2022-23 Allstar Voting has started!

[AHF]

34 minutes ago, shakes said:

Who's better?

Player A:  47gp, 20ppg, 10.2apg, 57.8efg%, 22.8PER, 6.0 WS, team has 25 wins

Player B:  51 gp, 27ppg, 10.2apg, 48.5efg%, 21.8 PER, 4.6 WS, team has 29 wins

 

 

Can you replace efg% with TS%?  I care about points not whether they come from the line or the field.

[kg01]

45 minutes ago, shakes said:

Who's better?

Player A:  47gp, 20ppg, 10.2apg, 57.8efg%, 22.8PER, 6.0 WS, team has 25 wins

Player B:  51 gp, 27ppg, 10.2apg, 48.5efg%, 21.8 PER, 4.6 WS, team has 29 wins

 

 

Dunno.  Put the player names there and I'll let you know.

[shakes]

11 minutes ago, AHF said:

Can you replace efg% with TS%?  I care about points not whether they come from the line or the field.

Player A;  61% TS

Player B:  57% TS

[AHF]

3 minutes ago, shakes said:

Player A;  61% TS

Player B:  57% TS

Thanks.  Based only on those numbers, I'd say they are so close I'd need to look at other numbers / metrics to get me to say one had noticeably stronger case.  Scoring 7 more points with a 4% drop in TS% is not that far apart when balancing efficiency vs production.  The team success is pretty close but I don't weigh that heavily and think it is more often used to prop up undeserving players.  You could make the case either way based on these numbers alone but I'd probably lean towards player A due to the WS total if I had to pick based solely on the numbers.  (Just being honest for how I'd compare those two lines by themselves).

13 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Dunno.  Put the player names there and I'll let you know.

I you Try you can Tie-these together and figure it out just from the assist numbers.

[benhillboy]

3 hours ago, AHF said:

Can you replace efg% with TS%?  I care about points not whether they come from the line or the field.

Trae is currently sandwiched between Amir Coffey and Haywood Highsmith in TS added. 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, benhillboy said:

Trae is currently sandwiched between Amir Coffey and Haywood Highsmith in TS added. 

Yep.  Has moved from bottom of the barrel when you started your thread up (I think he is right about the 20th percentile whereas he was previously around the 5th percentile) but still has a ways to go to be where he needs to be.  Trae has been good in past seasons.  Has been better lately but hasn't been good on the whole this year.

Both of the % added stats are heavily position dependent, though.  TS% isn't as heavily dependent but still 24 of the top 47 slots are centers (#48 is where Haliburton appears; Trae was #14 last year).  So I don't think it is a stat you just use as a proxy for how effective someone is as a scorer by itself.  (Example:  Three of the top 10 players in FG% added are Nic Claxton, Daniel Gafford and Mason Plumlee.  None of them are even average offensive players let alone elite.)  A statistic like OBPM is much better at reflecting the best offensive contributors, imo.

Here are the top 30 by each stat for reference:

Which list strikes you as the better metric for reflecting offensive contributions?

[benhillboy]

50 minutes ago, AHF said:

Yep.  Has moved from bottom of the barrel when you started your thread up (I think he is right about the 20th percentile whereas he was previously around the 5th percentile) but still has a ways to go to be where he needs to be.  Trae has been good in past seasons.  Has been better lately but hasn't been good on the whole this year.

Both of the % added stats are heavily position dependent, though.  TS% isn't as heavily dependent but still 24 of the top 47 slots are centers (#48 is where Haliburton appears; Trae was #14 last year).  So I don't think it is a stat you just use as a proxy for how effective someone is as a scorer by itself.  (Example:  Three of the top 10 players in FG% added are Nic Claxton, Daniel Gafford and Mason Plumlee.  None of them are even average offensive players let alone elite.)  A statistic like OBPM is much better at reflecting the best offensive contributors, imo.

Here are the top 30 by each stat for reference:

Which list strikes you as the better metric for reflecting offensive contributions?

Offensive box is mainly usage based, not taking anything away.  Just guessing but I’m pretty sure only about 3 of those players are below 30%.  But that’s the only advanced BB Ref metric he’s excelled in throughout his career.  Offensive rating, adjusted shooting, win share, on/ off all mediocre or worse.

If you wanna go “guard specific” have you ever been impressed with his steals or assist to turn?  Both also mediocre to much worse.  Granted FT shooting always been elite.

Edited February 16, 2023 by benhillboy

[benhillboy]

Haliburton and Jimmy are the notable names from your OBPM list missing in top usage and I assure you they will never want to even approach anything near 30%.  Other than that the lists are pretty much tied together.  Players like Poole, Westbrick, and Jalen Green obviously stupidly high in usage.  Durant, Booker, Brown, and Edwards to lesser extents, not the most shrewd passers.

Edited February 16, 2023 by benhillboy

[ABH]

Going to be a fun night

[shakes]

got to see a real all star PG up close and personal last night.  I really hope Brunson gets the replacement call, he's earned it.

 

I read that since the all star reserves wer announced Brunson is shooting 60% from the field.  LOL, has our all NBA PG even had a single game all year where he shot over 60% from the field?  I"ll save you the research....the answer is no.

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, shakes said:

got to see a real all star PG up close and personal last night.  I really hope Brunson gets the replacement call, he's earned it.

 

I read that since the all star reserves wer announced Brunson is shooting 60% from the field.  LOL, has our all NBA PG even had a single game all year where he shot over 60% from the field?  I"ll save you the research....the answer is no.

 

 

He's been really good this year for the Knicks

[JayBirdHawk]

Kevin was brutal with only 8 points

 

 

 

 

...Julius made his son cry

 

 

 

 

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Kevin was brutal with only 8 points

 

 

 

 

...Julius made his son cry

 

 

 

 

Randle’s kid is  

[macdaddy]

Poor Kevin.  He must still think he's a Hawk or something.  

This may have been posted already.  

NBA Legend Wants Players Drug Tested After Trae Young's Snub - Sports Illustrated Atlanta Hawks News, Analysis and More

 

[JayBirdHawk]

12 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Poor Kevin.  He must still think he's a Hawk or something.  

Speaking of Kevin.....his 3 point percentages have been trending down each month since his hot start.....53.2, 41.1, 37.5, 37.2, 28.6...still could use him on the Hawks.

[AHF]

On 2/15/2023 at 7:33 PM, benhillboy said:

Offensive box is mainly usage based, not taking anything away.  Just guessing but I’m pretty sure only about 3 of those players are below 30%.  But that’s the only advanced BB Ref metric he’s excelled in throughout his career.  Offensive rating, adjusted shooting, win share, on/ off all mediocre or worse.

If you wanna go “guard specific” have you ever been impressed with his steals or assist to turn?  Both also mediocre to much worse.  Granted FT shooting always been elite.

I’ve given you a ton of data on why Ast%/TO% is MUCH BETTER than simple A/TO ratio.  I’ve done it a dozen times probably and have never seen you respond so I’m kind of out about discussing simple A/TO ratio with you when all my previous posts have been the equivalent of taking to the void.  If you legitimately want to discuss this, then find one of the prior posts I’ve made specifically to you on this topic and let’s start from there.

[Spud2nique]

F you Adam Silver. Filling out those ballots for nothin! Malnutrition frail Pee Wee Herman puppet looking perv!