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

Soth you love centers huh..

 

KAT

Jokic

Bamba

i believe Horford as well.. ?

You

likey the

big boys eh ?

Yes. I have always loved the big man. If I was a foot taller back when I played bball in college I would have been at center. My low post game was on point. Hours of watching McHale had me posting up other point guards like Mark Jackson and Payton...but I wanted to be a center. Oh well.

For this team, we do need an actual center. Bagley is still my first option (assuming Ayton/Doncic gone) and Bamba is my second.

 

[Buzzard]

21 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I don't like Bagley.  I think he'll put up nimbers but not impact winning.

Only issue I have on Doncic (aka whiteEvan Turner) is he appears to be an excellent 2nd or 3rd guy.  Basically a SF version of Alice.  Can't be a 1st option but is an excellent support player.  At this point, if we take Doncic, we'd need him to be 'the guy'.  Another in a long line of instances of us trying to force a guy to be something he's not.

Doesn't mean he's not a good player.  Just means it'd only work here if we proceed with the knowledge that we're still in need of the guy.

You are welcome to your opinion but I think a lot on this board are starting to drink the defensive hype koolaid. We need someone who not only can be that guy; but they want to be that guy. Especially in the last five minutes of the 4th quarter. Neither Bagley or Doncic shy away from big moments. They both want the ball; so give them the ball and see what they can do. That is being the guy.

[Buzzard]

8 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Yes. I have always loved the big man. If I was a foot taller back when I played bball in college I would have been at center. My low post game was on point. Hours of watching McHale had me posting up other point guards like Mark Jackson and Payton...but I wanted to be a center. Oh well.

For this team, we do need an actual center. Bagley is still my first option (assuming Ayton/Doncic gone) and Bamba is my second.

 

My opinion has never really changed. Give me Ayton, Doncic, or Bagley. But I have stated I would not be shocked if Schlenk takes Young or Bamba instead. Especially if we trade down.

Those are the five players I think we are sold on. JJJ is all smoke and mirrors in my opinion.

[kg01]

1 minute ago, Buzzard said:

You are welcome to your opinion but I think a lot on this board are starting to drink the defensive hype koolaid. We need someone who not only can be that guy; but they want to be that guy. Especially in the last five minutes of the 4th quarter. Neither Bagley or Doncic shy away from big moments. They both want the ball; so give them the ball and see what they can do. That is being the guy.

I'm not sure there's evidence of this with Bagley.  I'd say there's as much evidence to the contrary.  Maybe not that he doesn't "want" it, but more so that he's not a player who has the ability to do it (ball-handling, etc.) on his own.  Anthony Davis and Chris Bosh, for example, showed more perimeter abilities as FR which suggested they could do those things.

Donc has done it over there which does count/matter to me.  However, there are some legit concerns about his ability to 'get his' vs consistently higher caliber/more athletic opponents.  It's not something that should be ignored.

He has indeed been doing that in a competitive, high-level bball league but it is not the NBA.  Jan Vesely excels there.  Before Doncic, the MVP of their final 4 was Epke Udoh (who? exactly).  Let that sink in.  We cannot simply assume everything he's doing will translate.  Slowly getting by guys, tricky-dribbling and shooting over guys ... it all looks great but there are legitimate questions as to what degree of that will be possible when the overall level of play and athleticism are ratcheted up.

I happen to think he will do well in the NBA, but I think whether he ends up as Evan Turner/Hedo Turkoglu or something greater will be heavily dependent on his supporting cast.

[Buzzard]

1 minute ago, kg01 said:

I happen to think he will do well in the NBA, but I think whether he ends up as Evan Turner/Hedo Turkoglu or something greater will be heavily dependent on his supporting cast.

There is a lot more to the NBA these days than just one guy. Steph and Klay got shut down the other night but Golden State still won. That was against Lebron and in Cleveland no less. Draymond is the best defensive player on that team; but if you ask anyone; most would take KD, Steph, of Klay over him all day long. Which goes to my points.

We need to start somewhere. That somewhere may not be perfect; but I will take the better offensive option over the better defensive option all day long as my starting point. Bagley did not whither away during crunch time. From the tip off of the ACC Tourney until the final game against Kansas in the NCAA Tourney, he averaged over 20 and 10 and was efficient as hell. Doncic is not a wall flower either.

I am going to flat out hate the idea of taking a project offensive player at 3. I will pull for him but I will also be very uneasy until he starts putting the ball in the basket.

[KB21]

I'd be willing to bet that the same people who like Michael Porter as a prospect probably also think Andrew Wiggins is a good NBA player.

[kg01]

16 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

There is a lot more to the NBA these days than just one guy. Steph and Klay got shut down the other night but Golden State still won. That was against Lebron and in Cleveland no less. Draymond is the best defensive player on that team; but if you ask anyone; most would take KD, Steph, of Klay over him all day long. Which goes to my points.

We need to start somewhere. That somewhere may not be perfect; but I will take the better offensive option over the better defensive option all day long as my starting point. Bagley did not whither away during crunch time. From the tip off of the ACC Tourney until the final game against Kansas in the NCAA Tourney, he averaged over 20 and 10 and was efficient as hell. Doncic is not a wall flower either.

I am going to flat out hate the idea of taking a project offensive player at 3. I will pull for him but I will also be very uneasy until he starts putting the ball in the basket.

It seems like we pretty much are aligned in our thinking.  Agree with your point that ... shiiiiii, we gotta start somewhere.

It's why I've come around to being ok with Doncic and/or Young.  I was pretty much opposed to either as recently as the start of this week (if i'm being honest).

It's also why I like Bamba even though he's not a finished product on O.  I can see him being an elite contributor.  It's also why I still am ok with Porter despite his obvious warts.

Overall, I appreciate having a discussion that didn't devolve into personal attacks and questioning each other's intellect.  Seems that's rare these days ... well, let's be honest, there's only one poster incapable of basic discussion.  Who could that be though?  Hmmmm

[Gray Mule]

I'm still hopeful that Hawks maneuver around and, with 2 draft picks, choose Bamba and Trae.  Lloyd Pierce is said to be a defensive coach.  We hear that Bamba is built to be a fine defensive center and is already there.  Golden State has Curry.  Wouldn't Trae fit somewhat that description?  Our coach, being from G.S. will be trying to build like his former team, we believe.  If so, won't these two fit?

 

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, Sothron said:

Yes. I have always loved the big man. If I was a foot taller back when I played bball in college I would have been at center. My low post game was on point. Hours of watching McHale had me posting up other point guards like Mark Jackson and Payton...but I wanted to be a center. Oh well.

For this team, we do need an actual center. Bagley is still my first option (assuming Ayton/Doncic gone) and Bamba is my second.

 

That’s cool soth! U were Kev Willis on them! Quick spin baseline jam!

[Dragitoff]

Just now, Gray Mule said:

I'm still hopeful that Hawks maneuver around and, with 2 draft picks, choose Bamba and Trae.  Lloyd Pierce is said to be a defensive coach.  We hear that Bamba is built to be a fine defensive center and is already there.  Golden State has Curry.  Wouldn't Trae fit somewhat that description?  Our coach, being from G.S. will be trying to build like his former team, we believe.  If so, won't these two fit?

 

GM, I hear ya old friend!  Those two seem like a solid "high ceiling" pair to go with if we can get another early pick.  MPJ might be the only other candidate for projected higher ceiling with as much risk.  

[kg01]

1 minute ago, Spud2nique said:

That’s cool soth! U were Kev Willis on them! Quick spin baseline jam!

Sounds more like LiAngelo Ball.

#ShotsFired?