If one star would come to Atlanta then......

[ATLnightwing]

Who are the James Harden-like stars that would be available to us this Summer? Typically, these stars are either disgruntled stars looking for a new situation or young players with known potential that are ready to have their own team. Here's what I'm thinking:

Rajon Rondo - Has been in trade rumors for a while. I think he's an unlikely trade target because coming to Atlanta would not be too different from his current situation. Plus this guy is a champion.

Kevin Love- The primary target of this discussion. I think he's also unlikely. I think it is clear he's interested in going to a big market.

Dion Waiters - not as established as James Harden was, but do you not see the similarities in their situations? Both were/are 6th man on their teams. Both are known scorers. Who knows? If you give Waiters his own team, he might explode like Harden. I think he is a realistic target.

Greg Monroe- He has been in trade rumors. Detroit would prefer Josh Smith at the PF. We know he's capable of being a 20 and 10 player. If Detroit doesn't make the playoffs or struggles mightly again, I think he's going to be traded for sure. Maybe we can finally get a good center. I think he's a realistic target.

Lance Stephenson- Another unlikely one, but I've had my eye on him this year. He is an unbelievable player, a near triple-double every night. He will likely resign this Summer, but if something goes wrong with the Pacers in the playoffs, I would love to target him as a FA.

So in my opinion, I don't see many established stars on the market looking to be traded. More realistically, we go after a young player with potential to become one.

[Jody23]

The Atlanta Hawks are a yoyo team, having a yoyo season. Just think. We've watched it over and over. We're up. We're down.When we're hot, no one can beat us. When we're cold, any NBA teamcan have their way with us. When the shots are falling, our defense seems to take on an aggressive life of it's own. We fight for every lose ball. We rebound. Passes zipfrom side to side and inside out and we score. Then, in other games, Hawks go into their famous sleepwalk mode. Theyhave practiced this with different players and different coaches. Doesn'tseem to matter, it's always in the back of our mind, wondering, when willit happen again? We know it's coming, just don't know when. Two years ago, with expensive assets and our own version of a super starin Joe Johnson and the "almost but not quiet" star Smoove, Hawks finishedthe season and post season in much the same place we expect this teamto end up. We want our very own super star when in reality we really need a good, solidteam of players who fit together and get the job done as a team, along with thebench players to make it all work. A super star? Great. We sell our soul for a great super star. He has a careerending injury and then what? We have nothing left, that's what. Let's imagine building a team that does all things well and has the size andspeed to make things happen. They rebound well, the shoot really well. Theyare intelligent enough to know which direction is up. Answer me this. What does it require to have a championship team? All thosegreat super stars or that team that is team enough to play together, fly up and down the floor and cause havoc with the opponent? I believe that a super star is great but a super team is better and, in our case,probably a lot easier to achieve. What do you think???

I would say history disagrees with you. Sure, you have to put together a good and solid team, but you also have to have at least two star, all nba players. Joe Johnson and Josh Smith were never at that level. No one we had was. When we had the Smitty and Mookie teams in the 90s (good and solid), we ALWAYS lost to the good teams that had the star/all nba players. We all are rooting for Ferry to succeed with his approach because if he does, it means the team succeeds. However, he's basically relying on new cba rules and cap flexibility while keeping the team in the competitive middle. He's banking on another James Harden scenario. I and others disagree with that approach.

[Jody23]

Who are the James Harden-like stars that would be available to us this Summer? Typically, these stars are either disgruntled stars looking for a new situation or young players with known potential that are ready to have their own team. Here's what I'm thinking: Rajon Rondo - Has been in trade rumors for a while. I think he's an unlikely trade target because coming to Atlanta would not be too different from his current situation. Plus this guy is a champion. Kevin Love- The primary target of this discussion. I think he's also unlikely. I think it is clear he's interested in going to a big market. Dion Waiters - not as established as James Harden was, but do you not see the similarities in their situations? Both were/are 6th man on their teams. Both are known scorers. Who knows? If you give Waiters his own team, he might explode like Harden. I think he is a realistic target. Greg Monroe- He has been in trade rumors. Detroit would prefer Josh Smith at the PF. We know he's capable of being a 20 and 10 player. If Detroit doesn't make the playoffs or struggles mightly again, I think he's going to be traded for sure. Maybe we can finally get a good center. I think he's a realistic target. Lance Stephenson- Another unlikely one, but I've had my eye on him this year. He is an unbelievable player, a near triple-double every night. He will likely resign this Summer, but if something goes wrong with the Pacers in the playoffs, I would love to target him as a FA. So in my opinion, I don't see many established stars on the market looking to be traded. More realistically, we go after a young player with potential to become one.

This is why I don't get the obsession from this team with making the playoffs THIS year. The James Harden scenario won't be a regular thing. The big market teams will always find a way to bend the rules in their favor. Along with getting good players, we're going to need the star player and I think our best shot is the draft.

[JTB]

Who are the James Harden-like stars that would be available to us this Summer? Typically, these stars are either disgruntled stars looking for a new situation or young players with known potential that are ready to have their own team. Here's what I'm thinking: Rajon Rondo - Has been in trade rumors for a while. I think he's an unlikely trade target because coming to Atlanta would not be too different from his current situation. Plus this guy is a champion. Kevin Love- The primary target of this discussion. I think he's also unlikely. I think it is clear he's interested in going to a big market. Dion Waiters - not as established as James Harden was, but do you not see the similarities in their situations? Both were/are 6th man on their teams. Both are known scorers. Who knows? If you give Waiters his own team, he might explode like Harden. I think he is a realistic target. Greg Monroe- He has been in trade rumors. Detroit would prefer Josh Smith at the PF. We know he's capable of being a 20 and 10 player. If Detroit doesn't make the playoffs or struggles mightly again, I think he's going to be traded for sure. Maybe we can finally get a good center. I think he's a realistic target. Lance Stephenson- Another unlikely one, but I've had my eye on him this year. He is an unbelievable player, a near triple-double every night. He will likely resign this Summer, but if something goes wrong with the Pacers in the playoffs, I would love to target him as a FA. So in my opinion, I don't see many established stars on the market looking to be traded. More realistically, we go after a young player with potential to become one.

Exactly that's what this thread is about! Either getting an already established star player or getting an potential star player.Now I'm not too sure about some of these guys you've mentioned as far as being a star but there is potential. Dion W. is actually very interesting number one he's aggressive as hell and so is lance Stephenson! Both those guys have a natural high motor, high aggressiveness level they maintain all year and that's what we need in at that guard position other than passing of course.So yeah Dion W., Greg Monroe, Evan Turner, these are guys that can be stars under coach bud possibly. Anyways these are the type of trades that are worth doing...now I'm not saying give away the whole damn team for any of these players but if you have to trade good assets for these guys so be it.

[Vol4ever]

Players will get their money when they start producing like Harden has in Houston. His next contract will be a monster and if Houston doesn't pay another team will. It appears to me that DF is just treading water trying to find a cheap contract player that has the potential to become a star. When Millsaps contract is up in 2 years he is going to get paid. So my question is when his contract comes up does Ferry dump him for a cheaper contract? I hope this is not the case and we are building for something in the future. I believe after never having a shot in the D12 free agent sweepstakes we should have just dumped the season. I've been to a few games this season and we are lucky to have 10,000 in the building, so ownership is losing money. Sometimes losing money is a tax write-off, but big losses start to effect millionaires checking account something has to change. I would say Mr Ferry is under great pressure to put some butts in those seats, the lower lever seats are mostly corporate owned, but those corps won't continue to dump money into something that continues to be a middle of the pack product.I have been labeled one of the three negative folks on the board and I'm ok with that. I never have nor ever will be a part of the political correct crowd anyway. I'm one person that has an opinion on a message board that calls it the way I see it.My goal is for this organization is to win a championship by any means possible.

Edited January 19, 2014 by Vol4ever

[yungsta]

Players will get their money when they start producing like Harden has in Houston. His next contract will be a monster and if Houston doesn't pay another team will.It appears to me that DF is just treading water trying to find a cheap contract player that has the potential to become a star. When Millsaps contract is up in 2 years he is going to get paid. So my question is when his contract comes up does Ferry dump him for a cheaper contract? I hope this is not the case and we are building for something in the future. I believe after never having a shot in the D12 free agent sweepstakes we should have just dumped the season. I've been to a few games this season and we are lucky to have 10,000 in the building, so ownership is losing money. Sometimes losing money is a tax write-off, but big losses start to effect millionaires checking account something has to change. I would say Mr Ferry is under great pressure to put some butts in those seats, the lower lever seats are mostly corporate owned, but those corps won't continue to dump money into something that continues to be a middle of the pack product.I have been labeled one of the three negative folks on the board and I'm ok with that. I never have nor ever will be a part of the political correct crowd anyway. I'm one person that has an opinion on a message board that calls it the way I see it.My goal is for this organization is to win a championship by any means possible.

I have said this before Ferry job is to keep the team a playoff team with the least amount of committed salary as possible. The reasoning behind the Ferry hire was to clean up the team financially because Im sure the new CBA penalties freaked the owners out. That is the conclusion I have came up with observing the trend of moves Ferry has made. Every move he has made involves acquiring veterans on short term contracts.

The one exception was willing to spend on d12 and cp3 cause they knew it would significantly raise the franchise's value.

I hope it blows up in ASG's face and they keep losing money until they are forced to sell the team... the hawks will never accomplish anything under them.

[Vol4ever]

I have said this before Ferry job is to keep the team a playoff team with the least amount of committed salary as possible. The reasoning behind the Ferry hire was to clean up the team financially because Im sure the new CBA penalties freaked the owners out. That is the conclusion I have came up with observing the trend of moves Ferry has made. Every move he has made involves acquiring veterans on short term contracts. The one exception was willing to spend on d12 and cp3 cause they knew it would significantly raise the franchise's value. I hope it blows up in ASG's face and they keep losing money until they are forced to sell the team... the hawks will never accomplish anything under them.

I agree 110%. If anyone on this board has the belief that the ASG is in this for the chance to win a championship you are going to be horribly disapointed over the next few years.

[Sothron]

I agree 110%. If anyone on this board has the belief that the ASG is in this for the chance to win a championship you are going to be horribly disapointed over the next few years.

They already showed they are backstabbers and traitors. This former Thrasher season ticket holder knows it.

[Gray Mule]

We've gotta, We've gotta,

we've just gotta get us a super star!

That is the answer to all our problems.

Then, riddle me this. How many championships did the King have when

he was in Cleveland? No one can deny that he is one of the elite players

in the NBA.

But, you say, if we had that super star here, other near super stars would

be gung ho to come here. Really? Why didn't that happen in Cleveland?

To me, a well built team with all the pieces fitted together correctly, would

give every team in the NBA nightmares about facing us.

Just my opinion. Opinions are like noses because everyone has one and

no two are exactly alike!

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Players will get their money when they start producing like Harden has in Houston. His next contract will be a monster and if Houston doesn't pay another team will.It appears to me that DF is just treading water trying to find a cheap contract player that has the potential to become a star. When Millsaps contract is up in 2 years he is going to get paid. So my question is when his contract comes up does Ferry dump him for a cheaper contract? I hope this is not the case and we are building for something in the future. I believe after never having a shot in the D12 free agent sweepstakes we should have just dumped the season. I've been to a few games this season and we are lucky to have 10,000 in the building, so ownership is losing money. Sometimes losing money is a tax write-off, but big losses start to effect millionaires checking account something has to change. I would say Mr Ferry is under great pressure to put some butts in those seats, the lower lever seats are mostly corporate owned, but those corps won't continue to dump money into something that continues to be a middle of the pack product.I have been labeled one of the three negative folks on the board and I'm ok with that. I never have nor ever will be a part of the political correct crowd anyway. I'm one person that has an opinion on a message board that calls it the way I see it.My goal is for this organization is to win a championship by any means possible.

I agree with most of what you say. I guess I'm part of the negative crowd these days too, because I have little faith in Danny Ferry right now. To think that we lost JJ and Josh for virtually nothing, and we're still not better ( or in a full rebuilding mode ), indicates to me that Danny simply wants to straddle the fence.

Despite the mediocre overall record, the team has actually been very good at home. We just don't have any big names . . or exciting type of players.

Signing Korver to that long deal was mind blowing. Signing MIllsap was good. But that CAN'T be your free agent signings, if you have 30+ million in cap space, and if you're still trying to win. You have to do more and bring in players with more punch to their games.

But like you said, he should've never chased after Dwight. That was the pipe dream of all pipe dreams.

The only hope Ferry has for the next few years, is if something catastrophic happens in Brooklyn ( i.e - a Joe Johnson season ending injury ) that takes them out of the playoffs, so that we can get a lottery pick. If that doesn't happen, I don't trust Ferry at all to make the right type of moves to improve the team.

[Jody23]

We've gotta, We've gotta,

we've just gotta get us a super star!

That is the answer to all our problems.

Then, riddle me this. How many championships did the King have when

he was in Cleveland? No one can deny that he is one of the elite players

in the NBA.

But, you say, if we had that super star here, other near super stars would

be gung ho to come here. Really? Why didn't that happen in Cleveland?

To me, a well built team with all the pieces fitted together correctly, would

give every team in the NBA nightmares about facing us.

Just my opinion. Opinions are like noses because everyone has one and

no two are exactly alike!

We can all have our opinions. That's fine. But opinion doesn't change fact. Absolutely no one is saying that it isn't important to have a good team. But this idea that you can simply win a title with NO stars, but just with a "good" team has been proven to be a fallacy.

And the example of Lebron is not a good one. That Cavs team wasn't that great, but with him they went to the Finals. And now that he's with a better team, he's won two championships and now eyeing a third. Do you honestly think the Heat win those championships without him though? Absolutely not. A good team is key, but an elite/star player is necessary.

[JETSET]

We've gotta, We've gotta,

we've just gotta get us a super star!

That is the answer to all our problems.

Then, riddle me this. How many championships did the King have when

he was in Cleveland? No one can deny that he is one of the elite players

in the NBA.

But, you say, if we had that super star here, other near super stars would

be gung ho to come here. Really? Why didn't that happen in Cleveland?

To me, a well built team with all the pieces fitted together correctly, would

give every team in the NBA nightmares about facing us.

Just my opinion. Opinions are like noses because everyone has one and

no two are exactly alike!

You have to have a superstar to win a ring. This is fact as the Pistons are the only team to win a title without a superstar in atleast the past 30 years.

[Vol4ever]

Some of you don't remember maybe or weren't around but we had a superstar in Nique with the Hawks and didn't win. We had great coaching, a shot blocking rebounding center and a Allstar power forward. We had a great sharp shooter at the two and a good defensive pg. We had Ted Turner. Everything we are clamering for now. Why didn't we win?Laugh if you want, but the NBA wanted the Celtics and Lakers to win for ratings. We got screwed and tatood by the refs in the Boston garden time after time. I actually got on a plane and went to some of those games and almost landed in jail after on of them. Of, course they had a pretty damn good team themselves with Larry Legend and his bunch.

[nathan2331]

Some of you don't remember maybe or weren't around but we had a superstar in Nique with the Hawks and didn't win. We had great coaching, a shot blocking rebounding center and a Allstar power forward. We had a great sharp shooter at the two and a good defensive pg. We had Ted Turner. Everything we are clamering for now. Why didn't we win?Laugh if you want, but the NBA wanted the Celtics and Lakers to win for ratings. We got screwed and tatood by the refs in the Boston garden time after time. I actually got on a plane and went to some of those games and almost landed in jail after on of them. Of, course they had a pretty damn good team themselves with Larry Legend and his bunch.

You're right, we never won anything. But while Wilkins was here we actually had a chance at winning something. While I'm not a pro-tanker, I definitely see the merits of their argument. The way I see it so long as Bud is our coach, we will maximize whatever talent is on the roster. He can't however turn the talent we currently have into a legitimate contender.

[Gray Mule]

We've gone back and forth about the Hawks having a super star. Have

we even decided what constitutes a super star?

When we decide that, then we must determine how many there are in

the NBA and, if their team isn't winning it all, why not? Can they still

be a super star and their team not win it all?

Then, where do these super stars come from? Are they drafted and

then become great? Do they always stay with the team who drafted

them? If not, why not? What makes them a super star? Is it because

of how great they are, individually, or how good they make the team

that they are playing with?

Is it possible that the Hawks might develop their very own super star?

If not, where must he come from and how do we get him to become

a Hawk? If he or they don't want to be here, as were CP3 and Superman,

we still face the same problem.

Finally, a player may be a super star in one person's eye and not in

another. Who gets to decide? So many questions.

I'm sure each and every one of you have the perfect solution, don't you?

No? Then perhaps you know some of the answers. Please share.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Some of you don't remember maybe or weren't around but we had a superstar in Nique with the Hawks and didn't win. We had great coaching, a shot blocking rebounding center and a Allstar power forward. We had a great sharp shooter at the two and a good defensive pg. We had Ted Turner. Everything we are clamering for now. Why didn't we win?Laugh if you want, but the NBA wanted the Celtics and Lakers to win for ratings. We got screwed and tatood by the refs in the Boston garden time after time. I actually got on a plane and went to some of those games and almost landed in jail after on of them. Of, course they had a pretty damn good team themselves with Larry Legend and his bunch.

Honestly though, who outside of Nique could be considered an All-Star caliber player back then? Doc was a real good PG,but he was only a 1 time All-Star. The same could be said about Mookie. Kevin Willis came into his own in the 90s, not when Nique was in his prime in the 80s. Nique was going up against teams that not only had multiple All-Stars, but future Hall of Fame players.

Even when we got Moses Malone, he was on the tail end of his career. He had the real good season in 1989, but Willis was hurt. Then in 1990, his age really started to show, and the Hawks suffered for it. In other words, Nique played with some good players, but they were fringe All-Stars at best.

Honestly, Nique needed a Joe Johnson level player to help him back then. Those teams in the 80s and early 90s were just too strong, even with the talent that Nique had. He couldn't do it all by himself, even if he tried to do it. It's a shame that ownership was so scared to lose him for nothing, that they traded him off the 1993 team . . trying to get value for him.

[Jody23]

Like Jordan had Pippen, like Magic had Kareem...what Nique needed was ANOTHER superstar. Nothing less.

[Admin]

Some of you don't remember maybe or weren't around but we had a superstar in Nique with the Hawks and didn't win. We had great coaching, a shot blocking rebounding center and a Allstar power forward. We had a great sharp shooter at the two and a good defensive pg. We had Ted Turner. Everything we are clamering for now. Why didn't we win?Laugh if you want, but the NBA wanted the Celtics and Lakers to win for ratings. We got screwed and tatood by the refs in the Boston garden time after time. I actually got on a plane and went to some of those games and almost landed in jail after on of them. Of, course they had a pretty damn good team themselves with Larry Legend and his bunch.

Please also add that the fans still didn't show up to support the team during those glory years with Nique.

And you're right the league has actively gone out of their way to make sure Atlanta didn't win in a lot of big games over the years.

[Admin]

And damn I can't believe how many have already lost faith (likely never had any) in Danny Ferry not even 1.5 seasons into his tenure.

[Jody23]

And damn I can't believe how many have already lost faith (likely never had any) in Danny Ferry not even 1.5 seasons into his tenure.

I'll readily admit I've been critical, but moreso of the direction he's taking than Ferry himself. I like Ferry. The guy knows basketball. But I also realize he's got bosses he works for who may very well affect the direction he's allowed to take just like they did with the guys before Ferry. We all know that with the ASG, the basketball doesn't come first. If I end up being wrong about the avenue Ferry's taking to try to build a championship team, then I'll admit it.