I hope the Siakam deal fails to go through.

[BangHolman]

I personally don't think that Siakam is the right guy, but the whole point of building is to find your star (Trae), sign complimentary vets, draft and develop players around him, and when the time comes... consolidate some of that developing talent and assets for all-star level players that can take you to the next level. We're closing in on the later. Trae and Dejounte can't wait years for guys to develop, especially when it looks like we're a move away from competing for an Eastern Conference Championship at least.

[thecampster]

4 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Dammit, peo.  I agree with all this.

Except the 'patients' part.  There's plenty of patients here ... mental patients. 

our patients have no patience

[thecampster]

Let me try it this way.

 

Siakam - year 2 - age 23 PER36 numbers.

12.6PP36 on 50.8% FG%, efg%.537, 22 3pt%, 7.8 rp36, 3.4 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 0.9 bp36.

 

JJ - year 2 - age 20 PER36 numbers

13.6PP36 on 49.1% FG%, efg%.537, 28.8 3pt%, 9.7 rp36, 2.9 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 1.2 bp36.

 

I've bolded where each player "won" the matchup.  Comparing 21 year old JJ to 29 year old Siakam is not a fair comparison. But JJ has every a solid chance to end up just as good based on their year 2 numbers.

[Gray Mule]

COST TOO MUCH!  I continue to say this about Siakam.  What does Canada want for him?  They want a complete rebuild of their roster with several young Hawks.  Do we expect him to lead us to the NBA championship?  Yep.  Just as he did his team last season!

Wait!  What?  They didn't win it all?  Why not?  After all, they had Siakam.  You mean, he couldn't do it last season but he can if he's traded to us?  What if we trade for him and he becomes injured?  Hawks would be dead in the water.  If one of our youth goes down we have others.  But, if they are gone to Canada, - - - - 

I hope we don't do this.  Siakam costs too much!!

[JeffS17]

10 minutes ago, thecampster said:

Let me try it this way.

 

Siakam - year 2 - age 23 PER36 numbers.

12.6PP36 on 50.8% FG%, efg%.537, 22 3pt%, 7.8 rp36, 3.4 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 0.9 bp36.

 

JJ - year 2 - age 20 PER36 numbers

13.6PP36 on 49.1% FG%, efg%.537, 28.8 3pt%, 9.7 rp36, 2.9 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 1.2 bp36.

 

I've bolded where each player "won" the matchup.  Comparing 21 year old JJ to 29 year old Siakam is not a fair comparison. But JJ has every a solid chance to end up just as good based on their year 2 numbers.

The question becomes timing, no?  Even if we take this comparison at face value and assume the same trajectory -- are we comfortable not making moves to win now so that we have an all-star level PF ready in 4 years?  We have a great opportunity to win big in the next 1-4 years in my opinion, for a few reasons:

• New CBA is going to make current contenders worse in the coming years
• By making contenders worse, we have an opening to take advantage of, since we will not be negatively impacted
• DJs value contract gives us a lot of room and flexibility.  4 years from now he's up for an extension
• Trae will be eligible for a 35% max in 3 years which will be constraining on our cap space
• We have some young guys on good contracts
• Last note -- I specifically didn't call this a 1-4 window because I think with the development staff and coaching staff we will always be giving ourselves a shot.  Even if we swap a lot of pieces around -- even Trae -- I believe we will always have a chance to make a splash.

[Hawkish]

24 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

The question becomes timing, no?  Even if we take this comparison at face value and assume the same trajectory -- are we comfortable not making moves to win now so that we have an all-star level PF ready in 4 years?  We have a great opportunity to win big in the next 1-4 years in my opinion, for a few reasons:

• New CBA is going to make current contenders worse in the coming years
• By making contenders worse, we have an opening to take advantage of, since we will not be negatively impacted
• DJs value contract gives us a lot of room and flexibility.  4 years from now he's up for an extension
• Trae will be eligible for a 35% max in 3 years which will be constraining on our cap space
• We have some young guys on good contracts
• Last note -- I specifically didn't call this a 1-4 window because I think with the development staff and coaching staff we will always be giving ourselves a shot.  Even if we swap a lot of pieces around -- even Trae -- I believe we will always have a chance to make a splash.

Timing is certainly the focal point as far as keeping Trae satisfied, etc.  Having said that, check out the jump Siakam made from Year 2 to Year 3.  Is JJ capable of something similar?  

[Spud2nique]

You can’t stop the Siakam deal, you can’t even contain it.

1 minute ago, Hawkish said:

Is JJ capable of something similar?  

I’m gonna say I’d be surprised. 

[JeffS17]

3 minutes ago, Hawkish said:

Timing is certainly the focal point as far as keeping Trae satisfied, etc.  Having said that, check out the jump Siakam made from Year 2 to Year 3.  Is JJ capable of something similar?  

I hope so

I'll be very sad if we trade him.  I actually think it's more likely we trade AJ though.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 hour ago, Peoriabird said:

There is no patients here.  Some think that somehow Siakam makes this team a contender which is totally laughable.  Some of these guy really need to root for the Knicks at this point because is exactly the moves they have made year after year with the Mello's and Randles of the NBA to remain a treadmill team.

So if we stand pat, what are we now?

Are we still a .500 team?

Are we a 50 win team?

Are we top 4 in the East?

 

What is your assessment of the Hawks if we make no more moves?

[kg01]

1 hour ago, Spud2nique said:

You can’t stop the Siakam deal, you can’t even contain it.

I’m gonna say I’d be surprised. 

I'd be shocked if BenJalen JohnSimmonson isn't significantly better than Siakim this year.  That that, squd. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 hour ago, thecampster said:

Let me try it this way.

 

Siakam - year 2 - age 23 PER36 numbers.

12.6PP36 on 50.8% FG%, efg%.537, 22 3pt%, 7.8 rp36, 3.4 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 0.9 bp36.

 

JJ - year 2 - age 20 PER36 numbers

13.6PP36 on 49.1% FG%, efg%.537, 28.8 3pt%, 9.7 rp36, 2.9 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 1.2 bp36.

 

I've bolded where each player "won" the matchup.  Comparing 21 year old JJ to 29 year old Siakam is not a fair comparison. But JJ has every a solid chance to end up just as good based on their year 2 numbers.

You sure?

What we know about Siakam is that even in college, he had a high motor and a great work ethic.

With Jalen, his work ethic and loyalty has been questioned, whether it be unfair or not.

I like Jalen and have no issue seeing him develop. With Siakam, he made the jump in Year 3 and was a All-Star by Year 4.

So if Jalen is to make that jump, he MUST start at the 4 this season.

 

[thecampster]

So I just keep going back to the 15 game sample after the all-star break. His Per36 during that time equates to 15.5p/9.9r/4.7a/1.9s/1.9b on 52.9% shooting/30.4% 3pt shooting.  If that is really what we'd be looking at with him, I can't imagine trading that away.

5 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

You sure?

What we know about Siakam is that even in college, he had a high motor and a great work ethic.

With Jalen, his work ethic and loyalty has been questioned, whether it be unfair or not.

I like Jalen and have no issue seeing him develop. With Siakam, he made the jump in Year 3 and was a All-Star by Year 4.

So if Jalen is to make that jump, he MUST start at the 4 this season.

 

 

[thecampster]

I mean I posted on it multiple times but he outplayed JC post Nate with Quin.

[JeffS17]

17 minutes ago, thecampster said:

So I just keep going back to the 15 game sample after the all-star break. His Per36 during that time equates to 15.5p/9.9r/4.7a/1.9s/1.9b on 52.9% shooting/30.4% 3pt shooting.  If that is really what we'd be looking at with him, I can't imagine trading that away.

 

I think there's a decent shot he can get his three ball to 35% too which will open up his game massively.  

[Hawkish]

4 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

I think there's a decent shot he can get his three ball to 35% too which will open up his game massively.  

Pun intended?

[TheNorthCydeRises]

32 minutes ago, thecampster said:

I mean I posted on it multiple times but he outplayed JC post Nate with Quin.

This I definitely agree with. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Jalen's Weaknesses coming into the draft

 

Siakam's Weaknesses coming into the draft

 

The biggest thing I see between the two, is that most of the things listed as weakness about Siakam, center around tweaking his game and tightening up his body.  They also didn't believe he was as good as his numbers showed, due to not playing in one of the power basketball conferences.

Most of the weaknesses listed around Jalen center around consistency with his shooting and playmaking.  And they questioned his attitude and commitment, which I hope are not issues at the moment.

Siakam has vastly surpassed his projection of being Luc Mbah a Moute.  Jalen's comparison was Stephen Jackson, which is a much tougher comparison to live up to.

[kg01]

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Jalen's Weaknesses coming into the draft:

Robots

Fixed your typo... 

[AtLaS]

1 hour ago, thecampster said:

So I just keep going back to the 15 game sample after the all-star break. His Per36 during that time equates to 15.5p/9.9r/4.7a/1.9s/1.9b on 52.9% shooting/30.4% 3pt shooting.  If that is really what we'd be looking at with him, I can't imagine trading that away.

 

This all happened at age 21 in his first chance at legitimate playing time, and right after getting Quin.   On day 1 I remember a Quin interview where he was like we need to get this guy involved, he's too gifted to not be playing.  JJ responded immediately.  He also adds rim protection and plays passing lanes and is a good rebounder and can guard 5 positions, all things we will need if OO is starting.

JC is now gone so that opens up a lot more playing time.  

JJ also dominated in the summer league and g-league, was a 5 star recruit and only fell b/c of the situation at Duke.  He was a STEAL.

 

 

 

[AtLaS]

Check out dude's passing from 3-4 minutes on the second video.  VERY few players have that type of passing ability/anticipation.  Trae is one of them.  

Trade Bey or Bufkin.  We need to keep AJ and JJ.