The Official NBASupes, Sothron, and theCampster Insider Thread - NBA 2022-23 Season

[sturt]

58 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

What do you expect? This whole thread is literally based on rumors and conjectures.

Allow me to answer that. I expect if a poster asserts that obtaining KP would not require us to give up Murray, then that poster has a particular trade proposal in mind... and especially if trying to sell the conclusion that a trade for KP would allow that, while a trade for KAT would not. And again, truth is, both WAS and MIN are definitely looking for a PG upgrade.

[ShooterSays]

25 minutes ago, sturt said:

Allow me to answer that. I expect if a poster asserts that obtaining KP would not require us to give up Murray, then that poster has a particular trade proposal in mind... and especially if trying to sell the conclusion that a trade for KP would allow that, while a trade for KAT would not. And again, truth is, both WAS and MIN are definitely looking for a PG upgrade.

[JTB]

I know many on this board think it’s unrealistic and typically I would agree but I actually think the possibilities of getting KAT here in Atlanta is very possible but while it’s exciting….. it’s not.

Trae + KAT would be a ridiculous offense and I’m not at all worried about KATs recent injuries. He has more of a track record of being available than not being available.

But the reason I can’t get too excited if we were to pair Trae & KAT is because I’d need to understand what’s going around those two. OO is a given …ok that’s great but what else?

You need some seriously good ass defenders around Trae and KAT. Can’t just be OO. If we got into this situation I’d seriously consider trading for player like Thybulle. Assuming we can hold on to hunter in a KAT trade (which I believe we can). I would prefer a true point of attack defender who can really get at it Thybulle like even if he can’t space the floor.

 

Trae, Thybulle (like player), Hunter, OO, KAT

Keep bench as is. Then we could truly contend.

[JTB]

38 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

I like the idea of keeping Murray oppose to trading him in a KAT deal but either way id be happy as long as the overall build out of the roster makes sense.

Love the idea of Trae + KAT but also love the idea of Trae + Murray + Porzingis.

I’m thinking the deeper we are the better oppose to 2 big names.

 

[sturt]

We have vastly different assessments of Porzingis, or Collins, or both. Vastly.

You imagine we should pay not even just one, but two  FRPs for the privilege of one season of the $36m player (, ie $10m more than JC, who I control for at least 3 seasons locked-in at his current salary, no raises).

If I'm paying that, you'd have to show me so much more divide between most recent four years' histories than this...

 

If I make that deal at all, it's straight up.

Look. We don't even get the routine benefit of KP as an expiring salary because we're already so far above the salary cap that we can't participate in free agency anyhow... so, next season, he's replaced by someone on the MLE at best.

So, it's a strain to even see straight-up as reasonable.

[ShooterSays]

You’re going to ignore the most important factor in all of this, SIZE? Size matters…

OO is our Center of the future. Agree? I don’t think there’s much denying that.

OO is 6’8”. JC is maybe 6’9”. Pair them in the front court and between a 6’0” (maybe) Trae and 6’4” Murray we’re one of the smallest teams in the NBA…maybe THE smallest.

Give me the 7’3” Unicorn all day. And to get something of value, you have to give something of value. Could be 1 pick, could be 2. Idk… But I do know if JC had much value he wouldn’t still be a Hawk. 

[JayBirdHawk]

13 hours ago, ShooterSays said:

 2 1sts for a guys as a FA or the right  to overpay him?  Pass all day.  

Think back about what he was traded from Dallas for, having a 'decent' season after that trade doesn't warrant an overpay.

I'll say what I say during this time of year - Stop giving away the Hawks stuff!!!

[sturt]

52 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

But I do know if JC had much value he wouldn’t still be a Hawk. 

Last part first...

But you don't. (Know that.)

C'mon. The laws of logic have to be applied consistently. That offers have been made for Player X but were not accepted, or that offers have been made to deal Player X but were not accepted... either way... only means that two sides were not able to agree on value. That's all. Period. And without knowing exactly what other teams' GMs offered in return, it's not even reasonably possible to come to merely an informed opinion, let alone the conclusion you just stated.

Let's try to confine discussions within some boundaries of rational thought.

 

52 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

You’re going to ignore the most important factor in all of this, SIZE? Size matters…

OO is our Center of the future. Agree? I don’t think there’s much denying that.

OO is 6’8”. JC is maybe 6’9”. Pair them in the front court and between a 6’0” (maybe) Trae and 6’4” Murray we’re one of the smallest teams in the NBA…maybe THE smallest.

Eastern Conference champ's primary 2022-23 starting line-up

Lowry 6-0

Herro 6-5

Martin 6-5

Butler 6-7

Adebayo 6-9

 

Atlanta hypothetical future line-up

Young 6-0

Murray 6-4

Hunter 6-7

Collins 6-9

Okongwu 6-8

 

Not seeing this startling difference you're suggesting. Not even a little bit. To the contrary, we're (slightly) bigger overall in the front court, which is where bigger actually matters to any significant degree.

 

And of course, all of that avoids any  of the points made with regard to how such a trade would set us back after one year of Porzingis... who barely moves the needle, if at all, when looking at raw cold hard statistical intel in comparison to JC.

 

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, ShooterSays said:

SIZE? Size matters…

12 hours ago, JTB said:

I’m thinking the deeper we are the better oppose to 2 big names.

I think we both want the same thing but you’re saying it weird 

[Spud2nique]

18 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 2 1sts for a guys as a FA or the right  to overpay him?  Pass all day.  

Think back about what he was traded from Dallas for, having a 'decent' season after that trade doesn't warrant an overpay.

I'll say what I say during this time of year - Stop giving away the Hawks stuff!!!

When TF did Kristap become a unicorn …. I mean again.. ? 

[JayBirdHawk]

23 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 2 1sts for a guys as a FA or the right  to overpay him?  Pass all day.  

Think back about what he was traded from Dallas for, having a 'decent' season after that trade doesn't warrant an overpay.

I'll say what I say during this time of year - Stop giving away the Hawks stuff!!!

I mean...

The Dallas Mavericks traded forward/center Kristaps Porzingis and a protected second-round pick to the Washington Wizards in exchange for Spencer Dinwiddie and Davis Bertans.

[JayBirdHawk]

1 hour ago, ShooterSays said:

Give me the 7’3” Unicorn

 

 

 

 

[ShooterSays]

15 minutes ago, sturt said:

Eastern Conference champ's primary 2022-23 starting line-up

Lowry 6-0

Herro 6-5

Martin 6-5

Butler 6-7

Adebayo 6-9

You’re not wrong about this team winning the East, but this smaller lineup has also been outmatched so far against Denver’s bigs. Clint also gave them fits.

I get what you and @JayBirdHawk are saying about compensation for KP. I’m obviously open to getting him for less than what I proposed lol But I think the challenge the Hawks are going to face is who to pair with OO. Maybe that’s JC, but my personal opinion is we need more size.

Wish there was a world where OO and Clint worked together, but so far that hasn’t been seen and I think the time where we have to choose one is getting close as OO is ready to start.

[Spud2nique]

1 minute ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

 

 

 

My little Po…rzingis  I mean … pony.

[JayBirdHawk]

8 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

 

I get what you and @JayBirdHawk are saying about compensation for KP. I’m obviously open to getting him for less than what I proposed lol But I think the challenge the Hawks are going to face is who to pair with OO. 

The other challenge for the Hawks is Porzingas' $36 million dollar salary. That's already $11 million more than JC for next season.

And if you plan to keep him beyond next season, how much are you willing to pay him? 

[Spud2nique]

That’s ittttt, I’m sorry the conductor of the train has asked me to politely ask the Porzingo lovers to go ahead and watch your step as you… step off the train .

Thank you and goodbye  

[kg01]

4 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

That’s ittttt, I’m sorry the conductor of the train has asked me to politely ask the Porzingo lovers to go ahead and watch your step as you… step off the train .

Thank you and goodbye  

I like it on paper but in practice seems untenable.  I await anyone that can poopoo my BLopez idea.... 

@ShooterSays ain't wrong in wanting us to have more positional size, fwiw. 

[Spud2nique]

Just now, kg01 said:

I like it on paper but in practice seems untenable.  I await anyone that can poopoo my BLopez idea.... 

I was staring at your freak at work yesterday and scrolled about 40 players down and saw another one of your freak targets of 4 years ago in Thomas Bryant… and another sandwiched in between. You been craving bigs huh? 3 bigs in the last few years. We need a big NURKY DURKY type fck indeed.

[Wretch]

43 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I mean...

The Dallas Mavericks traded forward/center Kristaps Porzingis and a protected second-round pick to the Washington Wizards in exchange for Spencer Dinwiddie and Davis Bertans.

See....   

Now take that trade and consider the trade out of NY:

• Mavericks receive: Kristaps Porzingis, Trey Burke, Tim Hardaway Jr. and Courtney Lee
• Knicks receive: DeAndre Jordan, Wesley Matthews, Dennis Smith Jr., 2021 first round draft pick, 2023 first round draft pick (top-10 protected)

Then consider this in light of his injury history and this is where I'm stuck at.  Aside from these GM's knowing something we don't, I can't get my head around why the modest returns on him.

That said, I would explore a fair trade for him in a heartbeat and move pieces around to start him with OO.

[ShooterSays]

11 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

The other challenge for the Hawks is Porzingas' $36 million dollar salary. That's already $11 million more than JC for next season.

And if you plan to keep him beyond next season, how much are you willing to pay him? 

True but we’re also paying $46M between JC and Capela. And I don’t see us paying Cap $21M this year and $22M next year to come off the bench IF we choose to start OO.