John Collins trade watch

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Atlantaholic said:

He ranks bottom twenty in his draft class (out of 60 players who have logged any type of minutes) in virtually every single value stat from VORP (he ranks second to last) to WAR, to Win Shares per 48 mins, box +-, Raptor, etc.

His inability to generate significant deflections or rebounds definitely hurts his defensive numbers.  Offensively, he has been mediocre.

His one streak was 17 games from 12/23 to 1/27.  That is a very short window.  The table is set for him to do that (or better than that) for a full year if he is ready.  This will be his age 25 season so would be great to see him take that leap this year.

Most importantly to me, he has been hurt basically every offseason until this year so that is a big blow to his developmental time.  This could be a catch-up for him this offseason.  As a pending FA, he should be extremely motivated (if not simply for the potential this team carries).  

I think he is better than his numbers but his numbers have been bad enough that this could be damning with faint praise.  He should leap over that low bar this season.

[Atlantaholic]

6 minutes ago, AHF said:

His inability to generate significant deflections or rebounds definitely hurts his defensive numbers.  Offensively, he has been mediocre.

His one streak was 17 games from 12/23 to 1/27.  That is a very short window.  The table is set for him to do that (or better than that) for a full year if he is ready.  This will be his age 25 season so would be great to see him take that leap this year.

Most importantly to me, he has been hurt basically every offseason until this year so that is a big blow to his developmental time.  This could be a catch-up for him this offseason.  As a pending FA, he should be extremely motivated (if not simply for the potential this team carries).  

I think he is better than his numbers but his numbers have been bad enough that this could be damning with faint praise.  He should leap over that low bar this season.

 We invested some serious draft capital into both Hunter and OO. They both need to step up this year, stay healthy, and produce up to their draft position.

[Wretch]

8 minutes ago, Atlantaholic said:

 We invested some serious draft capital into both Hunter and OO. They both need to step up this year, stay healthy, and produce up to their draft position.

+1000 to every last word of this.  I couldn't have said it better with an entire book.

[JayBirdHawk]

37 minutes ago, Atlantaholic said:

 We invested some serious draft capital into both Hunter and OO. They both need to step up this year, stay healthy, and produce up to their draft position.

Yep #4 and #6 pick - can't stay in the shadows anymore. Gotta move to the front.

[kg01]

45 minutes ago, Atlantaholic said:

 We invested some serious draft capital into both Hunter and OO. They both need to step up this year, stay healthy, and produce up to their draft position.

You're in luck.  Some project OO to be our best player this year, it seems. 

[JayBirdHawk]

3 minutes ago, kg01 said:

You're in luck.  Some project OO to be our best player this year, it seems. 

Aaayooo @Spud2nique...come get your Cagey friend ...he's 

[kg01]

7 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Aaayooo @Spud2nique...come get your Cagey friend ...he's 

Why I would never.  Stop spreadin' rumors, burd. 

[Peoriabird]

They need to stop putting him at power forward while asking him to chase guards at the same time

[BangHolman]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

They need to stop putting him at power forward while asking him to chase guards at the same time

Murray should help a lot with this.

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Aaayooo @Spud2nique...come get your Cagey friend ...he's 

 Hence why I gave him a confused 🫤 look . 
 

I didn’t say that about OO! 

58 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Why I would never.  Stop spreadin' rumors, burd. 

Just for that, OO showin up wit a jumper and more rebounding. We mad !!!!

[kg01]

6 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

I didn’t say that about OO! 

It wasn't you.

6 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Just for that, OO showin up wit a jumper and more rebounding. We mad !!!!

I'll believe it when I see it.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Wretch said:

+1000 to every last word of this.  I couldn't have said it better with an entire book.

Stuart will take care of that if needed.  (j/k!!) 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Peoriabird said:

They need to stop putting him at power forward while asking him to chase guards at the same time

He did both of those things but not really at the same time.  This year, he should not play PF and he should have to do a lot less marking of guards.  The table is set for success.  

[Peoriabird]

29 minutes ago, AHF said:

He did both of those things but not really at the same time.  This year, he should not play PF and he should have to do a lot less marking of guards.  The table is set for success.  

Unless they trade Collins or Nate decides not to use Jalen Johnson

[RandomFan]

 

[RedDawg#8]

8 minutes ago, RandomFan said:

 

Thank Clint Capela for this.

JC gets bashed on too much for a guy who has consistently figured out a way to be valuable despite all the shortcomings of his teammates.

 

[RandomFan]

Just now, RedDawg#8 said:

Thank Clint Capela for this.

JC gets bashed on too much for a guy who has consistently figured out a way to be valuable despite all the shortcomings of his teammates.

 

Ummm, you don't blame a traditional center for filing his role that displaces a non-traditional PF. 

As was posted here previously, John is a misfit of skills for his position which makes it difficult to put players around him to maximize his strengths. 

There is nobody to "blame" those are just the cold hard facts. 

[nathan2331]

3 minutes ago, RandomFan said:

Ummm, you don't blame a traditional center for filing his role that displaces a non-traditional PF. 

As was posted here previously, John is a misfit of skills for his position which makes it difficult to put players around him to maximize his strengths. 

There is nobody to "blame" those are just the cold hard facts. 

JC is a traditional PF. Teams just don't play through their bigs in the NBA through constant post ups anymore. JC not being maximized doesn't mean he's a bad fit on this team though. He's a better option than most PFs would be. So long as we have limited offensive centers, Collins sacrificing makes us a stronger team.

[RedDawg#8]

2 minutes ago, RandomFan said:

Ummm, you don't blame a traditional center for filing his role that displaces a non-traditional PF. 

As was posted here previously, John is a misfit of skills for his position which makes it difficult to put players around him to maximize his strengths. 

There is nobody to "blame" those are just the cold hard facts. 

Ummm, yes I do blame an Old school style Center whose game has not adapted to the modern NBA where 5’s can step out and hit a 15 foot jumper or more.

You cannot credit Clint for being “traditional” while tearing down JC whose inside-out skillset would translate across any generation.

JC has ADAPTED to the modern NBA, going from a guy who didn’t shoot any jumpers his whole career to a guy who shoots above average from 3pt range.

Yes, JC absolutely deserves credit for that.

I do, in fact, blame a player who cannot do anything outside of 5ft from the rim and cannot hit his FT’s, and has zero post game to his name. Clint is literally just a lob threat and a some-timey baby-hook shooter. He has nothing else besides his defense. He even shies away from contact due to fear of going to the line.

JC deserves the utmost credit for finding more and more ways to contribute to the game despite the severe limitations of his frontcourt partner.

[RandomFan]

Some seriously wrong JC takes being dropped in here, but OK.