Merged: Greg Monroe

[BrazilianHawk]

I'm not going to get carried away with Tim Duncan comparison. Monroe will never be the 1st team All NBA Defender that Duncan was......but I see no reason why he won't be an all star.

 

I have to ask this question. If Ferry only wanted to sign Milsap to a 2 year deal at the age 28. Than why would he want him for 4 years at the age of 30 ?

 

Because he delivered? Because he turned out to be a great fit in our system.

 

And there's no guarantee he would be signed to a 4 year deal next offseason. DF could offer an extension, couldn't he?

[Diesel]

I'm not going to get carried away with Tim Duncan comparison. Monroe will never be the 1st team All NBA Defender that Duncan was......but I see no reason why he won't be an all star.

 

I have to ask this question. If Ferry only wanted to sign Milsap to a 2 year deal at the age 28. Than why would he want him for 4 years at the age of 30 ?

 

To answer your question, Millsap has proven himself.  Don't say this too loud but Sap was coming off of a bad year when we picked him up.  Things with him, Kanter, Jefferson, and Favors just wasn't working out.  DFerry kinda got Sap in a prove yourself contract and I believe that Millsap has definitely proved himself... Especially with Bud.  The 70 foot statue of Millsap is no accident.  I think he has a place here in Atlanta and I don't think Ferry would want to risk Sap on the bidding system if we can get him to reup this year.

They talk about how tight knit our team is right now, I think that because of that and him being a team leader, Sapp may take the deal.

[Diesel]

I'd venture to say Monroe fits even better. I like Millsap a lot but I'd absolutely consider this.

 

True.. but the question is does Horf fit still?  I know Horf PNR... got that but Horf has never played PF.

[BrazilianHawk]

I'd venture to say Monroe fits even better. I like Millsap a lot but I'd absolutely consider this.

 

the fact is, we wouldn't know until he has played under Bud's system. He could be great, or he could be not.

 

I'd keep Sap, we already know what he brings... It's a lot, on a good contract no less.

 

 

 

We should be talking about improving what NEEDS improvement.

Edited July 2, 2014 by BrazilianHawk

[Admin]

True.. but the question is does Horf fit still?  I know Horf PNR... got that but Horf has never played PF.

 

I'm sure Horf could play there quite well. Not like there's a heck of a lot of difference between PF and C these days anyway. Most of the guys he faces at C are really PF's

[Admin]

the fact is, we wouldn't know until he has played under Bud's system. He could be great, or he could be not.

 

I'd keep Sap, we already know what he brings... It's a lot, on a good contract no less.

 

 

 

We should be talking about improving what NEEDS improvement.

 

On a good contract? He's on an expiring contract and he'll either be gone next year or he's very likely to get a healthy raise if he has another good year. 

 

Monroe passes extremely well, better than Millsap, he's an equal or better scorer in the post and equal or better rebounder. Those are all things that will fit in perfectly with our system. The only question is his defense but you don't get Monroe expecting him to be a stud defender. 

[macdaddy]

On a good contract? He's on an expiring contract and he'll either be gone next year or he's very likely to get a healthy raise if he has another good year. 

 

Monroe passes extremely well, better than Millsap, he's an equal or better scorer in the post and equal or better rebounder. Those are all things that will fit in perfectly with our system. The only question is his defense but you don't get Monroe expecting him to be a stud defender. 

 

And we need to remember that we truly play team defense.   Monroe has been stuck in the land of chuckers on dysfunctional teams and still was very good.   

[Admin]

And we need to remember that we truly play team defense.   Monroe has been stuck in the land of chuckers on dysfunctional teams and still was very good.   

 

His offense and rebounding have been good. His defense has been some of the worst I've ever seen. But I'm not sure if that's coaching or not. I know he wasn't that bad at G'Town and I'm sure @phoostal can attest to that since he's a fan of that classless team ;)

[coachx]

On a good contract? He's on an expiring contract and he'll either be gone next year or he's very likely to get a healthy raise if he has another good year. 

 

Monroe passes extremely well, better than Millsap, he's an equal or better scorer in the post and equal or better rebounder. Those are all things that will fit in perfectly with our system. The only question is his defense but you don't get Monroe expecting him to be a stud defender. 

I'd say Monroe's rebounding is better then Milsap and so is his post scoring.

 

Playing with both Josh Smith and Drummond caused his rebound % to go down, as expected. However, its still better then Milsap. I mean Drummond grabbed nearly 14 rpg but Monroe still managed 9.3 rpg while playing with him. Milsap brought down 8.5 rpg without playing with elite rebounder like Drummond or a above average rebounding "SF" like Josh Smith.

 

IMO, opinion Monroe will easily snag over 10 rpg if he is not playing next to Drummond.

 

IMO the post scoring is not "even" b/c Monroe can be deadly in the post against both Centers and PFs.

 

We also have to realize that with Monroe just turning 24, on June 4th, that  there is a high probability of improvement. Especially with excellent coaching.........and we have heard several Hawks say Coach Bud prepared them better then any coach they have ever had.

 

Milsap will turn 30 this season. He is not going to improve any more. He jumper may improve as his athletic ability declines causing there to be no net gain.

Edited July 2, 2014 by coachx

[Admin]

I'd say Monroe's rebounding is better then Milsap and so is his post scoring.

 

Playing with both Josh Smith and Drummond caused his rebound % to go down, as expected. However, its still better then Milsap. I mean Drummond grabbed nearly 14 rpg but Monroe still managed 9.3 rpg while playing with him. Milsap brought down 8.5 rpg without playing with elite rebounder like Drummond or a above average rebounding "SF" like Josh Smith.

 

IMO, opinion Monroe will easily snag over 10 rpg if he is not playing next to Drummond.

 

IMO the post scoring is not "even" b/c Monroe can be deadly in the post against both Centers and PFs.

 

We also have to realize that with Monroe just turning 24 on June 4th causes a there to be a high probability of improvement. Especially with excellent coaching.........and we have heard several Hawks say Coach Bud prepared them better then any coach they have ever had.

 

Milsap will turn 30 this season. He is not going to improve any more. He jumper may improve as his athletic ability declines causing there to be no net gain.

 

I said even or better on post scoring and rebounding. Millsap is very good in both areas and I think if he spent more time in the paint his rebound % would have been higher. 

 

Agree about Millsap's age and improvement vs that of Monroe. 

[coachx]

I said even or better on post scoring and rebounding. Millsap is very good in both areas and I think if he spent more time in the paint his rebound % would have been higher. 

 

Agree about Millsap's age and improvement vs that of Monroe. 

My bad.......... poor reading comprehension on my part.

[Diesel]

I'm sure Horf could play there quite well. Not like there's a heck of a lot of difference between PF and C these days anyway. Most of the guys he faces at C are really PF's

 

Actually...  The role of PF has changed a lot.   Haven't you seen the rise of the stretch PF.   While I believe that the High PNR will always have a place, if you have a slashing guard, you need a PF who can draw the defense out.   We gave Miami the blueprint to beat Indy. Indy was much better than us or Miami but we made Hibbert useless with our stretch PF and our stretch C (even though he couldn't hit the broad side of a barn). Miami did the same thing and because they have Bosh, Bosh was able to make them pay for not covering him outside.

 

Horf is definitely high pick and roll, pick and pop but that's at C.  At PF, he needs to have the same kind of range that Sap showed otherwise defenses would PF having one foot in the lane.

[Vol4ever]

On a good contract? He's on an expiring contract and he'll either be gone next year or he's very likely to get a healthy raise if he has another good year. 

 

Monroe passes extremely well, better than Millsap, he's an equal or better scorer in the post and equal or better rebounder. Those are all things that will fit in perfectly with our system. The only question is his defense but you don't get Monroe expecting him to be a stud defender. 

 

Who is a stud defensive big we should go after then if that is our weakness?

[Diesel]

Who is a stud defensive big we should go after then if that is our weakness?

 

Defense (especially in the post) is a smokescreen.  We play team defense that relies on bodies being in positions rather than individual abilities.   That talk about Monroe being a bad defender is irrelevant.  Once he gets here, his rebounding will make him a great defender.  Our defense is limiting teams to 1 shot.  Our offense does the rest.   Therefore, we need high effeciency in rebounding and on offense than we need in blocks.  Blocks would be nice, but it's not a necessity.

If we went with a Horf for Monroe trade, signed Millsap to a 4 yr extension and picked up Deng, Ariza, or Chandler, we'd be in the ECF this year.

[Vol4ever]

Defense (especially in the post) is a smokescreen.  We play team defense that relies on bodies being in positions rather than individual abilities.   That talk about Monroe being a bad defender is irrelevant.  Once he gets here, his rebounding will make him a great defender.  Our defense is limiting teams to 1 shot.  Our offense does the rest.   Therefore, we need high effeciency in rebounding and on offense than we need in blocks.  Blocks would be nice, but it's not a necessity.

If we went with a Horf for Monroe trade, signed Millsap to a 4 yr extension and picked up Deng, Ariza, or Chandler, we'd be in the ECF this year.

Im not in total disagreement with you here, but I do think a shot blocker can make a difference.

[BrazilianHawk]

Adding Monroe to occupy Millsap's place COULD result in a slight improvement overall, I'll give you that.

 

But I don't think the slight improvement would be worth the "only 4M more" we would have to pay Monroe.

 

This money should be used to acquire someone who would result in great improvement, be it a SG or SF.

 

No need to mess up with what's good.

 

On a good contract? He's on an expiring contract and he'll either be gone next year or he's very likely to get a healthy raise if he has another good year. 

 

Monroe passes extremely well, better than Millsap, he's an equal or better scorer in the post and equal or better rebounder. Those are all things that will fit in perfectly with our system. The only question is his defense but you don't get Monroe expecting him to be a stud defender. 

 

I don't know that an expiring contract can't be a good contract.

 

We don't know whether Millsap would ask for a massive paycheck next offseason or not. He is going to be 30, after all.

 

"Will fit" sounds a lot different than "has fit" to me. Millsap has proven himself, he's a big part of our relative success. Not giving him away for "will fit... who knows... perhaps... maybe, someday..."

Edited July 2, 2014 by BrazilianHawk

[Admin]

Actually...  The role of PF has changed a lot.   Haven't you seen the rise of the stretch PF.   While I believe that the High PNR will always have a place, if you have a slashing guard, you need a PF who can draw the defense out.   We gave Miami the blueprint to beat Indy. Indy was much better than us or Miami but we made Hibbert useless with our stretch PF and our stretch C (even though he couldn't hit the broad side of a barn). Miami did the same thing and because they have Bosh, Bosh was able to make them pay for not covering him outside.

 

Horf is definitely high pick and roll, pick and pop but that's at C.  At PF, he needs to have the same kind of range that Sap showed otherwise defenses would PF having one foot in the lane.

 

Actually... Al does have that range. He said last year he had worked on his 3pt game and was quite proficient at it. He's more than capable of stretching the D. 

Who is a stud defensive big we should go after then if that is our weakness?

 

If Robin Lopez is available I'd really try and make a run after him. He'd fill the Tiago Splitter role perfectly. 

[Diesel]

Im not in total disagreement with you here, but I do think a shot blocker can make a difference.

 

A shot blocker would be gravy... which is why I really wanted Asik.  However, it's not necessary.  How many blocks does the Spurs get as a team?

I'll help you, San Antonio gets 5.1 bpg.  We get 4.0.

I think more telling however is that San Antonio gets 1.1 more rebs than their opponents and our opponents get 3.5 more rebounds than us.

[ATLscrubLove]

I'd go for Monroe and keep Horford... Millsap is going to command a much larger contract next offseason. I know he stepped up last year when Horford went down but I didn't really get to see enough with both of them on the floor to determine if it is a good fit. The only problem with moving Horford to the 4 is that he can't stretch the floor and shoot the long ball. I'd go for a sign and trade for Monroe ( which I heard Detroit would want to do if they don't match a max offer ). Send them Millsap, Salmons ( salary dump and maybe a second round pick to make them happy. That should leave us with about $8 mill or so to low ball Deng with lol.

[Admin]

Adding Monroe to occupy Millsap's place COULD result in a slight improvement overall, I'll give you that.

 

But I don't think the slight improvement would be worth the "only 4M more" we would have to pay Monroe.

 

This money should be used to acquire someone who would result in great improvement, be it a SG or SF.

 

No need to mess up with what's good.

 

 

I don't know that an expiring contract can't be a good contract.

 

We don't know whether Millsap would ask for a massive paycheck next offseason or not. He is going to be 30, after all.

 

"Will fit" sounds a lot different than "has fit" to me. Millsap has proven himself, he's a big part of our relative success. Not giving him away for "will fit... who knows... perhaps... maybe, someday..."

 

It's a very minimal risk that Monroe wouldn't fit. If you haven't watched him play since college maybe I can understand your trepidation, but I'm not in the least worried that he'd fit in our system.