Looking Back - Was Hinrich trade a bad move?

[JackB1]

At the time it happened, I was in favor of the trade, but now I am not so sure? Here are my reasons:

1) No more alley-oops for Smith. Bibby was the only one who seemed to know how & when to set up Smith for those jams that now seem like distant memories.

2) Bibby was more clutch from 3 point land when needed. Hinrich seems more hit or miss.

3) I don't see a huge difference on defense. Bibby wasn't as quick, but used his "smarts". Hinrich gets beat by quick guards just like Bibby did. I am really not that impressed with Hinrich's D to be honest. It just seems "average" to me.

4) Hinrich doesn't have the court leadership skills that Bibby has. Bibby used to get in Josh's face now and then when Josh played stupid. Hinrich just stands there with that WTF look.

5) Bibby ran the pick & roll to perfection with Horford. Horford's production seems to have tailed off noticeably since Bibby left.

In the end, did we need an upgrade at PG?....Yes. Did we really get it? Not really.

Edited March 23, 2011 by JackB1

[niremetal]

3) I don't see a huge difference on defense. Bibby wasn't as quick, but used his "smarts". Hinrich gets beat by quick guards just like Bibby did. I am really not that impressed with Hinrich's D to be honest. It just seems "average" to me.

I'm truly flabbergasted by this paragraph, especially the first sentence. That's all I'll say.

Edited March 23, 2011 by niremetal

[JackB1]

I'm truly flabbergasted by this paragraph, especially the first sentence. That's all I'll say.

You can be flabbergasted all you want, but I watched Hinrich in person a few times recently and

his defence is "OK"....nothing special. It's not like he's ever going to be on the "all defensive team"

or anything. I watched him closely at games and a good point guard gets around him almost

as easily as he would with Bibby. The difference is minimal IMO. Also I think we lost a lot more

than we realize by losing Bibby.

[GST]

I think Hinrich was a good move because if we hadn't done it, we would have went into the off season thinking we just need to fix the hole at PG. We now know better.

[coachx]

You can be flabbergasted all you want, but I watched Hinrich in person a few times recently and

his defence is "OK"....nothing special. It's not like he's ever going to be on the "all defensive team"

or anything. I watched him closely at games and a good point guard gets around him almost

as easily as he would with Bibby. The difference is minimal IMO. Also I think we lost a lot more

than we realize by losing Bibby.

Hinrich has actually already been on the all defensive team.

There is already a good article posted on this. All the signs were there at he allstar break. We were barely beating poor teams and had the weakest 1st half schedule in the league. That means we get the toughest 2nd half schedule and we are paying for it now.

Edited March 23, 2011 by coachx

[lethalweapon3]

"Trading for Hinrich" is still good move. We'd still be getting beasted twice a week, and as awful as morale is now, we'd be screaming about how "we stood pat while Miami went put and upgraded their PG spot with Kirk Hinrich!" or somebody. Now whether we gave up too much in the deal is a whole other show.

Kirk's "average" D is still eons better than the Bibster's orange-cone approach. The thing with Bibby is he accommodated (as best he could) for the rest of the team's collective shortcomings on offense, and in turn the team accommodated him (as best they could) for his shortcomings on defense. Now that the codependency is gone the team is struggling to readjust.

As far as shooting goes, it's worth noting that Hinrich is shooting 46.5% on 3.3 FGAs per game through 13 contests. With either LeBron or D-Wade getting drawing extra defenders away from the perimeter, Bibby's giving the Heat 45.7% on 3.5 FGA per game through 10 games. For what was Bibby's saving grace, Kirk is giving us that at least.

~lw3

[Crank]

No the bad move was not trading Josh for Amare when he had a chance and not trading Marvin for Deng either .

We needed an alpha personality but its too late the window has shut on this team.

[macdaddy]

Considering we look totally lost out there I agree that so far the trade isn't looking great. Now maybe all of this would have happened with Bibby. I'm just baffled that we traded Bibby and not Crawford. I actually think Crawfords defense is much worse.

I'm hoping Hinrich gets adjusted to what our guys are good at and things start clicking. Remember when Bibby came in he clicked immediately. Back in the good old days when we were clawing for that 8th seed instead of falling towards it.

[Crank]

Considering we look totally lost out there I agree that so far the trade isn't looking great. Now maybe all of this would have happened with Bibby. I'm just baffled that we traded Bibby and not Crawford. I actually think Crawfords defense is much worse.

I'm hoping Hinrich gets adjusted to what our guys are good at and things start clicking. Remember when Bibby came in he clicked immediately. Back in the good old days when we were clawing for that 8th seed instead of falling towards it.

Well see thats the problem you think this team is about Hinrich or Crawford or Bibby when its not .

Its about Josh and Al and Joe those are the guys we invested major money in and those are the ones we deemed untouchable and those are the ones who have not come close to delivering the goods .

Bibby is was a excuse

Crawford is now the excuse

Hinrich will become the excuse

of course they all clicked before they got paid now what are they playing for because winning has never seemed that important to them and we are seeing it now that the money is off the table and in there hands

[Jungle Jack]

Hello,

With JC2 putting up some excellent numbers, this Trade is beginning to look worse and worse. If we did not have to give up what is shaping up to be a higher and higher 1st Round Draft Pick, this would not be so painful. It sadly brings into question just how bad the Hawks are at Player Development.

We need to put Teague in the Starting Lineup now. I realize that many of his points last night were against the Bulls 2nd Team, but it was not like anyone else was producing against them. As a lifelong Hawks Fan like most all of you, it is so painful to have such inept Ownership who settle on the cheapest HC option when we could have gotten a real HC. Personally, I would fire Drew today and hire Larry Brown.

Cheers,

JJ

[Bawse]

Not a bad move, and here's why:

1) No more alley-oops for Smith. Bibby was the only one who seemed to know how & when to set up Smith for those jams that now seem like distant memories.

To be fair, even when Bibby was here this season, there weren't many oops to Smoove. We haven't been running the floor near as much as we have in the past. Bibby was also here for 3 seasons, each of our playoff runs. He knew our player tendencies and molded well. Hinrich still is the odd man out.

2) Bibby was more clutch from 3 point land when needed. Hinrich seems more hit or miss.

Agreed. But that is Bibbys strongest feat. He is a spot up shooter, while Hinrich runs the point traditionally with much more added defense. Hinrich looks to get others involved before himself.

3) I don't see a huge difference on defense. Bibby wasn't as quick, but used his "smarts". Hinrich gets beat by quick guards just like Bibby did. I am really not that impressed with Hinrich's D to be honest. It just seems "average" to me.

Baffling comment. Bibby was burned night in and night out on defense. Hinrich is a much added contribution on defense, hustle wise, and just by playing 1 on 1 defense against the other point. It is no longer 4v5 on defense. That said, we are still being blown out, but you CANNOT put this on Hinrichs shoulders. He was traded mid-season. How do you think he feels? He barely knows these guys still. Hinrich gets beat as much as Bibby? And his D is average? All Defensive Second Team 2007. Nuff' said.

4) Hinrich doesn't have the court leadership skills that Bibby has. Bibby used to get in Josh's face now and then when Josh played stupid. Hinrich just stands there with that WTF look.

Hinrich might stand there with the "WTF" look because, again, he has just JOINED this squad. Hinrichs BBIQ is at the top, that's no secret. Maybe Hinrich is giving him the "WTF" look because he's wondering why the ball isn't in his hands as a PG to run the offense, instead of Smoove standing at the top of the perimeter, throwing bullet passes. Again, this is a trust issue. As Hinrich grows with this team, trust will as well. When Bibby joined our squad during our first playoff run, we had no veteran leadership. Bibby was that man. This squad was still young. This is a different scenario now.

5) Bibby ran the pick & roll to perfection with Horford. Horford's production seems to have tailed off noticeably since Bibby left.

You blame this on Bibby leaving? I don't think it's Hinrichs fault Horford is now more accustomed to the mid-range jumper, instead of banging inside. SMH bro.

Now... with all that said, I still wish we'd have kept Jordan Crawford. It was foolish to move him. But we desperately needed a PG improvement.

Edited March 23, 2011 by Boss

[yungsta]

kirk hinrich was my last option i really wanted a pg who could penetrate i really wanted d harris or ramon session atleast

[GameTime]

Getting Hinrich wasn't bad, but the trade was a bad trade though. Bibby (Bought out so great move by Wash), Mo Evans (expirer), Jordan Crawford (20-5-5 player given minutes), and a 1st round pick (16th-20th I guess; Kemba Walker, Nolan Smith, Kyle Singler, Chris Singleton and Kenneth Faried available) was way too much IMO.

Edited March 23, 2011 by GameTime

[Marvin24Williams]

YES. Hinrich is not worth a dam 1ST (goodbye kemba walker) and jo crawford.

[Kimsey]

My problem with kirk is he is a tweener, can't guard most 2s or 1s. This (dis) organization is allergic to acquiring real point guard players. I might as well blame stern for approving the sale several years back because he will be facing alot of heat this summer anyways.

[Joker]

No the bad move was not trading Josh for Amare when he had a chance and not trading Marvin for Deng either .

We needed an alpha personality but its too late the window has shut on this team.

It was Amare for Josh and our 1st which was Horford which is the player they wanted badly but the Hawks felt that was too much and seeing where Horford is today, it was far too much times 100. I never heard Deng was on the market for Marvin, I heard bigger prospect everytime with Deng.

Not a bad move, and here's why:

To be fair, even when Bibby was here this season, there weren't many oops to Smoove. We haven't been running the floor near as much as we have in the past. Bibby was also here for 3 seasons, each of our playoff runs. He knew our player tendencies and molded well. Hinrich still is the odd man out.

Agreed. But that is Bibbys strongest feat. He is a spot up shooter, while Hinrich runs the point traditionally with much more added defense. Hinrich looks to get others involved before himself.

Baffling comment. Bibby was burned night in and night out on defense. Hinrich is a much added contribution on defense, hustle wise, and just by playing 1 on 1 defense against the other point. It is no longer 4v5 on defense. That said, we are still being blown out, but you CANNOT put this on Hinrichs shoulders. He was traded mid-season. How do you think he feels? He barely knows these guys still. Hinrich gets beat as much as Bibby? And his D is average? All Defensive Second Team 2007. Nuff' said.

Hinrich might stand there with the "WTF" look because, again, he has just JOINED this squad. Hinrichs BBIQ is at the top, that's no secret. Maybe Hinrich is giving him the "WTF" look because he's wondering why the ball isn't in his hands as a PG to run the offense, instead of Smoove standing at the top of the perimeter, throwing bullet passes. Again, this is a trust issue. As Hinrich grows with this team, trust will as well. When Bibby joined our squad during our first playoff run, we had no veteran leadership. Bibby was that man. This squad was still young. This is a different scenario now.

You blame this on Bibby leaving? I don't think it's Hinrichs fault Horford is now more accustomed to the mid-range jumper, instead of banging inside. SMH bro.

Now... with all that said, I still wish we'd have kept Jordan Crawford. It was foolish to move him. But we desperately needed a PG improvement.

I am not going to reply to all you wrote but Horford has always been a PnR NBA player at PF. Just as Joe never really been a true #1, Josh has never had high BBIQ, and Zaza never been that athletic so when we lost Bibby who is a very good PnR PG for one who is solid at best which is also what Teague is at the PnR then we almost might as well forget about Horford on offense as we did in Al's rookie season,

[TomSelleck]

The biggest problem is it should be pretty evident that the window has closed on this Hawks team and any move to improve for 2011 or 2012 was pointless. If the Hawks did nothing a new window may have been possible by 2013, at the earliest. But now the team has given away two assets that could have helped open the new window (Jordan Crawford and 2011 1st round pick), the Hawks are looking more like their next window won't be opening until 2014 or 2015.

[GameTime]

I think this deserves a bump.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Hinrich was overrated from the jump. He's a decent, mediocre PG at best now. People want him to play at the level he played at 4 years ago, when the "Baby Bulls" were the talk of the league. Well, he hasn't played that well in a long time. Even tonight, he was no match for Wall. And he was awful offensively.

The real question is knowing what you know now, would you trade Jordan Crawford for Kirk Hinrich straight up . . forget Bibby.

The fact that we gave them Bibby + Jordan + Mo ( cap space ) + a 1st round pick, puts them in position to really assemble a nice young nucleus. If they get lucky and win the NBA Lottery, they REALLY get to upgrade their young talent.

Honestly, the main card that the Hawks could play regarding Hinrich, would be to trade him for a better player, or group of players. The 8 mill expiring contract he has going into next summer should be traded as soon as the lockout is over. You don't do what you did with Jamal, and keep him around and not possibly upgrade the team. You trade Hinrich, or trade him + another player, and really try to upgrade this team with a better player(s).

Doubt that this ownership group does that though.

[NJHAWK]

Face it we got JACKED . Bibby is better than Hinrich period. We also throw in a 1st round pick and a guy who could be a future all star. Hinrich is a slow over rated has been. JACKED. I wouldnt have traded any player or pick in that deal straight up for K.H. except Mo Evans. Even then I would have played K.H. off the bench same as where the rest of the league would play him.