Bogi calls out entire team after Boston loss

[Sothron]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/266003/Bogdan-Bogdanovic-We-Lost-That-Identity-On-How-To-Win-Games

 

Atlanta Hawks wing Bogdan Bogdanovic didn't mince words when talking about his team's struggles this season. After blowing a big lead and losing to the Boston Celtics, Bogdanovic said the Hawks have lost their identity.

"We lost that identity on how to win games," Bogdanovic said. "We executed bad. We didn't find a way to win the game."

Bogdanovic also said the Hawks can't be considered a good team when they lose games to undermanned teams. Boston lost Jaylen Brown early in the game to a sprained ankle. He did not return, but the Celtics still outscored the Hawks 56-33 in the second half.

"When you're up 15 and they lose one of the top two guys on the team and if you're not able to win that game, you're not a good team."

[RedDawg#8]

all facts

[macdaddy]

We should be starting Trae/Bogi/Kev/JC/Capela with a second unit of Lou/Wright,Kev/Gallo/OO.   

Trae and Bogi are the best 2 players by far right now and that lineup happens to be the one that won a ton of games and won in the playoffs last year.   the Kev/Hunter pairing is killing us. 

[marco102]

4 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

We should be starting Trae/Bogi/Kev/JC/Capela with a second unit of Lou/Wright,Kev/Gallo/OO.   

Trae and Bogi are the best 2 players by far right now and that lineup happens to be the one that won a ton of games and won in the playoffs last year.   the Kev/Hunter pairing is killing us. 

I'm assuming you mean Hunter on the second unit? 

[macdaddy]

1 minute ago, marco102 said:

I'm assuming you mean Hunter on the second unit? 

Yes.   Oops.

[Diesel]

We hope that JC can go... tomorrow.    Otherwise, I agree about Bogi.   I wanted to keep the continuity of the second unit.. where Bogi is the 1st option... but now... shoot.. ah forget it.. let's just go with the guys who want to win.   Get Slippy hands off the court and he don't have to play on the second team.. hell give me JJ or Knox. 

[JayBirdHawk]

Anyone remember when Nate said that maybe he should call more plays particularly in the 4th quarter and end of games? That's what we're paying him to do.

[Sothron]

My dad and I talked after last night's game. He was pretty upset as was I but a lot of his anger was at Nate. What offense do we actually run besides P&R with PG/Center? Our basic offense is either one of two things:

Watch Trae with the ball. Trae tries to do P&R, attack the basket with a floater or randomly shoots very long three point shots. Unless involved with the P&R the other three players literally do nothing but stand on the three point line.

Trae off court: players randomly do dribble hand offs around the three point line. The only Hawk that will attack the basket not named Trae is Bogi. What does Bogi do? Look for P&r, attack the basket with a floater or his step back jumper. Much better selection on his three point shooting than Trae.

You see something kinda novel here? It is basically a one trick pony offense. Spam PG/C P&R, stand on three point line and that's basically it. When someone not with the ball actually cuts it seems to catch the opposing defense by shock. Seriously, go back and watch game tape and see how non ball handlers that cut are given free reign to do so. 

So my dad's point is that Nate is hired to be a head coach and we've seen in his previous years Nate is a good coach. Not a great coach maybe but a good coach. Where's the actual offense? Why do we have wing players that literally will not ever cut or attack the basket? Why do we have zero low post game or even really try it?  He said teams have scouted us out and despite our being #2 on offense it isn't sustainable because we have no real offensive identity outside of spamming 1/5 P&R. 

I can't disagree with him. We spend a lot of posts on here talking about the defense (which is valid) but we don't seem to talk more about our offense. Is Trae Young not capable of playing in another system than this? We maximize him as much as we can but wouldn't it be better if he came off some screens some times? Maybe get the ball to cutters and let them attack the paint? When JC is healthy feed him in the post?

[Dynamo]

It doesn’t seem like there is an emphasis being put on players cutting or setting screens.Stagnant offense.

 

[shakes]

Bogi needs a mirror.

[Diesel]

I have evaluated Nate's offense a little.

We have the 1,5 screen.

We have the 1, 4 screen.

We run about 3-4 screens.

Last night we employed a give and go with Trae.

The truth is you see more of the ball movement plays with the 2nd Unit.   Delon and Lou run the second unit and there's fluidity of ball movement that normally ends up with Bogi taking a shot or making the correct pass.  Watching the second unit, the only time the ball stops is when we're about to shoot or when Gallo has a small guy on his hip and he's about to work him. 

Back to the first Unit...  The Ball moves when everybody is happy.   When we played Toronto in Atlanta, the Ball moved from left to right.  Usually Trae tries to get everybody involved early and he finds his points... he was extra aggressive coming off of the Chicago loss.. where he flipped the switch and he attacked the basket and got everybody involved from there. 

This is the strength of our offense.  When Trae attacks.   Then we introduce:

Goat Float.

PNP

and when the other players move... wide open threes. 

Slippy hands have been missing the wide open threes.  Kev has been missing the wide open threes. 

It's at this point that the player (Slippy hands or Kev) has to be smart enough to take the ball and drive.  The problem is Slippy hands is a turnover waiting to happen (right now).   And Kev is inconsistent.   Kev has hit some great runners...  but then he has missed some..  Worst of all, Kev avoids contact.   Like he has the plague.   Bogi and Trae go to the basket knowing that they will be touched.  Kev goes to the basket trying very hard not to get touched and it messes up his shot.   Especially against a guy like Smart.   Smart will push, touch, elbow.. just to mess with your mind... It works on Kev.   Kev becomes passive after he has been touched.  Settles for threes.  I don't know what's up with that. 

 

You might say.... That's not enough offense.  That's far more offense than Utah ever played and they dominated.   

The other thing.. I hear people calling for another ball handler to let Trae Play off ball.  I Hope that works.  I would like to see us trade for Brandon M.  but I don't know if you have another ball handler would Trae become disinterested.   Trae is a deadline standstill shooter... it would put him in his best light.   We can even Reggie Miller that thing up and let him run through screens to get to his spot.   But would he become disinterested without the ball... moreover, would he still take over the offense like he does with Delon.   I don't know if Delon Defers or if Trae takes over... but that's the pilot test right there. 

 

[Diesel]

One last thing...

The aggressive Trae that makes our offense work better... shows up on the big stage.   I'm like the doctor looking at the dying patient saying... Just get him to the playoffs.  This is what happens when you put Trae on the big stage...

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

Yep. ^

 

Nate offense stinks.

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

 

Yep. ^

 

Nate offense stinks.

JC was the main screen slipper. 

[RedDawg#8]

1 hour ago, Diesel said:

JC was the main screen slipper. 

JC is elite at slipping screens. Very underrated skillset in a player, especially a big.

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

5 hours ago, Sothron said:

My dad and I talked after last night's game. He was pretty upset as was I but a lot of his anger was at Nate. What offense do we actually run besides P&R with PG/Center? Our basic offense is either one of two things:

Watch Trae with the ball. Trae tries to do P&R, attack the basket with a floater or randomly shoots very long three point shots. Unless involved with the P&R the other three players literally do nothing but stand on the three point line.

Trae off court: players randomly do dribble hand offs around the three point line. The only Hawk that will attack the basket not named Trae is Bogi. What does Bogi do? Look for P&r, attack the basket with a floater or his step back jumper. Much better selection on his three point shooting than Trae.

You see something kinda novel here? It is basically a one trick pony offense. Spam PG/C P&R, stand on three point line and that's basically it. When someone not with the ball actually cuts it seems to catch the opposing defense by shock. Seriously, go back and watch game tape and see how non ball handlers that cut are given free reign to do so. 

So my dad's point is that Nate is hired to be a head coach and we've seen in his previous years Nate is a good coach. Not a great coach maybe but a good coach. Where's the actual offense? Why do we have wing players that literally will not ever cut or attack the basket? Why do we have zero low post game or even really try it?  He said teams have scouted us out and despite our being #2 on offense it isn't sustainable because we have no real offensive identity outside of spamming 1/5 P&R. 

I can't disagree with him. We spend a lot of posts on here talking about the defense (which is valid) but we don't seem to talk more about our offense. Is Trae Young not capable of playing in another system than this? We maximize him as much as we can but wouldn't it be better if he came off some screens some times? Maybe get the ball to cutters and let them attack the paint? When JC is healthy feed him in the post?

 

Name a PG that constantly comes off screens, other than Steph Curry, to score the basketball?  You won't find one that is also a high assist generator, doing that.

Having Trae play like Steph, will not help the offense.  What will help the offense, is guys simply making open shots, and not throwing up a ton of bricks.  @JayBirdHawk constantly points out how our guys miss wide open looks.  Even I broke down how our shooters, for the most part, are only average open 3 shooters.  We are literally the top 3 point shooting team in the league, but we don't have 1 outstanding 3 point shooter.

None of our rotation guys are over 40% from 3, but almost all of our rotation players fall around 38%, give or take a percentage point.  What happens with our guys, is they tend to run either red hot, or ice cold.

 

Games in which our rotation guys have shot less than 30% from 3 in a game.  ( min. 1 attempt )

 

Huerter - 22  . . . ( out of 54 games . . . 12 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 41% of games

Trae - 22 . . . ( out of 56 games . . . 5 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 39% of games

Collins - 20 . . .  ( out of 50 games . . . 15 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 40% of games

Gallo - 19 . . . ( out of 49 games . . . 5 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 39% of games

Hunter - 14  . . . ( out of 32 games  . . . . 8 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 44% of games

Bogi - 10 . . . . . ( out of 43 games . . . . 2 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 23% of games

 

And to illustrate the hot/cold nature of these guys, check out these same 6 players, when you see how many have shot 50%+ from 3 in a game.

 

 

Collins - 20 . . . ( out of 50 games . . . 16 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . .  shot 50%+ from 3 in 40% of games 

Gallo - 20 . . . ( out of 49 games . . . . . 15 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 41% of games

Huerter - 18 . . ( out of 54 games . . . 17 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 33% of games

Trae - 14 . . . . ( out of 56 games . . . 14 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 25% of games

Hunter - 11 . . .  ( out of 32 games . . . 7 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 34% of games 

Bogi - 10 . . . . ( out of 43 games . . . 8 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 23% of games

 

When you're a volume 3 point shooting team, it only takes a few of these guys being off, to mess up the entire offense.  Trae has the ability to compensate for bad 3 point shooting games, by getting to the FT line.  But even he needs to make multiple 3s, in order for the team to be successful.  When he doesn't, we're dead in the water.   And it seems like if he's off, the rest of the guys are just as ice cold ( in a bad way ).

The only thing the fans ask the role players to do, is make a higher volume of wide open shots.  If you have to make the extra pass to get someone else a better shot, do it.  But that guy MUST make the damn shot, if he expects the ball to be swung around to him.

 

 

[Sothron]

8 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

Name a PG that constantly comes off screens, other than Steph Curry, to score the basketball?  You won't find one that is also a high assist generator, doing that.

Having Trae play like Steph, will not help the offense.  What will help the offense, is guys simply making open shots, and not throwing up a ton of bricks.  @JayBirdHawk constantly points out how our guys miss wide open looks.  Even I broke down how our shooters, for the most part, are only average open 3 shooters.  We are literally the top 3 point shooting team in the league, but we don't have 1 outstanding 3 point shooter.

None of our rotation guys are over 40% from 3, but almost all of our rotation players fall around 38%, give or take a percentage point.  What happens with our guys, is they tend to run either red hot, or ice cold.

 

Games in which our rotation guys have shot less than 30% from 3 in a game.  ( min. 1 attempt )

 

Huerter - 22  . . . ( out of 54 games . . . 12 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 41% of games

Trae - 22 . . . ( out of 56 games . . . 5 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 39% of games

Collins - 20 . . .  ( out of 50 games . . . 15 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 40% of games

Gallo - 19 . . . ( out of 49 games . . . 5 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 39% of games

Hunter - 14  . . . ( out of 32 games  . . . . 8 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 44% of games

Bogi - 10 . . . . . ( out of 43 games . . . . 2 games in which he didn't make a 3 ) . . . . . . shot less than 30% from 3 in 23% of games

 

And to illustrate the hot/cold nature of these guys, check out these same 6 players, when you see how many have shot 50%+ from 3 in a game.

 

 

Collins - 20 . . . ( out of 50 games . . . 16 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . .  shot 50%+ from 3 in 40% of games 

Gallo - 20 . . . ( out of 49 games . . . . . 15 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 41% of games

Huerter - 18 . . ( out of 54 games . . . 17 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 33% of games

Trae - 14 . . . . ( out of 56 games . . . 14 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 25% of games

Hunter - 11 . . .  ( out of 32 games . . . 7 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 34% of games 

Bogi - 10 . . . . ( out of 43 games . . . 8 games in which he made 2 threes or more ) . . . . . shot 50%+ from 3 in 23% of games

 

When you're a volume 3 point shooting team, it only takes a few of these guys being off, to mess up the entire offense.  Trae has the ability to compensate for bad 3 point shooting games, by getting to the FT line.  But even he needs to make multiple 3s, in order for the team to be successful.  When he doesn't, we're dead in the water.   And it seems like if he's off, the rest of the guys are just as ice cold ( in a bad way ).

The only thing the fans ask the role players to do, is make a higher volume of wide open shots.  If you have to make the extra pass to get someone else a better shot, do it.  But that guy MUST make the damn shot, if he expects the ball to be swung around to him.

 

 

This is a bunch of straw man, no offense. I never said we should play Trae just like Steph. And our guys inability to hit threes or to hit them since we are the #1 3 point shooting team in the NBA isn't what I was talking about either.

What is our offense outside of pick and roll? Pretty much nothing. No one cuts to the basket. No low post plays. It is literally pick and roll and Trae or Bogi attacking as the ball handler while everyone else either stands behind the three point line or is the big involved in the pick and roll. We need more diversity in our offense. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 hour ago, RedDawg#8 said:

JC is elite at slipping screens. Very underrated skillset in a player, especially a big.

 

 

The thing about slipping screens, is there are times in which you need to hold the screen, in order to give Trae a clean opportunity to turn the corner and shoot the floater.  Capela and Collins are notorious for not holding screens.  Capela will slip a screen to get the quick roll at the basket.  Collins will do the same thing, but he also pops out to the other side of the 3 point line.

One of the things I always commented Bruno Fernando on in his rookie year, is that he always held the screen for Trae, and sought out to make contact with Trae's defender.  Bruno and Len would always hold the screen, before rolling.  Damian Jones would always slip the screen, and go quick as he could toward the basket.

Needless to say, Trae's minutes were maximized when he played with Len and Bruno, as opposed to Jones.  It's also when he really discovered how effective his floater could be.

[Diesel]

3 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Having Trae play like Steph, will not help the offense.  What will help the offense, is guys simply making open shots, and not throwing up a ton of bricks. 

 

I have said the same.  Our offense is predicated on when we have ball movement, Guys hitting open shots... and Kev and Slippy hands have been failing at this recently...

The hope is that they were skilled enough to attack instead of settle for the three.  Slippy hands is Slippy hands for a reason.   He loses the ball whenever he has to put it on the floor.   Defenders can just take it away from him like candy in a baby's hands.   Whereas there is no consistency in Kev.   You see better in Bogi and Gallo.   And for some reason, the Ball doesn't swing JC's way anymore.