The Tank Thread

[Diesel]

On 4/30/2018 at 1:22 PM, Jungle Jack said:

Hard not to feel like TV and other ancillary income has given ownership the cover to purposely imploding as well.   Hopefully Silver will affect change.  The deck is certainly rigged considering his employer to say the least.

Silver is not going to change something that he controls.  The League controls the draft lottery.  So tanking is moot.  They can promote anybody they want. 

[JayBirdHawk]

2 hours ago, Diesel said:

If you can't see how making your team better gets you more money on the resale then you've missed it.   We sold this team after our best season ever...   Gearon and Co. are smiling. 

 

Why though? The  Context and circumstances of the sale matters. (Ehem DF)

Hawks weren't a tanking team for 3/4 years before the sale, they were perinnial playoff victims losing sometimes in historic fashion.

 

Edited May 4, 2018 by JayBirdHawk

[AHF]

2 hours ago, Diesel said:

If you can't see how making your team better gets you more money on the resale then you've missed it.   We sold this team after our best season ever...   Gearon and Co. are smiling. 

 

So you are assuming that tanking is the best way to get your team better correct?  If the goal is to improve the team and flip it then you take the best path to improvement and then cash out.  

[DBac]

Tonight's Philly game has been one of the most blatant fixes I've seen.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Well, that's 10 straight losses by the Raptors to Lebron.  I guess they should blow the entire team up and start from scratch. May as well tank it away.

Edited May 8, 2018 by TheNorthCydeRises

[AHF]

4 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Well, that's 10 straight losses by the Raptors to Lebron.  I guess they should blow the entire team up and start from scratch. May as well tank it away.

They are one significant piece from being a contender.  Not a legit contender today.

[DBac]

4 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Well, that's 10 straight losses by the Raptors to Lebron.  I guess they should blow the entire team up and start from scratch. May as well tank it away.

Nah, they won 55+ games and are generally pretty young.

[KB21]

7 hours ago, DBac said:

Nah, they won 55+ games and are generally pretty young.

But the entire rationale for tanking is to suck while LeBron is still great because you can’t beat him.  It doesn’t matter if you can beat everyone else.  If you can’t beat a player who has lead his team to 7 consecutive NBA finals, you should just suck for years on end and hope you can compete when he retires.  

[DBac]

 

28 minutes ago, KB21 said:

But the entire rationale for tanking is to suck while LeBron is still great because you can’t beat him.  It doesn’t matter if you can beat everyone else.  If you can’t beat a player who has lead his team to 7 consecutive NBA finals, you should just suck for years on end and hope you can compete when he retires.  

They are pretty young. It's not the same situation as the Hawks last year.

 

[KB21]

I have a hard time visualizating how appropriate player development can be done when winning is not your goal?   How do you develop players to play winning basketball when you are wanting to lose as much as possible?

[MaceCase]

The Hawks have lost to the Wizards, Pacers twice, Celtics twice, Bulls, Magic, and Cavs three times over the ten years they were in the playoffs with half of those losses being in the 1st round.  That's a different story getting knocked out by numerous teams than just running into LeBron.

If LeBron goes out West or even just suffers an injury the Raptors have a chance to represent the East in the Finals with the exact same roster.  The Hawks OTOH have had trouble separating themselves from the rest of the pack to claim that LeBron was their only obstacle.

[MaceCase]

Simple, you put young guys in situations to perform and learn from rather than solely relying on vets that have been there and done that.

[KB21]

8 minutes ago, MaceCase said:

Simple, you put young guys in situations to perform and learn from rather than solely relying on vets that have been there and done that.

Then those young players develop bad habits that causes the team to lose games.  This is why it takes so long to even get to the point of being good.  You can’t stress developing winning habits in losing situations.  

Edited May 8, 2018 by KB21

[MaceCase]

1 minute ago, KB21 said:

Then those young players develop bad habits that causes the team to lose games.  This is why it takes so long to even get to the point of being good.  You can’t stress developing winning habits in losing situations.  

You absolutely can but notice I said not to rely solely on vets and nothing about just letting young guys run around out there. 

The idea is you need to put the young guys in a position to learn how to succeed.  I can give an example: if it comes down to a game winning shot, you can draw a play up for the trusty reliable vet or you can call on the young guy.  Make or miss, you live with the result and use it as a teaching opportunity to either grow upon or learn to do better next time.  That is the emphasis of sacrificing wins for development.

[KB21]

The desire to let the young kids just run around without structure is why this team has moved on from a great coach in Bud, and why this coaching search will end with them hiring a no name coach from the Philly staff. 

[parfait]

14 minutes ago, KB21 said:

The desire to let the young kids just run around without structure is why this team has moved on from a great coach in Bud, and why this coaching search will end with them hiring a no name coach from the Philly staff. 

He's not a no name just because you hadn't heard of him.

Remember, he was mentioned to the media by the widest range of league personnel of all of the assistant coaches out there.

[KB21]

3 minutes ago, parfait said:

He's not a no name just because you hadn't heard of him.

Remember, he was mentioned to the media by the widest range of league personnel of all of the assistant coaches out there.

LOL if you truly buy that.  

[KB21]

30 minutes ago, parfait said:

He's not a no name just because you hadn't heard of him.

Remember, he was mentioned to the media by the widest range of league personnel of all of the assistant coaches out there.

The bad thing is, he might turn into a capable head coach down the road, but he has no chance of having success in Atlanta in this situation.  

[parfait]

28 minutes ago, KB21 said:

LOL if you truly buy that.  

Well, it was written by Kevin Arnovitz of ESPN, who carries far less bias regarding the Hawks (zero) than naysayers such as yourself (infiniti).

[deester11]

33 minutes ago, parfait said:

Well, it was written by Kevin Arnovitz of ESPN, who carries far less bias regarding the Hawks (zero) than naysayers such as yourself (infiniti).

Naysayers? He's downright miserable.  Anyone who is this negative about every move....knows more than Arnovitz's of the world!