Trae Young - The Man, The Viper, and The Prosecution aka The MVP aka Ice Trae

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

Luka, Morant, Lillard, Harden, Murray, and Fox don't do any of that any better than Trae. 

3B my a$$!

[kg01]

7 hours ago, AHF said:

.... Atlanta players are assumed to be garbage until they put up the wins.  The Hawks ECF run was the only time I’ve really seen the media respect Trae.

This is the thing.  Why does it take that for one guy to get a semblance of respect?  Meanwhile dudes that ain't never led a team anywhere get the benefit of the doubt... and the accolades that come with it.

[NBASupes]

9 hours ago, AHF said:

So what did Ja do to get ranked #3?  Definitely not what you are describing.  I think what will primarily get Trae respect is the number of wins the Hawks get.  As long as we are .500 they will focus on his limitations and ignore what he is great at.  
 

That doesn’t mean you are wrong about things he can work on - he can and should improve in those items.  I just think if the Hawks were winning 50+ games last year while Memphis was barely .500 we would be having a different conversation regardless of their individual merits.

Atlanta players are assumed to be garbage until they put up the wins.  The Hawks ECF run was the only time I’ve really seen the media respect Trae.

Depends of the Ja you talking about.

1st half of last year Ja was a top 5 NBA player who ran an offense an elite level, tremendous decision maker, improved shooter, and just one of the best PGs we seen in some time.

2nd half Ja wasn't good. He wasn't in the tier of players that's even top 10 in his position and his off court issues were massive. 

But people will give that benefit of doubt to Ja. 

When professional writers put Trae with Kyrie and use trust in the same sentence, that's not good for Trae or Kyrie. 

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

This is the thing.  Why does it take that for one guy to get a semblance of respect?  Meanwhile dudes that ain't never led a team anywhere get the benefit of the doubt... and the accolades that come with it.

They honestly just don't like Trae's game. That's the biggest issue. 

[kg01]

41 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

They honestly just don't like Trae's game. That's the biggest issue. 

I'm cool if they just don't like his game, his face, whatever.  But they're supposed to be unbiased.  Elevating guys who's games are similar, but that they just happen to like, is unprofessional.  That's fine too.  I guess they're no longer in the business of 'telling the story', so the old journalistic standards are out the window.

We, as consumers, should stop putting their opinions on pedestals.  The reality is they've dumbed themselves down to the level of common fans, thus they should be treated as such.  We need to start acknowledging the fallacy that what they write is based on some level of understanding that exceeds our own.

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, kg01 said:

I'm cool if they just don't like his game, his face, whatever.  But they're supposed to be unbiased.  Elevating guys who's games are similar, but that they just happen to like, is unprofessional.  That's fine too.  I guess they're no longer in the business of 'telling the story', so the old journalistic standards are out the window.

We, as consumers, should stop putting their opinions on pedestals.  The reality is they've dumbed themselves down to the level of common fans, thus they should be treated as such.  We need to start acknowledging the fallacy that what they write is based on some level of understanding that exceeds our own.

Amen  

[djjob23]

16 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I'm cool if they just don't like his game, his face, whatever.  But they're supposed to be unbiased.  Elevating guys who's games are similar, but that they just happen to like, is unprofessional.  That's fine too.  I guess they're no longer in the business of 'telling the story', so the old journalistic standards are out the window.

We, as consumers, should stop putting their opinions on pedestals.  The reality is they've dumbed themselves down to the level of common fans, thus they should be treated as such.  We need to start acknowledging the fallacy that what they write is based on some level of understanding that exceeds our own.

100% THIS!  

Edited August 23, 2023 by djjob23

[Jdawgflow]

Trae will not get respect until he leads us to a title.  He may not even get it then.

[kg01]

3 minutes ago, Jdawgflow said:

Trae will not get respect until he leads us to a title.  He may not even get it then.

Youre not off here.

The ECF run is viewed as 'easy'.  I've seen some people say it should have an asterisk because, there were no fans in the stands ... yep, let that sink in.  I guess a ghost spit on Trae and chanted obscenities at him.  Smh

Folks, after the fact, claim NYK, PHI, and MIL were all easy opponents.  Totally neglecting the fact that those were among the best defenses in the league that season.  So whatever he/we did was nothing special.

It's why the terrible MIA series remains at the forefront of people's minds as they assess what Trae is as a player.  Nevermind the 24 (iirc) games where he played well in the playoffs, combined with this past season.  The 5 poor games vs MIA tell us he "can't play in the playoffs".  That new math. 

[JayBirdHawk]

Not sure what qualified as a 'bad pass'. Is it live ball turnovers? That number needs to be lower this year though.

 

 

[Spud2nique]

2 hours ago, djjob23 said:

100% THIS!  

Hunting for a like huh?  It’s a skill, like drawing a foul, good for you!  

Edited August 23, 2023 by Spud2nique

[Jdawgflow]

51 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Youre not off here.

The ECF run is viewed as 'easy'.  I've seen some people say it should have an asterisk because, there were no fans in the stands ... yep, let that sink in.  I guess a ghost spit on Trae and chanted obscenities at him.  Smh

Folks, after the fact, claim NYK, PHI, and MIL were all easy opponents.  Totally neglecting the fact that those were among the best defenses in the league that season.  So whatever he/we did was nothing special.

It's why the terrible MIA series remains at the forefront of people's minds as they assess what Trae is as a player.  Nevermind the 24 (iirc) games where he played well in the playoffs, combined with this past season.  The 5 poor games vs MIA tell us he "can't play in the playoffs".  That new math. 

Stupid common core.

[NBASupes]

3 hours ago, kg01 said:

I'm cool if they just don't like his game, his face, whatever.  But they're supposed to be unbiased.  Elevating guys who's games are similar, but that they just happen to like, is unprofessional.  That's fine too.  I guess they're no longer in the business of 'telling the story', so the old journalistic standards are out the window.

We, as consumers, should stop putting their opinions on pedestals.  The reality is they've dumbed themselves down to the level of common fans, thus they should be treated as such.  We need to start acknowledging the fallacy that what they write is based on some level of understanding that exceeds our own.

Idk about this one. We tend to like their opinions when we agree with them and hate them when we clearly don't. I've seen this a Atlanta fan regarding Vick. Matt Ryan, Andruw Jones, and Dale Murphy or basketball wise, Nique, JC, Smoove, Horford, Iso Joe, Sap, or most recently, Trae. Rarely do we have a Chipper or Greg Maddux where everyone is in agreement with. 

Most of the time, we get pissed when people say what we don't agree with. You guys and the media about Trae. You guys and me with Hunter. Etc. 

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Not sure what qualified as a 'bad pass'. Is it live ball turnovers? That number needs to be lower this year though.

 

 

As someone who watched every game and many twice, he's has a lot more than anyone else I've seen by a mile. 

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

Youre not off here.

The ECF run is viewed as 'easy'.  I've seen some people say it should have an asterisk because, there were no fans in the stands ... yep, let that sink in.  I guess a ghost spit on Trae and chanted obscenities at him.  Smh

Folks, after the fact, claim NYK, PHI, and MIL were all easy opponents.  Totally neglecting the fact that those were among the best defenses in the league that season.  So whatever he/we did was nothing special.

It's why the terrible MIA series remains at the forefront of people's minds as they assess what Trae is as a player.  Nevermind the 24 (iirc) games where he played well in the playoffs, combined with this past season.  The 5 poor games vs MIA tell us he "can't play in the playoffs".  That new math. 

I don't think that's fair on Trae. Like I said, a lot of people hate his game. Anything good is excused and anything bad is hyped. Just what people do when they don't like someone. See O'Connor bitchass

1 hour ago, Jdawgflow said:

Trae will not get respect until he leads us to a title.  He may not even get it then.

I don't believe he will ever get their respect till his game is finally the shit. 

[macdaddy]

58 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Idk about this one. We tend to like their opinions when we agree with them and hate them when we clearly don't. I've seen this a Atlanta fan regarding Vick. Matt Ryan, Andruw Jones, and Dale Murphy or basketball wise, Nique, JC, Smoove, Horford, Iso Joe, Sap, or most recently, Trae. Rarely do we have a Chipper or Greg Maddux where everyone is in agreement with. 

Most of the time, we get pissed when people say what we don't agree with. You guys and the media about Trae. You guys and me with Hunter. Etc. 

That's the case with anything and everybody.  No one hates opinions they agree with but i understand your point.

My thing with Trae is the numbers don't lie and no matter how 'mid' anyone says we have been these last three years we have been a playoff team with Trae as the far away best player on the team and league leader in points and assists.  SGA, Ja, Dame, and even the holy Luka can't say that.   So I'd say he's underrated for non-basketball reasons. 

[benhillboy]

4 hours ago, kg01 said:

I'm cool if they just don't like his game, his face, whatever.  But they're supposed to be unbiased.  Elevating guys who's games are similar, but that they just happen to like, is unprofessional.  That's fine too.  I guess they're no longer in the business of 'telling the story', so the old journalistic standards are out the window.

We, as consumers, should stop putting their opinions on pedestals.  The reality is they've dumbed themselves down to the level of common fans, thus they should be treated as such.  We need to start acknowledging the fallacy that what they write is based on some level of understanding that exceeds our own.

I jumped on that train years ago.  When Brent Barry left NBATV I haven’t consumed any well-known pundits’ opinions outside of Zach Lowe’s writing, as he’s useless on TV.  Scott Mitchell will always be my guy, he was the biggest national proponent of the 60 win team by far but it’s high time he lose the earrings lol.

When researching my MLB bets I occasionally have to quickly scroll past abject foolishness like headline video captions of SAS saying a SG is a better PG than Magic SMGDH.

[benhillboy]

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Not sure what qualified as a 'bad pass'. Is it live ball turnovers? That number needs to be lower this year though.

 

 

It’s obviously not good to lead that group but I don’t put too much stock into it; it’s a by-product of Trae being the league’s foremost lob-throwing threat, especially when his lost ball turnovers are very low for his usage.  Pretty instinctive Bigs who move very well have gotten good at breaking up his lobs:  Mitch Rob, JJJ, Mobley, Kessler, Jarrett Allen, Rob Will, Bam types.

The type of Big Trae lobs to matters as well.  I remember earlier in his career he was excellent at bounce passing to guys like Ded and Len in PNR situations who weren’t as vertically viable as John, Clint, and OO.

Edited August 23, 2023 by benhillboy

[benhillboy]

I can’t believe Jordan weighed in on the PG debate (he sent a message to SAS crowing Magic obviously). Chris Paul is the only PG with a higher career WS/48 than Magic, which is incredible seeing how many different rosters he’s played with.  A lot of people discredit Paul in some way (ill-timed injuries , persona, etc), and that’s fine, it took me until he got to Houston to fully appreciate his Greatness.

I go with Magic obviously, who’s passing + rebounding is only rivaled by Jokic, who’s much bigger and benefits from more screening, space, and movement when initiating.  I’m a Kidd fanatic: in that vein of rebounding + shot creation passing he was a poor man Magic.  Those Nets rosters he dragged to the Finals were not ideal at all: a bunch of great BUs starting.

Edited August 23, 2023 by benhillboy

[djjob23]

2 hours ago, Spud2nique said:

Hunting for a like huh?  It’s a skill, like drawing a foul, good for you!  

Haha! Nah, just looking for the and 1. Gotta support awesome posts like these!  

[AHF]

7 hours ago, kg01 said:

I'm cool if they just don't like his game, his face, whatever.  But they're supposed to be unbiased.  Elevating guys who's games are similar, but that they just happen to like, is unprofessional.  That's fine too.  I guess they're no longer in the business of 'telling the story', so the old journalistic standards are out the window.

We, as consumers, should stop putting their opinions on pedestals.  The reality is they've dumbed themselves down to the level of common fans, thus they should be treated as such.  We need to start acknowledging the fallacy that what they write is based on some level of understanding that exceeds our own.

This would be great.  I’ve just accepted that will rarely be the case with any Atlanta athlete who isn’t an elite winner.  It certainly won’t be the case for Trae when most of the media predicted him as the biggest bust of his draft class and have demonstrated they want to justify their original view even though it clearly was wrong.  So for me there is no improvement Trae can make other than winning big to get there.

8 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Depends of the Ja you talking about.

1st half of last year Ja was a top 5 NBA player who ran an offense an elite level, tremendous decision maker, improved shooter, and just one of the best PGs we seen in some time.

2nd half Ja wasn't good. He wasn't in the tier of players that's even top 10 in his position and his off court issues were massive. 

But people will give that benefit of doubt to Ja. 

When professional writers put Trae with Kyrie and use trust in the same sentence, that's not good for Trae or Kyrie. 

They honestly just don't like Trae's game. That's the biggest issue. 

I am talking about full season or full career Ja.  He has yet to have a season where he scored more efficiently than Trae including even last season.  He has yet to have a season where his passing is even in the same ballpark as Trae.  He is an obvious head are risk off the court right now.  But they keep rating him like he is better than Trae for….reasons that I think have clearly more to do with how many games Memphis wins without him.  When the team is a winning roster without you, you are going to finish the season with a good record.  Can’t really explain why they don’t get docked for never threatening in the playoffs but that is also how it used to be when they were non-contenders with nice regular season win totals before Ja.