Hate all you want.....Joe is still thinking about you!

[ATLSmith]

Joe didn't demand his contract.Joe was handed that contract.If I was handed 121 Million dollars, I wouldn't turn it down for the sake of the company either.

I agree. You know, there's always a chance to renegotiate his contract. I know it doesn't happen often, but it could.Glad to hear the Joe want's to win one for himself and the fans.

[GameTime]

It's not like we're the Smitty / Mookie / Deke Hawks who were all old and on the downside of their careers and got ran out of the playoffs due to age, we still have a young core and 2 very good young All-Star caliber players to build around plus a very good Joe Johnson for the next couple of years.

Smoove is turning 27 in December, Horf is turning 26 in June, Joe turning 31 in June. I think it is safe to say to say this "core" has peaked, unless you are under the persuasion of Jeff Teague being a top 5 PG in the next few years. Smoove is also going into FA next year with his buddy Dwight and I doubt we are their first option.

Edited April 4, 2012 by GameTime

[NineOhTheRino]

I guess I'll bite the bullet like some have suggested and grow to appreciate mediocrity.

[Sothron]

I guess I'll bite the bullet like some have suggested and grow to appreciate mediocrity.

How is finishing in the top eight every year mediocre. I guess every team in the league but the top three or four teams should blow up their roster every season in the hopes of finding a superstar in the draft.

[benhillboy]

Joe can buy an O'Brian trophy when he's done. I heard Dr.J was selling off all of his trophies and rings. There you go Joe.

[Admin]

Smoove is turning 27 in December, Horf is turning 26 in June, Joe turning 31 in June. I think it is safe to say to say this "core" has peaked, unless you are under the persuasion of Jeff Teague being a top 5 PG in the next few years. Smoove is also going into FA next year with his buddy Dwight and I doubt we are their first option.

It seems to me that most good players don't fully peak and begin their descent until about 30-32 so yeah to me we've got 4-5 more years until Snoove and Horford have peaked and Teague will continue to improve. As long as JJ doesn't drop off too badly over that time we should be able to continue improving as a team.

[AtLaS]

I don't get this idea that if a team currently constructed failed in the playoffs then they will continue to fail in the playoffs. I guess OKC is foolish for keeping their same team this year? And the Spurs should have blown up their team in 01-02, 03-04, and 05-06?

OKC went to the conference finals and were competitive. They very well could've been in the Finals last season if Dallas wasn't on an unstoppable hot streak. Durant is a top 5 player. And, their 3 best players are 23 or under.

A perfect example of overreacting to me is the Suns and their trade for Shaq. The team they had was finally healthy and leading the NBA in wins at the time. They threw away Shawn Marion for an unknown gamble and their team has fallen down to mediocrity ever since.

While I agree that the Suns made lots of mistakes, the Hawks have never been on the level that the Suns were a few years ago.The examples you've given were teams that were VERY close to a championship or on the verge. The Hawks have generally been uncompetitive after the first round.Honestly, do you think this team has a chance in the playoffs? We've essentially had the same starting lineup for the last 5 years. I know what this team is. The only difference is Teague vs Bibby and Teague is not that much better than Bibby was.I hope I'm wrong, but I don't see it.

[NineOhTheRino]

How did we come to the conclusion that JJ was not looking for a Max-deal from the Hawks? He turned down 4/$60. It's a bit of a moot point now, but you guys make it seem as if Joe's contract was the result of another ASG blunder and not Joe and his agent going for the jugular.

[Admin]

OKC went to the conference finals and were competitive. They very well could've been in the Finals last season if Dallas wasn't on an unstoppable hot streak. Durant is a top 5 player. And, their 3 best players are 23 or under.

Competitive? They got beaten 4-1 in the series and even though they were relatively close losses they still only won a single game.

While I agree that the Suns made lots of mistakes, the Hawks have never been on the level that the Suns were a few years ago.The examples you've given were teams that were VERY close to a championship or on the verge. The Hawks have generally been uncompetitive after the first round.Honestly, do you think this team has a chance in the playoffs? We've essentially had the same starting lineup for the last 5 years. I know what this team is. The only difference is Teague vs Bibby and Teague is not that much better than Bibby was.I hope I'm wrong, but I don't see it.

I'd argue that for the most part we were as competitive with the Bulls last year in the 2nd round as the Thunder were with the Mavericks in the conference finals and had we been healthy I think we'd have given the Bulls a real run for their money.

How did we come to the conclusion that JJ was not looking for a Max-deal from the Hawks? He turned down 4/$60. It's a bit of a moot point now, but you guys make it seem as if Joe's contract was the result of another ASG blunder and not Joe and his agent going for the jugular.

So you'd have been ok paying Joe $15 million a year but you're not ok with $20 million a year? Do you honestly think that $5 million a year difference would change anything about the ASG's spending?

[AtLaS]

It is certainly a better strategy to try and win games as opposed to tanking for a chance at something that may or may not work out. I seem to remember Greg Oden as a franchise changer. To me, there is just too much uncertainty with tanking while it is not necessarily a bad thing to continue to compete. The Mavericks continue to try and compete and have done a solid job with this over the past 10 years or so. Not one time did they have a lottery pick. I just find the tanking idea to be woeful because you do not need a lottery pick to succeed. Certainly having a better ownership group would help, but teams have won championships in spite of pathetic ownership before in sports.

We just have differing opinions. Personally, I don't think the Hawks have a chance to win the East. Not even 10%. I've seen this team for 5 straight years, I know what they are capable of. Again, I hope I am wrong.I certainly understand your point, and can respect that you'd rather see a competitive team that consistently makes the playoffs rather than watching 20-30 win teams with hope. Personally, I think this draft will go down as a very good one and would rather take my chances there since I don't think this Hawks team will make any real noise.

[AtLaS]

Competitive? They got beaten 4-1 in the series and even though they were relatively close losses they still only won a single game.I'd argue that for the most part we were as competitive with the Bulls last year in the 2nd round as the Thunder were with the Mavericks in the conference finals and had we been healthy I think we'd have given the Bulls a real run for their money.

I'm not sure why anyone is comparing OKC to the Hawks. It's not even remotely comparable.OKC made the WCF last season with two 22 year olds and a 21 year old as their best players. They were extremely competitive in each one of those games even though they lost 4-1. They have a top 5 player. Currently, they have the best record in the West and possibly the entire NBA by the time the season is over.The Hawks have had the same lineup for 5 straight years minus Bibby and plus Teague. We have never been higher than the 4th seed and have only been remotely competitive in the 2nd round once. We don't have a top 15 player, yet our best player is already on the decline and is being paid top 5 money for the next 4 years. Our 2nd best player wants to be traded. We won't have cap space for a while, yet it won't matter because according to Sothron noone would come here anyway.Our only hope IMO is Teague or Marvin become a become a superstar player. Comparing OKC and Atlanta is apples and oranges.

[benhillboy]

Not that you should listen to "experts" over your own opinion, but we're getting out of hand. Putting the Hawks in the same sentence with OKC is farfetched. Thinking we could win a championship with Joe aging as his contract grows is laughable. Have you ever heard any pundits, past HOFers, hell, even Dominique and Bob with their rose colored glasses, mention the Hawks in any of these regards of championship contender? Name your favorite announcer or analyst, they've never considered it under any circumstances of health or possible roster moves. It's common knowledge and a running joke in the NBA how bleak our future is due to Joe's contract. He's had ample time to rub elbows in the strip club and follow through on his promise to attract big-name free agents. Where they at? The people who detract from Joe here don't "hate" the guy just to hate. He's a freaking Hawk for crying out loud, and we all love the Hawks. We just can't figure for the life of us why some people think he's capable of greatness when his most productive seasons came for a lottery team. Arguably the best stretch of his career a week ago came against a string of bottom feeders. His two best playoff performances came in lost series. The guy's never come close to starting an All-Star Game. Are all of the NBA's fans not seeing what some of you guys see? I watch and follow the Hawks because I love NBA basketball. I watch enough around the league to know that this team doesn't have the resources on or off the court to do anything special besides a spirited, unexpected playoff win against a superior team before the Conference Final. Is that what we strive for and get excited over?

Edited April 4, 2012 by benhillboy

[Sothron]

I'm not sure why anyone is comparing OKC to the Hawks. It's not even remotely comparable.OKC made the WCF last season with two 22 year olds and a 21 year old as their best players. They were extremely competitive in each one of those games even though they lost 4-1. They have a top 5 player. Currently, they have the best record in the West and possibly the entire NBA by the time the season is over.The Hawks have had the same lineup for 5 straight years minus Bibby and plus Teague. We have never been higher than the 4th seed and have only been remotely competitive in the 2nd round once. We don't have a top 15 player, yet our best player is already on the decline and is being paid top 5 money for the next 4 years. Our 2nd best player wants to be traded. We won't have cap space for a while, yet it won't matter because according to Sothron noone would come here anyway.Our only hope IMO is Teague or Marvin become a become a superstar player. Comparing OKC and Atlanta is apples and oranges.

We have the worst ownership in sports I have ever seen or read about in my lifetime and I'm in my mid thirties. This franchise is considered toxic by players and agents because of the ownership. Until that changes we can have all the cap space in the world and not be able to recruit people. This isn't just my opinion, you can check any number of media types that have mentioned this before.If we get new owners that could change but frankly I think we are stuck with the A$G for years.

[arhawkfan]

Not that you should listen to "experts" over your own opinion, but we're getting out of hand. Putting the Hawks in the same sentence with OKC is farfetched. Thinking we could win a championship with Joe aging as his contract grows is laughable. Have you ever heard any pundits, past HOFers, hell, even Dominique and Bob with their rose colored glasses, mention the Hawks in any of these regards of championship contender? Name your favorite announcer or analyst, they've never considered it under any circumstances of health or possible roster moves. It's common knowledge and a running joke in the NBA how bleak our future is due to Joe's contract. He's had ample time to rub elbows in the strip club and follow through on his promise to attract big-name free agents. Where they at? The people who detract from Joe here don't "hate" the guy just to hate. He's a freaking Hawk for crying out loud, and we all love the Hawks. We just can't figure for the life of us why some people think he's capable of greatness when his most productive seasons came for a lottery team. Arguably the best stretch of his career a week ago came against a string of bottom feeders. His two best playoff performances came in lost series. The guy's never come close to starting an All-Star Game. Are all of the NBA's fans not seeing what some of you guys see? I watch and follow the Hawks because I love NBA basketball. I watch enough around the league to know that this team doesn't have the resources on or off the court to do anything special besides a spirited, unexpected playoff win against a superior team before the Conference Final. Is that what we strive for and get excited over?

He has started one as game.

[ViperXX79]

He has started one as game.

Only because someone was hurt.

[Peoriabird]

Most teams that win the championship are veteran teams not lottery winners. Howard is not winning a championship in Orlando. Labron didn't win in Cleveland. So What is your point Atlas????

[AtLaS]

Most teams that win the championship are veteran teams not lottery winners. Howard is not winning a championship in Orlando. Labron didn't win in Cleveland. So What is your point Atlas????

My point is that aside from the 04 Pistons, superstars win championships and we don't have one. Since we aren't a large or desirable market we have to rely on the draft since players aren't lining up to play here. Besides, both of those teams went to the Finals which is further than the Hawks have went in their entire 50+ year existence.I'd rather expedite rather than delay the process and stay in mediocrity for the next 4-5 years when we will eventually have to rebuild anyway. You don't have to win the lottery to land a star, but having a higher pick increases your chances.We have no chance of contending with the team constructed. What is everyone going to say when we lose in the first round and/or get blown out in the 2nd round again? I guess assume that Horford was the missing piece, giving us the same team again next season.

[Peoriabird]

My point is that aside from the 04 Pistons, superstars win championships and we don't have one. Since we aren't a large or desirable market we have to rely on the draft since players aren't lining up to play here. Besides, both of those teams went to the Finals which is further than the Hawks have went in their entire 50+ year existence.I'd rather expedite rather than delay the process and stay in mediocrity for the next 4-5 years when we will eventually have to rebuild anyway. You don't have to win the lottery to land a star, but having a higher pick increases your chances.We have no chance of contending with the team constructed. What is everyone going to say when we lose in the first round and/or get blown out in the 2nd round again? I guess assume that Horford was the missing piece, giving us the same team again next season.

Then Go follow Bobcats then damn!

[Joker]

Never been a settler. I want the best in life for myself, my family, and my peoples. So just placing is not an option. It's win or die for me. That is just the way I see.

[Diesel]

Define "early exit" for me. This team routinely makes it to the second round of the playoffs. That automatically puts us every year in the top four of our conference. Look at the teams above us in that regard and tell me how we beat them with this horrible ownership. You want us to go from being a top four team in a conference to doing what exactly? Trading away all the players for draft picks and hoping one of them pans out?

Yeah. I bought a ticket in the megaMillions last week. Just one. However, that's the mentality of a lot of Hawks fans now. They have the mentality that if we were able to start from scratch, we could build a better team. What they fail to see is that we have tried this... twice.The first time, we got rid of Smitty, Mookie, and Deke... and got back Terry, Big Dog, Theo, and Shareef.After that, we got rid of them and got what we have now.What we have learned is that no matter how much money you have, it's hard to entice players to come to Atlanta... UNLESS you overpay them.What we have learned is that WE SUCK at drafting.What we have learned is that... it's important to keep good coaching.What we have learned is that... each time we change, we lose more identity.But guess what.We want another shot at the lottery.BTWThe lottery is fixed. Stern will never and I mean NEVER let us win.