Johnson Wants Six-Year Max From Hawks

[AHF]

The Hawks' public starting position, in view of the other suitors wanting to step in to the dance, is "We expect to give him the SIX year max."

The Hawks' private starting position, in view of what the other suitors can actually give him, is "We will give you X-amount (a conservative amount, to be sure) above the FIVE year max."

I don't think the Hawks can have this disparity. Their public position should be "we are committed to retaining JJ in Atlanta" and not to mention the word "max" unless they are ready to put it on the table.

[DJlaysitup]

I don't think the Hawks can have this disparity. Their public position should be "we are committed to retaining JJ in Atlanta" and not to mention the word "max" unless they are ready to put it on the table.

I just hope the ASG does the best they can regardless of the outcome. Let's face it ($$-wise) it's like the Kansas City Royals going up against the New York Yankees in MLB.

Granted there is a cap - but it's also kind of soft.

[sturt]

I don't think the Hawks can have this disparity. Their public position should be "we are committed to retaining JJ in Atlanta" and not to mention the word "max" unless they are ready to put it on the table.

Not sure why you say that. Doesn't seem to really matter... people "reevaluate" their positions/options all the time.

[Diesel]

I think that you guys are misreading what is written. While it may be true that we have to give him the 6 year max for him to stay I really don't think that's what we can take from this posting.

The only thing the source says is that Joe has narrowed down his list of teams to the Hawks, Knicks and Bulls. It doesn't say that "the source also said if the Hawks do not offer Johnson a maximum-salary contract, he is almost certain to leave Atlanta and will likely sign with New York." I believe that 2nd sentence was the writers opinion, especially with the last half of the sentence saying he's likely to sign with New York.

How do I do this... +1.

NY writers are guilty of this all the time.

[Buzzard]

It's called negotiating.

but it does seem to be a player's market with more teams with sufficient cap space for top tier players than there are top tier players.

Yep and add in the two or three without cap who want to get into the action and you have a very large players market. NJ has some money but they do not have a lot of assets they want to give up. Probably why its been so quiet from their end. If they get shut out of the 1st tier, I look for them to make a hard run at the 2nd tier starting with Lee and working their way down. They could actually make some nice strides by getting multiple players for help instead of signing just one of the max players.

Edited June 30, 2010 by Buzzard

[Sothron]

Yep and add in the two or three without cap who want to get into the action and you have a very large players market. NJ has some money but they do not have a lot of assets they want to give up. Probably why its been so quiet from their end. If they get shut out of the 1st tier, I look for them to make a hard run at the 2nd tier starting with Lee and working their way down. They could actually make some nice strides by getting multiple players for help instead of signing just one of the max players.

this is what I don't think the ASG understands or if they do they don't care. Teams who are going to lose out on Lebron/Wade/Bosh are going to offer every penny they can for the second teir guys like Joe Johnson.

[Plainview1981]

IOW, if Atlanta doesn't offer him MORE than anyone else, he's leaving. So much for loyalty.

Screw him, I say.

hey... It's not like he left Phx for Atlanta out of the goodness of his heart. So he is not going to stay here out of the goodness of his heart.... But, if I was him, I wouldn't re-sign here because he basically kills any chance of winning a title here. If he leaves for a team of a higher place that is understandable, but if he is threatening to leave the Hawks for the Clippers or someone.... Well, f*** him completely.

But I laugh at the ones that tried to glorify him by saying he signed with the Hawks instead of the Suns out of some sense of being noble.

Edited June 30, 2010 by Hotlanta1981

[Plainview1981]

I was just wondering whether we could put together a package for Carmelo.

Josh Smith

Marvin Williams

Jamal Crawford

Mo Evans

for

Carmelo Anthony

Kenyon Martin

That works salary wise. Is that enough?

Denver runs Billups/JR/Marvin/Smith/Nene with Crawford/Lawson off the bench.

That's a terrible trade.

You want to trade possibly the best or 2nd best player on the team, the teams second leading scorer and Marvin for Mello and old injury prone Kenyon Martin? I don't like Marvin that much, but you're still trading three of the teams top 5 scorers. I'm not really a big fan of Kenyon Martin. He is far too likely to go down with an injury.

Edited June 30, 2010 by Hotlanta1981

[AtLaS]

Let Joe go, it would be flat DUMB to give him the max.

[AHF]

Not sure why you say that. Doesn't seem to really matter... people "reevaluate" their positions/options all the time.

Because it makes the ASG look like cheap liars and some form of that is exactly what JJ's agent will say to the press. "They promised they were ready to sign JJ to a 6-year maximum deal but when we met with them they didn't put that on the table and the figures they did mention didn't come close to the maximum deal they publicly promised last week. I don't want to call anyone a liar, but Rick Sund said is just not true. It is unfortunate that the Hawks tried to play games instead of negotiating in good faith with my client. JJ is going to go to a team that will deal with him honestly and pay him what he deserves to be paid."

JJ's agent isn't going to let him take the heat for having turned down a 6 year max offer that was never made.

[AHawks89]

Haha at trading Josh Smith. Josh Smith is our defense. One of the rising stars in the league. I know we would regret signing Josh Smith. I wouldn't mind seeing CA on this team though. Anyway that's possible?

[mrhonline]

He left the Suns because the Hawks offered him MORE than the Suns.

In this situation, the writer is implying Joe will leave Atlanta EVEN IF they match other team's offers.

[sturt]

Because it makes the ASG look like cheap liars and some form of that is exactly what JJ's agent will say to the press. "They promised they were ready to sign JJ to a 6-year maximum deal but when we met with them they didn't put that on the table and the figures they did mention didn't come close to the maximum deal they publicly promised last week. I don't want to call anyone a liar, but Rick Sund said is just not true. It is unfortunate that the Hawks tried to play games instead of negotiating in good faith with my client. JJ is going to go to a team that will deal with him honestly and pay him what he deserves to be paid."

JJ's agent isn't going to let him take the heat for having turned down a 6 year max offer that was never made.

AHF, I respect you immensely, and ordinarily think of you as bringing a level head to most things... but...

First, if I'm not mistaken, JJ's agent is Arm Tellum, and Tellum isn't going to call-out any team with that kind of whiny tone. Not only is he well-regarded as an agent, he's going to want to continue to be well-regarded. He has future negotiations to consider. it would be enough to say, "The max offer we had understood Atlanta was prepared to make was not forthcoming."

Second, it doesn't actually save JJ much face if, after that's said, Sund can respond in the media, "We offered what we felt the market dictated for the player, and I can tell you that it was more than the offer he eventually decided to sign."

Where am I wrong?

[Alex]

JJ isn't worth the max to begin with. That playoff series alone should tell the front office this. Offer him a fair deal and if he doesn't take it, then go the route of a sign and trade. Only if he accepts the deal and the trade is approved at the same time basically.

[spotatl]

If the Hawks were telling people that they were going to give Joe the six year max of course it would be leaked that the ASG cheaped out and didn't offer it because it fits with the script that the writers are already poised to write.

[AHF]

AHF, I respect you immensely, and ordinarily think of you as bringing a level head to most things... but...

First, if I'm not mistaken, JJ's agent is Arm Tellum, and Tellum isn't going to call-out any team with that kind of whiny tone. Not only is he well-regarded as an agent, he's going to want to continue to be well-regarded. He has future negotiations to consider. it would be enough to say, "The max offer we had understood Atlanta was prepared to make was not forthcoming."

Second, it doesn't actually save JJ much face if, after that's said, Sund can respond in the media, "We offered what we felt the market dictated for the player, and I can tell you that it was more than the offer he eventually decided to sign."

Where am I wrong?

You are right on the words being used as Tellum would be much more professional (JJ might tweet something less professional but Tellum wouldn't do it or encourage JJ to do it), but I promise this fan base will be comprised of two types of fans after they pull a stunt like that and lose JJ.

For the fan base, it plays out like this. The ASG announces they are willing to give a 6 year max deal. Everyone who thinks JJ isn't worth it is frothing at the mouth over how stupid this team is to pay that much money to JJ and those who think we absolutely have to bring JJ back are feeling great. After the Hawks refuse to make that offer and let JJ go elsewhere, the second group of fans who were reieved that JJ was coming back will be p#*$ed at the Hawks and the first group of fans will be glad we avoided what they believed was a disaster of a contract but still scratching their heads at the 180 degree turn. The ASG will lose credibility with the fans and FAs across the board and the number of fans who don't think the Hawks are cheapskates after hiring the league's cheapest coach, selling a draft pick, and then promising to max out JJ and reneging on that promise will be able to be counted on one hand.

I just think it would both enhance Tellum's position in negotiations which makes it harder to bring back JJ at a good price and will be a hugely negative PR move for the Hawks unless they end up signing JJ.

Let me also add that this shoots yourself in the foot with the other GMs in the league. The next time you tell them not to bother making an offer to Al Horford because you will absolutely pay to keep him, they won't believe you and will work harder to get him because they don't think your public statements can be trusted.

Edited June 30, 2010 by AHF