Former Hawk Wings Discussion (Kev/Cam)

[thecampster]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

I just see a lot better fits and fitness coming into this year. Hunter going from bottom tier starting 3 to top 10 SF is a massive jump and Capela just being Capela for a full season is helpful as well. We see the marked improvement of Trae, JC, and Aaron Holiday. Okongwu looks to be a stud. The only open items is JJ at the 4 and our wing depth which we haven't seen yet with with Justin Holiday and Bogi being out. That said, we did a much better job with the draft as Martin and Griffin look good. 

I think we will go back to having a great view of Nate again this year. I think Nate fixed some holes in our lineup. Last but not least, Murray is proving last season wasn't just a fluke but he's getting better still. Man, that trade might be a massive win for Atlanta. Kevin and Trae fit was that never good. 

Weirdly, Kevin is fitting in real well in Sacramento. They're happy with him. Some are calling for him to have a breakout year. Just proves how important fit is next to your other players.

[Spud2nique]

2 minutes ago, thecampster said:

They're happy with him.

You stop by any food places in Sac? Oh this was from your “sources” nevermind. 

[sturt]

11 minutes ago, thecampster said:

Kevin is fitting in real well in Sacramento

Feel about KVon like I feel about Juan Soto... hope he tears it up as long as my first priority team isn't competitive. Or, in this case, as long as his team isn't pitted against my first priority team. Love to see ya in the Finals, Kev.

(Of course, true to my word, I had to look in the last couple of days to even know that San Diego did, indeed, make the post season... so "hope" shouldn't be equated with paying attention.)

[thecampster]

3 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

You stop by any food places in Sac? Oh this was from your “sources” nevermind. 

No, this is from their message boards, local news.  I'm out of regular sources it seems, but thanks for reminding me I had to go through the offseason like a normal.

[kg01]

16 minutes ago, thecampster said:

No, this is from their message boards, local news.  I'm out of regular sources it seems, but thanks for reminding me I had to go through the offseason like a normal.

 A 'normal'?  Haha, the fall from the 1% is a long, bumpy one I bet. 

[NBASupes]

23 hours ago, NBASupes said:

I just see a lot better fits and fitness coming into this year. Hunter going from bottom tier starting 3 to top 10 SF is a massive jump and Capela just being Capela for a full season is helpful as well. We see the marked improvement of Trae, JC, and Aaron Holiday. Okongwu looks to be a stud. The only open items is JJ at the 4 and our wing depth which we haven't seen yet with with Justin Holiday and Bogi being out. That said, we did a much better job with the draft as Martin and Griffin look good. 

I think we will go back to having a great view of Nate again this year. I think Nate fixed some holes in our lineup. Last but not least, Murray is proving last season wasn't just a fluke but he's getting better still. Man, that trade might be a massive win for Atlanta. Kevin and Trae fit was that never good. 

As I stated

Kevin and Trae were never a good fit. It always netted a neutral or negative grade. Truth is, Kevin style of play is more inclined to be successful with Fox and Sacramento more than Atlanta.

 

 

[Diesel]

30 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

As I stated

Kevin and Trae were never a good fit. It always netted a neutral or negative grade. Truth is, Kevin style of play is more inclined to be successful with Fox and Sacramento more than Atlanta.

 

 

This may have been a shot at our team.   Indeed, it took three years for us to build the chemistry we have with Trae at the Lead.   However, the league and league play is more than that... Kev is still a young player with lots to learn...  I'm glad to see he's fitting in so far. 

As far as us, I really think our Chemistry is better now than it was two years ago and we haven't played much.   It just seems like from the first man to the CP Cuts... we have guys who really fit.  I think Schlenk has done an excellent job of scouting and knowing who to make offers to.   I think we have players that want it.   I'm applauding the work that Dre' put in over the summer and hopes he continues to grow that way. 

And I'm glad that we didn't continue mourning mistakes we made like Reddish.  He's a good player but he's just not a good fit for us.  I look forward to seeing how we grow from here and really I think the sky is the limit for our band of hell raisers.   Finally got some more dogs in Atlanta. 

 

 

[NBASupes]

13 minutes ago, Diesel said:

This may have been a shot at our team.   Indeed, it took three years for us to build the chemistry we have with Trae at the Lead.   However, the league and league play is more than that... Kev is still a young player with lots to learn...  I'm glad to see he's fitting in so far. 

As far as us, I really think our Chemistry is better now than it was two years ago and we haven't played much.   It just seems like from the first man to the CP Cuts... we have guys who really fit.  I think Schlenk has done an excellent job of scouting and knowing who to make offers to.   I think we have players that want it.   I'm applauding the work that Dre' put in over the summer and hopes he continues to grow that way. 

And I'm glad that we didn't continue mourning mistakes we made like Reddish.  He's a good player but he's just not a good fit for us.  I look forward to seeing how we grow from here and really I think the sky is the limit for our band of hell raisers.   Finally got some more dogs in Atlanta. 

 

 

Our offense is built around Trae, the PnR, and generating high percentage looks. 

 

It's not about movement regardless if it's player or ball, or isolation basketball unless it's Trae, Cam, Dre, or Lou. 

He was never a fit. Bogi was always a better fit than Kevin. Kevin was just a better personality and he just seemed to be a great teammate and I feel he is a great teammate and easy to coach.

Cam was clearly not a good fit but for reasons that would impact him everywhere, not just Atlanta. He doesn't understand he needs to master a role before anyone gives him the keys. Kevin can be a good fit but not in Atlanta. 

Edited October 10, 2022 by NBASupes

[Diesel]

3 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Our offense is built around Trae, the PnR, and generating high percentage looks. 

 

It's not about movement regardless if it's player or ball, or isolation basketball unless it's Trae, Cam, Dre, or Lou. 

He was never a fit. Bogi was always a better fit than Kevin. Kevin was just a better personality and he just seemed to be a great teammate and I feel he is a great teammate and easy to coach.

Cam was clearly not a good fit but for reasons that would impact him everywhere, not just Atlanta. He doesn't understand he needs to master a role before anyone gives him the keys. Kevin can be a good fit but not in Atlanta. 

I think Maryland Kevin was a better fit.   Something happened.  When I watch the game tapes of him at Maryland, he could have been just as much DJM as DJM is going to be.   The thing is that he showed some flashes of that but he never could make it sustainable.   I think after his arm injury, psychologically, the want to be physical and play inside was gone and that made him just another guy standing on the perimeter.  

The thing about Bogi is that Bogi has the heart of a champion.   He's a guy that will go and do what needs to be done whether it's outside shooting or running the offense or going inside.  Bogi's not afraid to try.   He just limited. 

I like you saw the potential in Cam.   But Cam had the same thing that guys like Ken Norman, Glen Robinson, and Josh Smith had... he had a personality that made him believe that he can be more than the system.  There's no problem with that when you are but if the system is working and you're still trying to work above it, then it becomes a problem.   Even though they are tanking, Cam could do well to go to a team like San Antonio.   Not to be humbled, but to learn how to use his gifts both in and outside of a system.  He still has talent and potential. 

 

 

[NBASupes]

25 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I think Maryland Kevin was a better fit.   Something happened.  When I watch the game tapes of him at Maryland, he could have been just as much DJM as DJM is going to be.   The thing is that he showed some flashes of that but he never could make it sustainable.   I think after his arm injury, psychologically, the want to be physical and play inside was gone and that made him just another guy standing on the perimeter.  

The thing about Bogi is that Bogi has the heart of a champion.   He's a guy that will go and do what needs to be done whether it's outside shooting or running the offense or going inside.  Bogi's not afraid to try.   He just limited. 

I like you saw the potential in Cam.   But Cam had the same thing that guys like Ken Norman, Glen Robinson, and Josh Smith had... he had a personality that made him believe that he can be more than the system.  There's no problem with that when you are but if the system is working and you're still trying to work above it, then it becomes a problem.   Even though they are tanking, Cam could do well to go to a team like San Antonio.   Not to be humbled, but to learn how to use his gifts both in and outside of a system.  He still has talent and potential. 

 

 

Kevin needs a lot more touches, that's something he was never going to get in Atlanta. He was here for what 5 years. He was never going to fit in Atlanta. 

I agree on Bogs

Josh even as stubborn as he could be was one of the smartest players to ever wear a Hawks jersey. I had numerous former Hawks who played with Josh brag about his IQ and how he knew where everyone was suppose to be. All of the plays. Everything. He just lacked a feel for the game to an extreme degree and his shot iq was insanely low. 

I don't know if I seen anyone like Cam before or after. Honestly, if he wasn't so freaking talented, I don't believe he would ever make it in the NBA. Even with his size and tools. He got too many flaws. The most flawed player I've ever seen in NBA history. 

[Spud2nique]

6 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Josh even as stubborn as he could be was one of the smartest players to ever wear a Hawks jersey.

Nope. Not even close. Many many times we would fall short because of Smoove dumb plays, lot of them covered by his athleticism but he wasn’t that.

 

7 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

The most flawed player I've ever seen in NBA history. 

Like Horford, the most talented too? Comon Supes, stay with us here.

[Spud2nique]

38 minutes ago, Diesel said:

When I watch the game tapes of him at Maryland, he could have been just as much DJM as DJM is going to be. 

Whoa I woke up to some outlandish stuff.

[NBASupes]

Just now, Spud2nique said:

Nope. Not even close. Many many times we would fall short because of Smoove dumb plays, lot of them covered by his athleticism but he wasn’t that.

 

Like Horford, the most talented too? Comon Supes, stay with us here.

He was exceptionally smart. You are confusing poor shot IQ and a shitty feel for the game for BBIQ in general. There is a difference. 

Huh? I have zero clue of your reference. Anyway, I've always said, Cam is the most flawed player and Smoove had the most critical crippling flaws I've ever seen. Crazy is both are Hawks which is my team. 

[Spud2nique]

19 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Anyway, I've always said, Cam is the most flawed player

No you haven’t. When WE were praising him you never did.

[JayBirdHawk]

Kevin's fit was fine in 'general' as a complementary piece.

However, the Hawks needed another 'star' player to go with Trae...Kevin wasn't trending that way.  

When Trae sat, did he take control of the team as 'the guy?'  

[AHF]

2 hours ago, NBASupes said:

As I stated

Kevin and Trae were never a good fit. It always netted a neutral or negative grade. Truth is, Kevin style of play is more inclined to be successful with Fox and Sacramento more than Atlanta.

 

 

Problem with chemistry was on defense, not offense.  We were the #8 team in ORTG two years ago and #2 last year.  No chemistry issues on offense preventing us from elite performance.

D was a whole other matter.  26th last year....

[JayBirdHawk]

54 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

The most flawed player I've ever seen in NBA history. 

Huh? When did you come to this realization about Cam? 

[JayBirdHawk]

5 minutes ago, AHF said:

On the topic of the thread

I have contributed to this thread going off topic, apologies. 

Can you create a separate Kev/Cam thread so we can keep this just about the predictions? 

[kg01]

34 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I have contributed to this thread going off topic, apologies. 

Can you create a separate Kev/Cam thread so we can keep this just about the predictions? 

Yes, and can the mods also make a thread about people [changing] their opinions of former players? 

[AHF]

Moving posts here.