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[Guest]

Al is a better player than Karl Malone?

[Plainview1981]

Malone had a toughness that someone like Horf will never come close to matching. Horford is the kind of player that you can forget he is even out there.... He does not and could never make the impact that a Malone makes. The comparison is laughable.Horford is a "Robin" player (at best) no matter what players or team you put him with.

 

Plus, to be a 25 PPG scorer in this league.... It takes will. Just like with Jeff Teague. Some nights he has the will and the interest, but some nights he doesn't. Most players (ncluding Al) don't have the mindset to do that every night. it just does not fit his personality. 

Edited November 22, 2014 by Hotlanta1981

[Guest]

Malone had a toughness that someone like Horf will never come close to matching. Horford is the kind of player that you can forget he is even out there.... He does not and could never make the impact that a Malone makes. The comparison is laughable.Horford is a "Robin" player (at best) no matter what players or team you put him with.

 

Plus, to be a 25 PPG scorer in this league.... It takes will. Just like with Jeff Teague. Some nights he has the will and the interest, but some nights he doesn't. Most players (ncluding Al) don't have the mindset to do that every night. it just does not fit his personality. 

 

Agree with all this.  The notion that Al is even in shouting distance of Malone is so laughable that I assume Supes meant something else.

 

I mean, Malone is top what 2 in scoring in league history?  You don't go from forgettable (which is a good word for Al) to all-time scoring in the league based on teammates.

[Plainview1981]

Korver is another guy that could put up 15-17 PPG in this offense if he wanted...But he is more concerned with his efficiency. Josh Smith could and did stop shooting 3's for one season. But he went back to what he wanted to do.

[willthepureshooter]

Did you bother to watch the game? They needed Al to play the Brook Lopez box out role considering how Drummond normally kills us in boards. His focus was boxing out and hedging. Please pay attention and watch before commenting. Al was very good last night after one of his worse games v. LAL.

First off, I watched the game through Espn Gamecast since I'm up north on business. Secondly, you're a complete moron if you don't think that AL shouldn't be responsible for helping rebound after hedging. I guess you don't know what hedging is or how commonly its used in the NBA by all teams during the season. Matter of fact, the Hawks have primarily used this defense since the Woody days. But you wouldn't know that because you don't really know basketball. You can't shoot from the hip every time you come on the squawk because someone like me is liable to embarrass you. As if your OJ Mayo debacle wasn't embarrassing enough. Smh.

As the hedger, Al is responsible for "showing hard" and pushing the ball handler out after switching on the screen - giving time for the ball handlers primary defender to recover. Once his teammate recovers, Al is responsible for retreating back and covering the roll man. This is done to prevent the easy roll pass to the basket, and to HELP REBOUND. It seems to me that Al is late on the roll due to poor conditioning and bad positioning. He can't get beat on the recovery, especially if he has the size disadvantage. That's why he continues to get massacred on the boards and on the post. Al has piss poor defensive fundamentals. Its showing even more now due to Josh Smiths absence.

[Admin]

Korver is another guy that could put up 15-17 PPG in this offense if he wanted...But he is more concerned with his efficiency. Josh Smith could and did stop shooting 3's for one season. But he went back to what he wanted to do.

 

And you tried being logical and not so negative for a while and then went back to being doom and gloom. You just gotta be happy, like a hippo, and don't try to change your stripes and be like the zebra :)

[nathan2331]

First off, I watched the game through Espn Gamecast since I'm up north on business. Secondly, you're a complete moron if you don't think that AL shouldn't be responsible for helping rebound after hedging. I guess you don't know what hedging is or how commonly its used in the NBA by all teams during the season. Matter of fact, the Hawks have primarily used this defense since the Woody days. But you wouldn't know that because you don't really know basketball. You can't shoot from the hip every time you come on the squawk because someone like me is liable to embarrass you. As if your OJ Mayo debacle wasn't embarrassing enough. Smh.

As the hedger, Al is responsible for "showing hard" and pushing the ball handler out after switching on the screen - giving time for the ball handlers primary defender to recover. Once his teammate recovers, Al is responsible for retreating back and covering the roll man. This is done to prevent the easy roll pass to the basket, and to HELP REBOUND. It seems to me that Al is late on the roll due to poor conditioning and bad positioning. He can't get beat on the recovery, especially if he has the size disadvantage. That's why he continues to get massacred on the boards and on the post. Al has piss poor defensive fundamentals. Its showing even more now due to Josh Smiths absence.

Watching the game, Horford found himself out of position a lot but I wouldn't put it all on him. There were a lot of times that a jumper was shot as he was coming back to his position. This wasn't a game however where I felt he wasn't giving enough effort. More a product of Detroit (and more specifically Josh Smith) throwing up the first shot they get after the screen.

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[Admin]

Yeah I definitely don't feel like Horford was lacking effort tonight. I think this was probably the 1st game this season where I can say that without any hesitation. No he wasn't big on the boards but he was doing a good job of boxing out and hustling out there and he had several plays where he was scoring down in the post with his back to the basket like a true C. I was very impressed at how he attacked the Detroit bigs. Considering that I've been one of his biggest critics lately this should tell you something. 

[Sothron]

You guys must really love cookies for this to get to five pages so far.

[Guest]

And you tried being logical and not so negative for a while and then went back to being doom and gloom. You just gotta be happy, like a hippo, and don't try to change your stripes and be like the zebra :)

I'm gonna kill youuuuuuuuuuu-Ruby Tuesday

Lol

I love that movie ..RIP PSH ....makin it rain lol

[NBASupes]

Malone had a toughness that someone like Horf will never come close to matching. Horford is the kind of player that you can forget he is even out there.... He does not and could never make the impact that a Malone makes. The comparison is laughable.Horford is a "Robin" player (at best) no matter what players or team you put him with.

 

Plus, to be a 25 PPG scorer in this league.... It takes will. Just like with Jeff Teague. Some nights he has the will and the interest, but some nights he doesn't. Most players (ncluding Al) don't have the mindset to do that every night. it just does not fit his personality. 

Bulls*it. Horf is plenty tough. I do agree, Al doesn't have that 25PPG mindset but we don't create enough anyway. Our personnel has Al out of position. This is a POS franchise who doesn't know how to put their players in positions to succeed.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhD6PBkHTxM

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAsRpdxf32Y

 

I am sick and tired of nonsense. We haven't put Al is a position to excel since he has been a Hawk. We didn't for Joe. Nor did we do it most other players here with the exception of Deke and even then, we weren't talented enough and Philly/Larry Brown used him much better than we did.

[willthepureshooter]

29 minutes 2/3 field goal 6 points 2 rebounds 3 assists 1 block

What in the hell? This dude was an all-star aka the next Karl Malone. Shittin me! He's soft and a bum!

[Peoriabird]

Jeff Teague should reach out to Al to express his empathy. 

[macdaddy]

Why are we knocking Al so much?   He's had two single digit scoring games in the last 10.  Duncan has had more than that.   Our offense is built to get scoring from different people in different games depending on the matchup.   Until we get the elusive 'star' we aren't going to have one guy going for 25 every game.   And even then I kind of doubt it.   Hawks win 6 out of 7 and we're bashing our most vocal leader?

[AHF]

Let's give Al more time to fully recover and reintegrate here.  People were crapping all over Lou last year when he was coming back from injury and now many of the same people are wringing their hands over his success in Toronto after more fully recovering.  Al has more recovery and rebuilding to do.  The real question is whether we are seeing the new status quo for his game or if he is relatively early on the road to being back.  I am definitely willing to give him more time to get back to the Al of old before calling him a bum or anything like that.  His team-oriented and competitive attitude in the past earns him some leeway with me.

[Admin]

Why are we knocking Al so much? He's had two single digit scoring games in the last 10. Duncan has had more than that. Our offense is built to get scoring from different people in different games depending on the matchup. Until we get the elusive 'star' we aren't going to have one guy going for 25 every game. And even then I kind of doubt it. Hawks win 6 out of 7 and we're bashing our most vocal leader?

It's not just the points. But he's not rebounding good enough for a guard let alone a C. And his defense has been mediocre as well. I'm telling yall we NEED to trade him while people still think he's the same guy he was prior to his injuries.

[Admin]

Let's give Al more time to fully recover and reintegrate here. People were crapping all over Lou last year when he was coming back from injury and now many of the same people are wringing their hands over his success in Toronto after more fully recovering. Al has more recovery and rebuilding to do. The real question is whether we are seeing the new status quo for his game or if he is relatively early on the road to being back. I am definitely willing to give him more time to get back to the Al of old before calling him a bum or anything like that. His team-oriented and competitive attitude in the past earns him some leeway with me.

That's fine if the old Al was a good rebounder, good post scorer, and good defender. But he was never consistently a good one at any of those things. So to think after 2 season ending injuries that he'll all of a sudden be better at those things is a bit wishful.

He's essentially a great mid range shooter and he can still get it done in the PnR and PnP but but that's about all he will ever consistently give us.

[AHF]

It's not just the points. But he's not rebounding good enough for a guard let alone a C. And his defense has been mediocre as well. I'm telling yall we NEED to trade him while people still think he's the same guy he was prior to his injuries.

 

I am fine trading anyone on our team for the right value, but I would say that we dealt Lou at the low end of his value by not letting him recover.  Horford is a very good player when healthy - healthy Al is a plus defender against everyone except the largest centers, a super-efficient and moderate volume scorer, and a solid rebounder.  There is some duplication with Sap but both are good assets.  I am not ready to give up on Al so unless a good deal comes calling I am not unloading him just to get in before he bottoms out in value.

[Admin]

I am fine trading anyone on our team for the right value, but I would say that we dealt Lou at the low end of his value by not letting him recover. Horford is a very good player when healthy - healthy Al is a plus defender against everyone except the largest centers, a super-efficient and moderate volume scorer, and a solid rebounder. There is some duplication with Sap but both are good assets. I am not ready to give up on Al so unless a good deal comes calling I am not unloading him just to get in before he bottoms out in value.

With Lou we just wanted out of his contract, not because of performance or lack thereof.

A plus defender against all but the big C's? That's news to me.

I wouldn't call him a solid rebounder either. At least not consistently. I can't recall him ever having a monster rebounding game. But I recall a lot of piss poor ones.

His value will probably hold up the rest of the season but he's a major risk of re-injuring his pecs so not only is his value on the court down significantly this year but his value because of injury risk is down as well. He's the NBA Mr Glass becoming the first ever player to tear a pec twice.

I would trade him right now for Dieng and an unprotected 1st plus filler and not think twice about it.

I am fine trading anyone on our team for the right value, but I would say that we dealt Lou at the low end of his value by not letting him recover. Horford is a very good player when healthy - healthy Al is a plus defender against everyone except the largest centers, a super-efficient and moderate volume scorer, and a solid rebounder. There is some duplication with Sap but both are good assets. I am not ready to give up on Al so unless a good deal comes calling I am not unloading him just to get in before he bottoms out in value.

With Lou we just wanted out of his contract, not because of performance or lack thereof.

A plus defender against all but the big C's? That's news to me.

I wouldn't call him a solid rebounder either. At least not consistently. I can't recall him ever having a monster rebounding game. But I recall a lot of piss poor ones.

His value will probably hold up the rest of the season but he's a major risk of re-injuring his pecs so not only is his value on the court down significantly this year but his value because of injury risk is down as well. He's the NBA Mr Glass becoming the first ever player to tear a pec twice.

I would trade him right now for Dieng and an unprotected 1st plus filler and not think twice about it.

[AHF]

IMO, Horford has always been a rock solid defender except when he has been physically overwhelmed at times by large bigs.  He also was pretty amazing in his ability to defend smaller forwards and guards for limited periods of time during switches.  For rebounding, he is a career 9.4 rpg guy.  That is pretty solid.  Only 10 other players have as many total and per game rebounds as Al since he was drafted even with the recent injuries.  

 

http://bkref.com/tiny/l0oCp