Official Game Thread: Hawks - Raptors

[ViperXX79]

Because it's skewed heavily by the top 10 guys. Here's the average salary by tier through the top 50.

1-10: $14.4 million

11-20: $8.2 million (Jeff Teague makes 8 million, 16th highest)

21-30: $5.3 million

31-40: $3.3 million

41-50: $2.5 million

You can say that those of us who are objective about him dislike him but after 5 years of up and down inconsistent play I think we are more than justified in our critique, especially seeing him get progressively worse the past 3 years. I'm not sure how you guys who like him so much can gloss over the FACT that he's gotten worse from 2011 to 2012, worse from 2012 to 2013 and now worse from 2013 to 2014. Those are FACTS so while his pay and responsibility has gone up his value to the team has gone down.

An internet forum is no place for facts.

[Admin]

You wanna talk about guys bringing real value? These are all guys who are performing way over their contracts for their teams.

Curry

.213 WS/48

$11 million

Lowry

.202 WS/48

$5.9 million

Dragic

.193 WS/48

$7.5 million

Lillard

.160 WS/48

$3.2 million

Conley

.155 WS/48

8 million

Thomas

.154 WS/48

885K

Wall

.134 WS/48

$6 million

Irving

.127 WS/48

$5.8 million

Rubio

.120 WS/48

$3.2 million

Then you've got Teague who's got Chalmers, K. Walker, Ellis, and Jennings just above him in WS/48 and well I gotta be honest, that's not exactly elite company.

Teague

0.79 WS/48 (career high 1.31, career average .100)

$8 million

[DatWerkk]

Is this thread a joke??

If we polled EVERY SINGLE executive and coach in the NBA, EVERY SINGLE basketball writer, EVERY SINGLE popular stat head, and asked them all to pick the better point guard out of Teague or Lowry, I would bet all of my salary FOR THE REST OF MY MOTHER BLEEPIN LIFE that Lowry would win in an epic, monumental landslide.

It's one thing to question whether Teague will be better than Lowry in the future, but the ignorance and homerism it takes to question who is better right now is beyond human comprehension.

This is the most preposterous debate I have ever witnessed on here.

[buckeye242424]

Is this thread a joke??

If we polled EVERY SINGLE executive and coach in the NBA, EVERY SINGLE basketball writer, EVERY SINGLE popular stat head, and asked them all to pick the better point guard out of Teague or Lowry, I would bet all of my salary FOR THE REST OF MY MOTHER BLEEPIN LIFE that Lowry would win in an epic, monumental landslide.

It's one thing to question whether Teague will be better than Lowry in the future, but the ignorance and homerism it takes to question who is better right now is beyond human comprehension.

This is the most preposterous debate I have ever witnessed on here.

Your salary? I call. Danny Ferry would. Pay me.

[Sothron]

An internet forum is no place for facts.

You mean like the guy earlier that said he looked at all the stats and Teague was better in Lowry in every stat then once Dolf started actually listing their stats he disappeared from the thread? And actually had the gall to say that Dolf was the laughingstock?

This place is sometimes the best entertainment you can find anywhere. People can actually post something as goofball nuts as that guy and actually expect to be taken seriously.

[DatWerkk]

Your salary? I call. Danny Ferry would. Pay me.

So Danny Ferry = a landslide?

[MaceCase]

Well all Jeffrey cost Danny was 8mil. Lowry would have cost him a pick and prospect too if he was even available during the summer so it's hard to phrase the debate as though both Lowry were sitting out there and Danny went with Jeffrey instead.

[DatWerkk]

Well all Jeffrey cost Danny was 8mil. Lowry would have cost him a pick and prospect too if he was even available during the summer so it's hard to phrase the debate as though both Lowry were sitting out there and Danny went with Jeffrey instead.

Look, don't get me wrong. I can't speak for Dolfan but I'm fine with Jeff Teague being my PG, for now at least. I wasn't one of the people who wanted to trade him at the deadline. And you're right, Lowry would cost his salary plus draft picks if we wanted him this season, and that makes it an uneven comparison. That's not how I'm looking at it. I'm just saying when you compare these two players, one of them is very obviously better than the other one, and I think it's ridiculous that some people think otherwise.

[Duff_Man]

So Danny Ferry = a landslide?

Stevie Nicks = Landslide

[lethalweapon3]

Next thread: Jeff Teague versus Brian Roberts!

~lw3

[macdaddy]

Is this thread a joke??

If we polled EVERY SINGLE executive and coach in the NBA, EVERY SINGLE basketball writer, EVERY SINGLE popular stat head, and asked them all to pick the better point guard out of Teague or Lowry, I would bet all of my salary FOR THE REST OF MY MOTHER BLEEPIN LIFE that Lowry would win in an epic, monumental landslide.

It's one thing to question whether Teague will be better than Lowry in the future, but the ignorance and homerism it takes to question who is better right now is beyond human comprehension.

This is the most preposterous debate I have ever witnessed on here.

I can't speak for all the Teague supporters but what i'd say is that Lowry is having a breakout year in his 9th year in the league. Before this he was a 11/5 guy for 3 different teams. Which is fine. Great for him. But the criticism for Teague seems to be that this is as good as he gets and if he hasn't figured it out by now he's never going to. This is year 5 and his first two he barely got off the bench. In Lowry's 5th year he 9/4.5 with 1.7 turnovers a game. Shooting 40% from the field and 28% from 3.

[Admin]

Next thread: Jeff Teague versus Brian Roberts!

~lw3

What's the 2nd baseman of the NY Yankees have to do with this?

[Admin]

I can't speak for all the Teague supporters but what i'd say is that Lowry is having a breakout year in his 9th year in the league. Before this he was a 11/5 guy for 3 different teams. Which is fine. Great for him. But the criticism for Teague seems to be that this is as good as he gets and if he hasn't figured it out by now he's never going to. This is year 5 and his first two he barely got off the bench. In Lowry's 5th year he 9/4.5 with 1.7 turnovers a game. Shooting 40% from the field and 28% from 3.

Did you know that according to WS/48, Lowry has had 5 seasons as good or better than Teague's best season of 3 years ago? Only his 2nd year in the league was he as bad as Teague has been this year and his career average is .135, which is higher than Teague's career high of .131 and much higher than Teague's career average of .100. Look I'd be all for believing that Teague is getting better and can still improve if this weren't his 3rd straight year of trending down. I'm just not sure how you guys are ignoring that with your Marvin colored glasses.

[macdaddy]

Did you know that according to WS/48, Lowry has had 5 seasons as good or better than Teague's best season of 3 years ago? Only his 2nd year in the league was he as bad as Teague has been this year and his career average is .135, which is higher than Teague's career high of .131 and much higher than Teague's career average of .100. Look I'd be all for believing that Teague is getting better and can still improve if this weren't his 3rd straight year of trending down. I'm just not sure how you guys are ignoring that with your Marvin colored glasses.

Seriously though? I don't think anyone is ignoring anything. I"m just not basing all my opinions on the win shares stat. Are you really saying that you liked Teague's play two years ago more than this year? Does that pass the eyeball test? I think his stats are down because he's pushing to do more, to be better and he's failing sometimes vs only trying to do what he's comfortable doing. I'm not sure how you can look at Lowry's 5th year and make the case that it's as good as Teague's 5th year (this year).

[Admin]

Seriously though? I don't think anyone is ignoring anything. I"m just not basing all my opinions on the win shares stat. Are you really saying that you liked Teague's play two years ago more than this year? Does that pass the eyeball test? I think his stats are down because he's pushing to do more, to be better and he's failing sometimes vs only trying to do what he's comfortable doing. I'm not sure how you can look at Lowry's 5th year and make the case that it's as good as Teague's 5th year (this year).

I didn't watch Lowry then so I can't compare them with the eyeball test but yeah I do believe Teague was much more beneficial to the team 3 years ago. Now his usage is way up, his shooting percentages are way down and he's turning the ball over more. He's just not a guy who should be more than the 4th or 5th option and that's fine but it's not worth 8 million per season.

[SalvorMallow]

Did you know that according to WS/48, Lowry has had 5 seasons as good or better than Teague's best season of 3 years ago? Only his 2nd year in the league was he as bad as Teague has been this year and his career average is .135, which is higher than Teague's career high of .131 and much higher than Teague's career average of .100. Look I'd be all for believing that Teague is getting better and can still improve if this weren't his 3rd straight year of trending down. I'm just not sure how you guys are ignoring that with your Marvin colored glasses.

I'm sure win shares are a great way to get a summary of how a player performs on the court, but I feel there's no way that that should be the ONLY thing that is considered when evaluating a player. If that was the case, it would be super easy to evaluate talent and there would be no room for questions about the value of players.

[GrimeyKidd]

What's the 2nd baseman of the NY Yankees have to do with this?

pelicans lol

[Atlantaholic]

Lowry turned the corner when he started hitting threes, something he did not do at all early on. However, his season this year has been on another level, at 27 years of age, have to wonder if the fact this is a contract year has anything to do with his bump in play. I remember reading an article years ago that looked at the fact that when average players have a career year at 27/28 or older the vast majority of them come back down to earth the following seasons. Most of those years coincided with contract years.

[Admin]

I'm sure win shares are a great way to get a summary of how a player performs on the court, but I feel there's no way that that should be the ONLY thing that is considered when evaluating a player. If that was the case, it would be super easy to evaluate talent and there would be no room for questions about the value of players.

It's not the only thing. We can also look at A/TO ratio, shooting %'s, efficieny %'s, EFF (efficiency as a rating), +/-, etc. etc. and you'll see he's not in the same league as PGs I've mentioned elsewhere in this thread and in others.

[AHawks89]

Crazy thread. Regardless of what the stats show, I much rather have Teague as my starting PG.

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