AJC: " Hawks need to trade Trae Young"

[Final_quest]

11 minutes ago, AHF said:

I don’t know what ultimatum has been given other than Trae saying he wants to win.

My understanding of the rumor was trade the pick for a star or trade me to San Antonio.  In Trae's public interview he said "I want to win."  Behind closed doors he seems to be saying something more aggressive.  

[bird_dirt]

39 minutes ago, AHF said:

I don’t think Trae gets into the details of personnel moves and I’m pretty certain he has never had the power to override the front office on anything.  He just wants the team to be legit moving towards winning a ring and not falling away from it or treading water while shedding salary.  This is my unsourced opinion/speculation.

I recall him advocating for JC to get his bag, him stepping in and stopping them from trading CC, and pushing them to trade for Murray. 

The request to trade the pick for a player or trade him tracks. 

Top players pressure their teams into moves all the time, and I doubt Trae is any different. 

[AHF]

49 minutes ago, bird_dirt said:

I recall him advocating for JC to get his bag, him stepping in and stopping them from trading CC, and pushing them to trade for Murray. 

The request to trade the pick for a player or trade him tracks. 

Top players pressure their teams into moves all the time, and I doubt Trae is any different. 

I’m calling the biggest crock of **** on the idea that Trae specifically required the Hawks to overpay JC.  That is unbelievable BS.  I’m sure he said he wanted to see JC return.  Why wouldn’t he?  But to think that the team would have resigned him for less money and Trae would have walked is just crazy.  Our GM overpaid him, not Trae.  Talk about trying to pass the blame.  Might as well blame Travis Schlenk for Trae missing a free throw.

[AHF]

We control Trae for 2 more years.  If Sarr turns into a star and the team is a rising playoff team, I don’t think we will have any trouble keeping him.  If we are struggling to make the playoffs then things will get ugly.  

[macdaddy]

 

Sure.  Let's blame Trae for the crummy team we've had the last few years.  

[AHF]

Anyone who thinks that it is a good idea to give a young person everything they want instead of what they need probably feeds their kids pop tarts, pizza and Mountain Dew for every meal.  Any GM who lets a 22 year under team control for like 6 years make decisions about contract offers deserves every bit of blame for what happens.  You don’t give LeBron an old and overpaid Shaq.  You give him a young rising center who will be better with him and keep him longterm.  You don’t grossly overpay JC and fail to leverage RFA and then give him away for nothing if you want to make Trae happy.  You build the best team possible around Trae which means the best players on the best contracts.  Trae deserves his share of blame for bad games where he went hero mode and sunk the team with bad shots and bad turnovers.  Our front office owns every personnel decision.

[Final_quest]

2 hours ago, bird_dirt said:

I recall him advocating for JC to get his bag, him stepping in and stopping them from trading CC, and pushing them to trade for Murray. 

The request to trade the pick for a player or trade him tracks. 

Top players pressure their teams into moves all the time, and I doubt Trae is any different. 

Trae having influence in our roster moves turns out to a huge trigger for some people.  No one is saying he called all the shots and is the only guy responsible for every move we've made.  He's had influence.  It's completely obvious, and he wants to push his influence more so now it seems.  It doesn't mean they did everything he wanted.  

[Final_quest]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

Anyone who thinks that it is a good idea to give a young person everything they want instead of what they need probably feeds their kids pop tarts, pizza and Mountain Dew for every meal.  Any GM who lets a 22 year under team control for like 6 years make decisions about contract offers deserves every bit of blame for what happens.  

This is a straw man and not what anyone thinks.  

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Final_quest said:

This is a straw man and not what anyone thinks.  

It is exactly what I'm hearing from the people who think a 22 year old Trae Young 6 years away from UFA forced the Hawks to overpay John Collins when JC was a restricted free agent.  Feel free to give me a steel man version of it if you think there is one.  I simply don't.  If the Hawks resigned JC for $90M, for example, I cannot envision a world where Trae tells the team he is no longer committed to winning in Atlanta because they haven't honored his request to pay his good friend.

(I'll just mention that I think there is considerable overlap between the people who think Trae is a terrible teammate as evidenced by JC "hating" him and those that think he is responsible for the Hawks overpaying JC because Trae somehow insisted on specific minimum payment terms for JC's next contract.)

[Plainview1981]

17 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I get the whole, Trae wanting to win and getting players he might have wanted....but again the work of the front office doesn't end there. I've talked ad nauseum about Hawks moving oncourt talent and not replacing because 'mandate to get under the luxury tax, but still have these high expectations to keep winning. We see it, Trae sees it. Everybody sees it. That is the bigger issue.

It's like me wanting a great TV with a big brand, all the bells and whistles and great PQ for like 700 bucks.lol

[RedDawg#8]

I’m riding with them on this. Ya’ll can miss me with the narratives.

 

 

[REHawksFan]

5 hours ago, Final_quest said:

My understanding of the rumor was trade the pick for a star or trade me to San Antonio.  In Trae's public interview he said "I want to win."  Behind closed doors he seems to be saying something more aggressive.  

And there's a 2nd insider that says no such meeting has actually happened and that they only plan to have such a meeting in the next few weeks.  So which is it?  

And regardless of whether Trae makes his feelings known or not, it's still not his responsibility to make deals happen.  

[Final_quest]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

It is exactly what I'm hearing from the people who think a 22 year old Trae Young 6 years away from UFA forced the Hawks to overpay John Collins when JC was a restricted free agent.  Feel free to give me a steel man version of it if you think there is one.  I simply don't.  If the Hawks resigned JC for $90M, for example, I cannot envision a world where Trae tells the team he is no longer committed to winning in Atlanta because they haven't honored his request to pay his good friend.

(I'll just mention that I think there is considerable overlap between the people who think Trae is a terrible teammate as evidenced by JC "hating" him and those that think he is responsible for the Hawks overpaying JC because Trae somehow insisted on specific minimum payment terms for JC's next contract.)

This is way too melodramatic.  No room for nuance. 

[StonedDogs]

5 hours ago, macdaddy said:

 

Sure.  Let's blame Trae for the crummy team we've had the last few years.  

It's 500% everyone in these photos to blame. 

Landry and Kyle are not GMs. 

Ressler and Jr know nothing about NBA players and run to run a successful NBA team.

The bald guy who tried to recreate the Warriors was an idiot. You cannot capture lightening in a bottle twice. 

In order to win with Trae, the other four players has to be perfect at their individual jobs and the bench has to have the best role players. There is almost zero room for error when building around Trae

[JayBirdHawk]

2 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

And there's a 2nd insider that says no such meeting has actually happened and that they only plan to have such a meeting in the next few weeks.  So which is it?  

And regardless of whether Trae makes his feelings known or not, it's still not his responsibility to make deals happen.  

I think this quote from Shams is what may have started the talk about Trae meeting with the Team...from the 1:00 minute mark:

"...That dialog, those talks will happen this week at the combine, next week and the weeks to come right before the draft."

 

 

 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Final_quest said:

This is way too melodramatic.  No room for nuance. 

If you can steel man it, go for it.  To me, it is always the GM (or owner) who is responsible for contract offers, personnel moves, etc.  Blaming a player for how much money per year another player was offered is crazy to me.  

3 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

I’m riding with them on this. Ya’ll can miss me with the narratives.

 

 

I think they get along just fine.  They just don't fit together on the floor which has to be frustrating for both of them.  If DJM was a plus defender of SGs, the pairing would probably work alright even if the fit wasn't ideal.  The reality is that it just doesn't work well on offense or at all on defense so one or the other needs to be moved.

[Watchman]

If management is seriously considering trading away Sarr and filler to get Kevin Durant, in order to placate Trae, then we know that management (and most of all, the ownership) care nothing about winning.  I don't know if this is what Trae wants or not, but it's what I have heard.  If we really would trade a young first pick in the draft to get a 35 year old (who will be 36 before the season starts)"superstar" then all they care about is more jersey sales in the arena store.  You can correct me if you think I am wrong, but Durant only wins big when he is on a team that is loaded with other stars.  For example, Golden State, with Steph Curry, Klay Thompson (when he still was a high level player), Draymond Green, a "defensive specialist" who doesn't really demand the ball, but has a reputation as a top defender.  If we give away our good players, and our prize rookie, to get Durant, we will end up with Trae and Durant, and G League scrubs.  That team will not win anything, just like our recent history.

[Watchman]

On 5/13/2024 at 11:51 AM, Dragitoff said:

Agreed.  Let's trade a top 15 (arguably better than that) player in the league who loves being in Atlanta, continues working to improve his game each year, and involves his teammates for the hopes that we get another player that eventually becomes that.  Trae has his flaws, but trading him essentially makes us a worse team or at best, the same level team.  We don't have all our own draft picks so you're not bottoming out and rebuilding.  The takes on trade him for picks make no sense unless you simply get our own picks back from SA. 

His comments don't back up the "wants to be here" stuff anymore.

[Watchman]

On 5/13/2024 at 12:18 PM, Dragitoff said:

I've honestly tried my best to ignore the trade Trae comments.  Until Trae asks for a trade, I can't see why the Hawks entertain such a proposal.  Stay off Bleacher Report Communities too.  The insanity and lack of coherence of trade Trae is next level there.  At least most posters here are knowledgeable, respectful and true Hawks fans.  The idiocy there is painful and frankly gives Hawks fans a bad rep.

If he asks for a trade, then we lose a lot of our ability to expect anything worthwhile in trading him.  That's why, if you're going to trade him, it needs to be done  before this becomes common knowledge.  At that point, we get two second round picks and an unusable TPE.  I think Trae wants to move on.

In the meanwhile, we dangle players out on the trade rumor mill year after year,  which damages our ability to attract other players, and is terrible for team morale.  For example, JC, Huerter, Bogi, and apparently DJM are/were dangled out there, some, year after year.

I personally am sick of this junk.

[Final_quest]

4 hours ago, AHF said:

If you can steel man it, go for it.  To me, it is always the GM (or owner) who is responsible for contract offers, personnel moves, etc.  Blaming a player for how much money per year another player was offered is crazy to me.  

OK. You claimed people are saying Trae forced the front office to pay JC against their wishes.

You said people think it’s a good idea to give a 22 year old whatever they want.

If it’s not a straw man show me where people are making those statements.  That you are fairly and accurately framing what people on here are saying with regards to Trae’s influence.

No one ever said Trae should get whatever he wants or that he forced them to overpay for JC.  
They are saying Trae put pressure on the front office and it was one of many factors that went into a decision.  You are distorting that view and attacking your misstated version of what no one actually thinks which is a definition of a straw man.