Will Trae lead us to a Championship?

[TheNorthCydeRises]

12 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

My point:

What we were missing, are missing now, and will need to ever sniff a title, is more leadership presence both on and off the court. We NEED at least 1 guy who can both talk it AND walk it. All champions need those players, the one's who say, "I dont care if you like what I have to say, Im going to say it like it is." (a la Draymond, Beverly, Russ, etc...)  An Alpha, TYPE A personality.

Trae is an assassin, but I dont know if he is a dawg. That's not a knock, because not all stars can be both. 

So while his play will speak for itself, and he will lead us in scoring, assists, highlights, and relevance, I dont know if can say he will himself be that guy who LEADS us to a championship. 

That's a void Schlenk needs to fill via acquisition, or Coach needs to groom from within John or Trae

 

Imagine the influence this guy could have on Cam and De'Andre.  Unlike his soft teammates in Minny, our rookies would embrace his work ethic and try to mimic his effort at all times.  He'd also keep Trae in line, if he gets a little too wild.

 

[Gray Mule]

If things get worse before it gets better, and it will, huge $$$ payroll for NBA players and all professional sports players may be history.  Unemployment is going to explode.  Until this corona virus is under control, attendance to sports events will be ancient history.

Just think about where all the $$$ money to meet those payroll comes from.  TV payments are huge.  But, if they have no great income from advertising, they will have no huge $$$ payments to share.

Right now, players with big $$$ contracts for future years may be required to cut their guaranteed pay check.  Right now, all those "little people" that work to make everything go well are out of work because the pro sports are not playing.  March madness is gone.  

Scary thoughts, isn't it.  But, sadly, history is changing so fast that we can't keep up.

Stay safe and may God bless you all.

[JTB]

17 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Normally, the 5 elements of a championship team are:

• A LEGIT All-Star player that will be a future Hall of Famer
• A very good 2nd player who many consider to be an All-Star right now, or is currently an All-Star
• A very good 3rd player who plays at All-Star level on occasion
• A team that is top 10 in defense
• A team that is top 10 in offense

How many of those elements do we have right now?  And what do we need to do to get these 5 elements.

This is all true except the top 10 defense element. I’ve looked this up before in the past and I’m not saying teams can be garbage at defense BUT if you take the time to look up the numbers/ranks for teams who made the finals you will see some contenders who sat just outside the top 10 in defense for that season (like 11-14)....now that’s not a significant drop off from top 10 but my point is you can’t find that for Offense. Offensively a team definitely has to be top 10 or you ain’t going far.

 

Not suggesting defense isn’t needed to win! I’m just saying in the NBA offense has always triumphed defense in every era. Hall of Fame players are mostly  those who were so gifted offensively in their era that they couldn’t be stopped.

The only team to make the finals that I know of (consistently at that) and wasn’t good at defense was those later cavs teams with lebron aka also the years lebrons defensive individual numbers started to fall. Truth is lebron learned during the Miami years that the East couldn’t score with him as long as he had  another star scorer and he was right. So when he went back to the cavs other then that first year when he returned that team did not play defense whatsoever.
 

but again not saying teams don’t need a good defense....I guess to me if we were top 3 offense one day in the future with Trae, Cam, Collins leading the offense and ranked 13th defensively, I personally would feel confident that we could make a finals trip BUT vice versa if we were top 3 defense and 14th offensively I personally wouldn’t feel very confident at all that we could get anywhere in the playoffs. Eventually a very good defense will start to give up points throughout the course of a series and the middle of the pack offense won’t be able to keep them alive.

[macdaddy]

8 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

Imagine the influence this guy could have on Cam and De'Andre.  Unlike his soft teammates in Minny, our rookies would embrace his work ethic and try to mimic his effort at all times.  He'd also keep Trae in line, if he gets a little too wild.

 

Is that just for fantasy discussion.  He signed a 4 year max contract with the Heat.

[benhillboy]

Nah.

[Spud2nique]

Jimmy would take away reps from Cam and Hunter..and Huerter. I’m good.

[sturt]

7 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Jimmy would take away reps from Cam and Hunter..and Huerter. I’m good.

That's not a good reason. Under that logic, you'd also turn down LeBron, Giannis, and any other All-Star wing.

Money/salary cap is the main reason I'm good. Add to that, since he's not a free agent, there would need to be young assets traded. Schlenk has said he's not interested in skipping steps. I'm among those who are with him on that. Making a big trade like that and restricting the capacity to participate in the free agency market to that degree would amount to skipping steps, hoping to accelerate the process.

[macdaddy]

6 minutes ago, sturt said:

That's not a good reason. Under that logic, you'd also turn down LeBron, Giannis, and any other All-Star wing.

Money/salary cap is the main reason I'm good. Add to that, since he's not a free agent, there would need to be young assets traded. Schlenk has said he's not interested in skipping steps. I'm among those who are with him on that. Making a big trade like that and restricting the capacity to participate in the free agency market to that degree would amount to skipping steps, hoping to accelerate the process.

Well the main reason not to get Jimmy (not that he is available anyway) is that he makes too much money and would just complain that he's the only one playing hard.

[Vol4ever]

18 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Well the main reason not to get Jimmy (not that he is available anyway) is that he makes too much money and would just complain that he's the only one playing hard.

You cant fault his work ethic.  Dude wants to win too.  

[TheNorthCydeRises]

4 hours ago, JTB said:

This is all true except the top 10 defense element. I’ve looked this up before in the past and I’m not saying teams can be garbage at defense BUT if you take the time to look up the numbers/ranks for teams who made the finals you will see some contenders who sat just outside the top 10 in defense for that season (like 11-14)....now that’s not a significant drop off from top 10 but my point is you can’t find that for Offense. Offensively a team definitely has to be top 10 or you ain’t going far.

The topic is . . can Trae lead us to a championship?

 

Defensive rank of the past 20 NBA Champions

 

2019 Raptors - 5th

2018 Warriors - 11th

2017 Warriors - 2nd

2016 Cavs - 10th

2015 Warriors - 1st

2014 Spurs - 3rd

2013 Heat - 9th

2012 Heat - 4th

2011 Mavs - 8th

2010 Lakers - 4th

 

2009 Lakers - 6th

2008 Celtics - 1st

2007 Spurs - 2nd

2006 Heat - 9th

2005 Spurs - 1st

2004 Pistons - 2nd

2003 Spurs - 3rd

2002 Lakers - 7th

2001 Lakers - 21st

2000 Lakers - 1st

 

 

60% of championship teams have had Top 5 defenses

30% of championship teams have had Top 6 - 10 defenses

10% of championship teams have had defenses below Top 10

30% of 30% of championship teams have had Top 6 - 10 defense

 

The 2001 Lakers were a defensive outlier, like the 2004 Pistons were an offensive outlier at 18th.  When you consider that 85% of the champions for the past 20 years were 9th or higher in defense, it shows you how critical defense is to winning a title.

 

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

45 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Jimmy would take away reps from Cam and Hunter..and Huerter. I’m good.

 

LOL . . so you're telling me that you wouldn't replace a prime Jimmy Butler for any of those 3 rookies, even if it meant one of them got sent to the bench?

Jimmy automatically elevates this team to playoff level, and possibly makes our small ball lineup much more lethal than it is now ( even with Jimmy being a non 3 point shooter ).  He'd instantly become the best defender, 2nd best facilitator, and maybe the best end of game shot maker on the team.  He's also a guy who would protect Trae at all costs.

 

PG - Trae

G - Reddish

F - Butler

F - Hunter

F/C - Collins

 

Come on man . . that's a no-brainer.

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, sturt said:

That's not a good reason. Under that logic, you'd also turn down LeBron, Giannis, and any other All-Star wing.

Ahhhh no I wouldn’t but now your putting Jimmy in the category as Lebron and Giannis which is wrong.

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, sturt said:

Schlenk has said he's not interested in skipping steps.

So just agree with me and let it go. Don’t make me swim through your Symantec word schemes to solve the riddle  

[Spud2nique]

32 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

LOL . . so you're telling me that you wouldn't replace a prime Jimmy Butler for any of those 3 rookies, even if it meant one of them got sent to the bench?

Jimmy automatically elevates this team to playoff level, and possibly makes our small ball lineup much more lethal than it is now ( even with Jimmy being a non 3 point shooter ).  He'd instantly become the best defender, 2nd best facilitator, and maybe the best end of game shot maker on the team.  He's also a guy who would protect Trae at all costs.

 

PG - Trae

G - Reddish

F - Butler

F - Hunter

F/C - Collins

 

Come on man . . that's a no-brainer.

Doesn’t fit our timeline.

Has a HUGE ego.

Ok you work hard but you ain’t the only one Jimmy. 
 

Too much of an ego maniac. Nah he’d mess up our rebuild kinda like he did with the Sixers.

[AHF]

6 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Doesn’t fit our timeline.

Has a HUGE ego.

Ok you work hard but you ain’t the only one Jimmy. 
 

Too much of an ego maniac. Nah he’d mess up our rebuild kinda like he did with the Sixers.

This is a legit concern with him.  Not like he has won big anywhere.  I would put him two steps below a guy like Giannis.  But I wouldn't fear to trade away one of our young wings to get someone younger at his level.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

2 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Doesn’t fit our timeline.

Has a HUGE ego.

Ok you work hard but you ain’t the only one Jimmy. 
 

Too much of an ego maniac. Nah he’d mess up our rebuild kinda like he did with the Sixers.

 

Trae has a huge ego too.  And most superstars are egomanics.

 

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

But I wouldn't fear to trade away one of our young wings

Wow really?

Just now, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

Trae has a huge ego too.  And most superstars are egomanics.

 

True but you can’t have 2 egos.

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

Trae has a huge ego too.  And most superstars are egomanics.

 

See Durant Westbrook and many other cases throughout history. 

[sturt]

44 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Ahhhh no I wouldn’t but now your putting Jimmy in the category as Lebron and Giannis which is wrong.

 

1 hour ago, sturt said:

Under that logic,

 

[sturt]

48 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

So just agree with me and let it go. Don’t make me swim through your Symantec word schemes to solve the riddle  

 

Spud==>