Merged: Grantland - Free Agency Winners and Losers

[NBASupes]

Toronto fans like the Raptors. Atlanta fans like the NBA, not the Hawks. In order to get fans, Atlanta gonna have to do it right. If you gonna build around your system and Horford. Get him away from the center position. 

[HawkItus]

You know the one thing Blank did that changed the Falcons?

 

• Cheap season tickets.

 

 The Hawks should offer season tickets for cheap and open up Centennial Olympic park as a gathering spot for those fans to watch the game on the big screen.  Steal the tailgating culture and bring it to the NBA.  Just be creative.

[HawkItus]

Maybe we disagree.  However, there's nothing to do in Toronto... and still Toronto gets major support from stars like Drake.  Our biggest supporter is Boris Koedjoe.  Moreover, there are some logistical problems and financial issues attached to going to games.   The Hawks do nothing to invite the college crowd.  It doesn't nothing to promote a family friendly (financial) atmosphere.  ASG has to understand that sometimes a loss at the gate + a good team = a better team in the future.

TI and Luda would beg to differ.

[macdaddy]

Joe was the best decision this franchise has made in the last 15 years. He was a 6th time All Star and potential HOF. Sorry but signing another PF who is even more undersized than the PF you are fronting at center to play PF isn't smart to me. It wasn't smart then and it's not smart now. Now with that being said, I understand you want talent around the talent you have. Sap at the very least has talent. 

 

But off the court Joe did zero to move the needle on fan interest in the team.   How many guys with his talent and accomplishments that you point out are so invisible in the city they play in.   I mean the dude was never on the radio, never appeared in an ad for anything, hell the guy rarely smiled.   I'm not knocking him, it's just who he is.   But you don't want him to be the focal point of your franchise from a PR perspective.   I guarantee you could put Horford Korver and Joe in a lineup and way more folks in Atlanta could id Horford and Korver than our 6 time all star.   

[Admin]

Maybe we disagree.  However, there's nothing to do in Toronto... and still Toronto gets major support from stars like Drake.  Our biggest supporter is Boris Koedjoe.  Moreover, there are some logistical problems and financial issues attached to going to games.   The Hawks do nothing to invite the college crowd.  It doesn't nothing to promote a family friendly (financial) atmosphere.  ASG has to understand that sometimes a loss at the gate + a good team = a better team in the future.

 

Nothing to do in Toronto???????  

 

And you're telling me that the Hawks don't get major support from entertainers as big or bigger than Drake? 

[NiqueDaLegend]

Oh man, someone was trying to say we weren't free agent losers, if you clear cap by trading your first rounder from last year and the 2 best players you get is a journey man trying to prove his self and a guy who fell out of favor with his team come playoff time.. tell me how that isn't a FA loser? lol.

 

The only hope the Hawks have is the Nets somehow just fall apart next year and we get a top 10 pick and hit on a superstar. Because we are just in motion of mediocrity and the whole league sees it

[Twinblade]

I don't buy that. Other teams (like the Raptors) have sucked for years and have no problem selling out. The fans there just show up. We've discussed this countless times on here and we'll never agree, but the truth is that Atlanta will never support the Hawks throughout the regular season unless we're the best team in basketball or we have a super duper star. 

 

Well that oughta teach em! Way to support the players! 

 

What players? We don't really have anybody worth a damn.

[Vol4ever]

28th in the league in home attendance last year. Way to support a team going to the playoffs for the 7th straight year. 

 

http://espn.go.com/nba/attendance

 

Or maybe these FA's should want to come here and have the home crowd boo them when they're playing against Lebron or Kobe or other super stars that the general fans care more about? 

Maybe it has something to do with the halfass broke ownership group.  Its about 20 years since we signed a major free agent.  Put a superstar player in a Hawks uni and the fans will show up.

[NiqueDaLegend]

Maybe it has something to do with the halfass broke ownership group.  Its about 20 years since we signed a major free agent.  Put a superstar player in a Hawks uni and the fans will show up.

Big time free agents won't even allow us to talk to them, Dwight was a pity talk too and we were bottom on his list, good luck getting a superstar here with the current situation we are presenting 

[Dejay]

@Dolfan23

 

If you look at attendance:

1986-87 Atlanta Hawks Attendance: 549,526 (8th of 23)

 

1987-88 Atlanta Hawks Attendance: 572,460 (8th of 23)

 

1988-89 Atlanta Hawks Attendance: 644,291 (11th of 25)

 

1989-90 Atlanta Hawks Attendance: 573,711 (18th of 27)

 

The bottom fell out in 1989-90 or did it?

 

2010-11 Atlanta Hawks Attendance: 641,596 (22nd of 30) 2012-13 Atlanta Hawks Attendance: 620,146 (26th of 30)

 

You are getting consistent support for the good teams, the stadium is just to big and the league expanded in my opinion.  Without a star you aren't getting new fans either.

 

Well, I was there in the mid-late '80s and I'll tell you why they didn't rank higher. It was because they played in one of the smallest arenas in the league at that time (especially in '88-89 when they brought in Theus and Moses and pratically sold out for the season). Wanna compare the Omni to the Forum, MSG, the Spectrum, the Palace of Auburn Hills, the Delta Center, or old Chicago Stadium? I'll wait...

 

Again, I never heard of a company relying on its customer base to help its product improve. Wanna put more butts in the seats? DRAFT BETTER. We wouldn't be having this conversation (AGAIN!!!) if Chris Paul et al were playing here instead of the jabronies BK brought in; no one on this forum can debate that one. Trade for something other than more cap space. Market the team better. Hyping up the visiting team and selling their star(s) jerseys in your arena says alot about what you think of your own product; you think Coca-Cola has Pepsi products being sold in their museum downtown? I'm sick and tired of hearing the 'Atlanta has bad fans because they don't pay to see a winning team' BS. What's your definition of winning? Mine doesn't include sub-.500 teams and embarrassing second-round knockouts that Mike Tyson opponents from the '80s would laugh at. And judging by the folks showing up to the building, I'm not alone.

 

You can't continue getting your ish pushed in come playoff time and expect folks to continue supporting your product. You have to break through at some point. Ask Mike Smith how under the gun he is to make the playoffs and do something. Ask Chipper Jones or John Smoltz why the fans stopped coming in October once their one-and-done performances started getting old. Don't complain about the crowds when everyone else except this team and the effin Clippers have seen the conference finals OVER THE LAST 40 YEARS. Don't complain when we have to watch one player after the next become breakout stars that this team passed over in the draft. Toronto doesn't have the NFL or the SEC/ACC to compete against year-round. Nor does one-horse towns like Salt Lake, Portland, Sacramento, or San Antonio. The excuses of them not improving their product has to end. The 'win without losing' approach to building a roster has to end. The piecemeal approach of building a team juuuuuuuust good enough to be a 5-8th seed and get some TV $$$ and nothing further has to end.

 

GAME. SET. MATCH.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Dejay

[DrReality]

Be interesting what the new PR guy cooks up to generate some excitement

[Admin]

What players? We don't really have anybody worth a damn.

Uhh what are you talking about? I didn't say we had players fans cared about.

[Vol4ever]

I'm not going to say I wont attend a game or games this year, but as things stand right now I doubt I will be going.  If DF is not going to significantly improve this team then there is no reason to go.  

 

This crap keeps happening and Coach Bud will go to another organization that is committed.  

 

The Hawks are not commited.

[Admin]

Maybe it has something to do with the halfass broke ownership group. Its about 20 years since we signed a major free agent. Put a superstar player in a Hawks uni and the fans will show up.

I didn't realize it was as simple as that. Not sure why LeBron and/or Dwight aren't Hawks then since we wanted both and had the money. {/sarcasm}

[Vol4ever]

I didn't realize it was as simple as that. Not sure why LeBron and/or Dwight aren't Hawks then since we wanted both and had the money.

   

[JTB]

Get what you all are saying but I truly believe that if the hawks can win 50 games for atleast 2 years straight. Fans will show up regardless of what we do in the playoffs.

I really believe that! 2 straight years win 50 games...to me it's a gurantee that fans will come out and marquee free agents will start to listen to ferry and bud.

With the big 3 breaking up I feel that the hawks are one player away from a 50 win season in the east! (Good thing we aren't on the west!...then we would' be talking about a 10 year plan)

[Guest]

Oh man, someone was trying to say we weren't free agent losers, if you clear cap by trading your first rounder from last year and the 2 best players you get is a journey man trying to prove his self and a guy who fell out of favor with his team come playoff time.. tell me how that isn't a FA loser? lol.

 

The only hope the Hawks have is the Nets somehow just fall apart next year and we get a top 10 pick and hit on a superstar. Because we are just in motion of mediocrity and the whole league sees it

Such a riveting argument! Although instead of going the "lol" route, I think you could have had a stronger take if you used the subtle "lmbo". You don't want to go overkill too soon with the "lmfao" on this. Save that for your rebuttal.

[Sothron]

Well, I was there in the mid-late '80s and I'll tell you why they didn't rank higher. It was because they played in one of the smallest arenas in the league at that time (especially in '88-89 when they brought in Theus and Moses and pratically sold out for the season). Wanna compare the Omni to the Forum, MSG, the Spectrum, the Palace of Auburn Hills, the Delta Center, or old Chicago Stadium? I'll wait...

 

Again, I never heard of a company relying on its customer base to help its product improve. Wanna put more butts in the seats? DRAFT BETTER. We wouldn't be having this conversation (AGAIN!!!) if Chris Paul et al were playing here instead of the jabronies BK brought in; no one on this forum can debate that one. Trade for something other than more cap space. Market the team better. Hyping up the visiting team and selling their star(s) jerseys in your arena says alot about what you think of your own product; you think Coca-Cola has Pepsi products being sold in their museum downtown? I'm sick and tired of hearing the 'Atlanta has bad fans because they don't pay to see a winning team' BS. What's your definition of winning? Mine doesn't include sub-.500 teams and embarrassing second-round knockouts that Mike Tyson opponents from the '80s would laugh at. And judging by the folks showing up to the building, I'm not alone.

 

You can't continue getting your ish pushed in come playoff time and expect folks to continue supporting your product. You have to break through at some point. Ask Mike Smith how under the gun he is to make the playoffs and do something. Ask Chipper Jones or John Smoltz why the fans stopped coming in October once their one-and-done performances started getting old. Don't complain about the crowds when everyone else except this team and the effin Clippers have seen the conference finals OVER THE LAST 40 YEARS. Don't complain when we have to watch one player after the next become breakout stars that this team passed over in the draft. Toronto doesn't have the NFL or the SEC/ACC to compete against year-round. Nor does one-horse towns like Salt Lake, Portland, Sacramento, or San Antonio. The excuses of them not improving their product has to end. The 'win without losing' approach to building a roster has to end. The piecemeal approach of building a team juuuuuuuust good enough to be a 5-8th seed and get some TV $$$ and nothing further has to end.

 

GAME. SET. MATCH.

 

I wish I had more likes for this post. It deserves it.

[AHF]

AHF:

I think we are absolutely able to land those types of middle-of-the-road players with overpay style contracts (which, IMO, describes both the rich Frye and rich Haward contracts).  We can get those guys without anything changing.  

 

Totally disagree on the first point. We didn't come close to overpaying for Paul and this appears to be what Danny is going with.

 

I think you and I are missing on my first point.  My first point was that if we chose to overpay for people like Frye, we can absolutely land them.  Both the examples you gave of non-major markets teams landing players (Frye and Hayward) were significant overpays.  That doesn't mean much for the true stars who can name their price and their team.

 

Now by saying we can land a Frye at 4 years and $32M, I wasn't arguing that Ferry has been overpaying people.  Generally, I think he has been disciplined and has landed some real bargains among his signings (Paul, DMC, etc.). These were guys without better options that he was able to pluck from the middle ground of the FA pool on attractive deals.  Kudos to him on that. 

 

The bigger point was the one we agreed on:  that Atlanta has struggled picking up guys who can get the same deal elsewhere or who are willing to sacrifice dollars for the chance to join a team they perceive to be a true contender.  Atlanta doesn't get so many of those players and gets none of them at the top of the pay scale.

[NiqueDaLegend]

Such a riveting argument! Although instead of going the "lol" route, I think you could have had a stronger take if you used the subtle "lmbo". You don't want to go overkill too soon with the "lmfao" on this. Save that for your rebuttal.

Despite me loling, you still had nothing to say about how we aren't losers for trading a first rounder from last year to get 2 role players, nice to see a well thought out statement from you.

Edited July 15, 2014 by PacManLogoFTW