Help me with a debate. I say Kyle Korver is the best "pure shooter" in the league

[randawg91]

My friend says that Steph Curry is. Now, there's no doubt that Curry is the better player. Korver has a waaaayyyy higher fg%, but my friend's point is that Curry makes a ton of his own shots, which is valid. Do y'all have any stats or articles to help me out? Maybe something like Korver having a better catch and shoot percentage? Thanks!

[Admin]

My friend says that Steph Curry is. Now, there's no doubt that Curry is the better player. Korver has a waaaayyyy higher fg%, but my friend's point is that Curry makes a ton of his own shots, which is valid. Do y'all have any stats or articles to help me out? Maybe something like Korver having a better catch and shoot percentage? Thanks!

 

There was an article that Bleacher Report did a couple of weeks back about who's the best 3pt shooter this year and they listed Curry #1 and Korver #2 because they heavily penalized Korver for the % of shots that he's assisted on vs that of Curry. They had several factors that they used to come up with their ranking but that was the dagger. They said had it not been for that, Kyle would have won in a landslide as he's the best pure 3pt shooter in the game. 

 

Here it is - http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2317154-ranking-the-nbas-top-25-three-point-shooters-so-far-this-season

[benhillboy]

As much as I have a man crush on Kyle and Wardell, I'd probably go with Dirk or KD over both.

While all 4 believe they will hit every three they attempt, the tall guys have more confidence and versatility in their mid-range game. Kyle tries to "guide" in his mid-range jumpers and Steph much rather find an open man when he's forced off the three point line, his depth perception from mid range is considerably behind his long-range coordinates.

I would guess the percentage of shots taken and converted that are mid range from Dirk and KD's repetiore are much higher than Kyle and Steph's also. I think all jumpers in all situations are a much better indicator than just three point accuracy. There are so many bums in the league who can luck up and shoot 40% from 3 in the same year they shoot sub .700 from the FT line, a clear mark of a poor shooter who only practices threes.

There have actually been a few threads on this topic, just search all 4 names together I guess.

Edited January 10, 2015 by benhillboy

[ATLHawks3]

What other player in this league shoots 50% from the field, 50% from 3, and 90% from the freethrow line? If those numbers aren't worthy of being the best pure shooter in the NBA, then I don't know what is. 

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

I hate that Korver is penalized because most of his threes come on assisted, wide-open attempts.  Just because a guy can make a shot with a guy in his face doesn't mean he's a better shooter.  If the shots didn't fall for Curry, he'd be listed as a chucker.  Great shooters shoot great shots.

 

Player comparison on B-ball Ref:

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&y1=2015&p1=curryst01&y2=2015&p2=korveky01&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=

[willthepureshooter]

What other player in this league shoots 50% from the field, 50% from 3, and 90% from the freethrow line? If those numbers aren't worthy of being the best pure shooter in the NBA, then I don't know what is.

This! Shooting consistently at an efficient clip is very difficult (leg fatigue, mental fatigue etc). I was a pretty good shooter during my high school years. I had a pretty high release point when I shot. My coaches and teammates called me the Giant Killer when I shot. But little did they know, I was worn out at the end of practices and games. Legs were heavy and my mental rhythm suffered for the next couple days of practice.

That's why I respect the hell out of Kyle Korvers shooting display this year. Its very difficult..

[AHF]

Maybe something like Korver having a better catch and shoot percentage? Thanks!

That is what you need. Apples to apples.

[DrReality]

That is what you need. Apples to apples.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

[AHF]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

You can do away with much of the shot selection issues by showing like shots against like shots. Taking harsher shots isn't much of an excuse for worse overall % if you aren't shooting equally well on the easy shots.

[randawg91]

Yeah, it's tough because there are several variables. I think the fact that Korver has the best 3pt% of any shooter on the all time 3's list (barely edges out Steve Nash, but is considerably better than allen and miller fyi) is pretty telling. Also, he has the highest free throw % so far this season, but curry is right behind him so that's not really too convincing. Sadly, I haven't found a great site for advanced stats like they have for baseball 

[lethalweapon3]

Also noteworthy is that Curry's FG% is relatively padded by a LOT more layups... 3.7 attempts per game for the Splash Brother (74.4 FG% on those layups), versus 14 layups total over 36 games for Kyle. Korver's 67.8 effective field goal percentage exceeds Curry's 58.3 eFG% without the benefit of layups/dunk(s)/hook shot attempts in the paint. Curry is a better "pure scorer," but a superior "pure shooter" argument on Curry's behalf would need more supportive data.

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/curryst01/shooting/2015/

 

Steph's jumper goes in the net just 41.8% of the time, including 39.1% on three-pointers. While he's certainly far more closely defended and must rely on his dribble skills to get shots off, it's unlikely those factors alone are the difference between his percentages and Kyle's 48.9 FG% and 51.7 3FG% on jumpshots.

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/k/korveky01/shooting/2015/

 

Steph's 3-point shooting percentage has also declined in the past three seasons, from 45.5% in 2011-12 (just 26 games) to 45.3% in 2012-13, 42.4% in 2013-14, and (so far) 39.1% this season. While Curry's still on the good side of his prime, the trendline in this category, for "best pure shooter in the league," should probably not be continually going downward at his age.

 

Since snapping the all-time NBA 3FG% season record with the Jazz, Korver shot 41.5 3FG% with the Bulls in 2010-11 and has since had his percentages trend upward every season ever since (43.5%, 45.7%, 47.2%, to 51.8% so far this year). It's more impressive given that Kyle's physical prime was arguably as a backup wing with the Sixers seven years ago.

 

Of course, there's always the SportsCenter Effect. If every Warriors highlight sequence shows plenty of makes and not many misses, it would appear to a casual viewer that Curry is always "on." Sports show host reactions can also play a part in how "on" a player looks ("Whoa! Steph Curry! Wow!" versus "There's another three by Kyle Korver.")

 

Plus with the W's rocking the best record in the NBA, it's rare for those viewers to see Curry shooting just 8-for-37 (21.6 3FG%) from three-point-range in losses this season (Korver is shooting "just" 47.5 3FG% in losses this year). Kyle's makes are featured on the Hawks' highlight sequence on the big nightly shows, but usually it will be one or two plays instead of Curry's three-to-five, especially given Atlanta's game highlights weren't put on Front Street until very recently.

 

~lw3

Edited January 11, 2015 by lethalweapon3

[buckeye242424]

Well, look at the elephant in the room... Age factors in here. He may have better stats than KD or Steph, but let's not be silly... I love Kyle.. He plays hard all the time. He's a product of the system. Is he a better shooter than Klay Thompson? I dunno...

[Guest]

I suggest fiddling around with nbawowy! if you want to get stats from this year. It's got a ton of information in there, so play around with it to see the splits for Korver and Curry.

The guy who runs the site may be a doucher, but there's a lot of data you can find there.

[enrique]

randawg91,

Until you and your friend agree on a "pure shooter" definition, then you will be going around and around on the debate. If you define "pure shooter" as someone "creating his own shot" and then making them at a higher rate, then Korver will never win the debate. Historically we would not call that part of being a pure shooter. If you use the historic idea of "who would you want to take the shot (regardless of how the shooter got open)" then I would want Korver taking any shot other than in the paint. 

 

Dribbling and crossing over and shooting is a skill for sure, but people should not act like running around like a maniac through 2-3 screens and then catching and shooting in less than a second and making it isn't. What Korver has done is historic!!!! I think Steve Kerr might have been the last person to put up the 50/50/90% in the NBA. If I am not mistaken, Kerr played much less and shot significantly fewer shots than Korver. Korver is doing this on a larger number of shots which makes it even more impressive and less "flukish" IMHO.

 

Hope that approach can help.

 

Go Hawks!!!!

[Sothron]

I don't understand how creating your own shot even remotely comes into the discussion of "best pure shooter". By the very definition of what the term is it means who can simply shoot the best. Not who can shoot better with a hand in their face or not. Korver is the best shooter in the NBA.

[enrique]

I don't understand how creating your own shot even remotely comes into the discussion of "best pure shooter". By the very definition of what the term is it means who can simply shoot the best. Not who can shoot better with a hand in their face or not. Korver is the best shooter in the NBA.

I agree totally and this is part of my point. But until randawg91 sets the definition to shooting (pure and simple), the debate will never end IMO. Either way it doesn't really matter. I am glad we have Korver. He is a huge asset to this team and system.

 

Go Hawks!