2023-24 Insider Information Thread

[theheroatl]

Winning a championship is hard. It’s not a perfect mix of players but it is definitely about talent. There is a good bit of luck involved but in the NBA and most sports, the more you spend the higher chance you have of hitting into something.

Yall waste so much time creating excuses why we shouldn’t spend or chase talent.

 

Instead of wasting time worrying about fit, collect the best talent and coaching and throw it out there. It’s not perfect and you can’t expect to just win.

There certainly are long winded posts around here trying to explain a path to success or the right plan but that’s pretty much just a colossal waste of time on those posters part.

 

If yall think you got the right plan figured out or you are a front office genius or you know which rookies will hit into all-nba talent, you should have chosen a career path in an nba front office.

Edited July 30, 2023 by theheroatl

[Diesel]

14 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

Winning a championship is hard. It’s not a perfect mix of players but it is definitely about talent. There is a good bit of luck involved but in the NBA and most sports, the more you spend the higher chance you have of hitting into something.

Yall waste so much time creating excuses why we shouldn’t spend or chase talent.

 

Instead of wasting time worrying about fit, collect the best talent and coaching and throw it out there. It’s not perfect and you can’t expect to just win.

There certainly are long winded posts around here trying to explain a path to success or the right plan but that’s pretty much just a colossal waste of time on those posters part.

 

If yall think you got the right plan figured out or you are a front office genius or you know which rookies will hit into all-nba talent, you should have chosen a career path in an nba front office.

•  Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the finals?
• Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the ECFs?
• Do you believe that the spacing on our offense will be helped by any of the proposed trades?
• Do you not see potential in AJ or JJ or Bey?

[theheroatl]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

•  Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the finals?
• Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the ECFs?
• Do you believe that the spacing on our offense will be helped by any of the proposed trades?
• Do you not see potential in AJ or JJ or Bey?

D my man, nothing is guaranteed.

 

Talent over spacing

 

All 3 of those have tons of potential.

 

what else you got

[Peoriabird]

20 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

D my man, nothing is guaranteed.

 

Talent over spacing

 

All 3 of those have tons of potential.

 

what else you got

You seem to see all of this talent that I just don't see.  Trae is a nice player who if he improved his shooting and turnover rate could be a 2nd or 3rd team all NBA but not an all time great.  Murray is just an occasional All star when he has a good season and Siakam is a guy that is pretty good at what he does but what he does is not good enough to counter the multi talented players he has to compete with. None of these players are generational talents or MVP types. And now you are saying that you can just throw this mix together and they will out perform Durant/Hardin/Irving or Durant/Paul/Booker or George/Leonard etc?  You don't even believe that nonsense. 

[theheroatl]

3 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

You seem to see all of this talent that I just don't see.  Trae is a nice player who if he improved his shooting and turnover rate could be a 2nd or 3rd team all NBA but not an all time great.  Murray is just an occasional All star when he has a good season and Siakam is a guy that is pretty good at what he does but what he does is not good enough to counter the multi talented players he has to compete with. None of these players are generational talents or MVP types. And now you are saying that you can just throw this mix together and they will out perform Durant/Hardin/Irving or Durant/Paul/Booker or George/Leonard etc?  You don't even believe that nonsense. 

No there’s a chance they won’t out perform those. I don’t even know what you qualify as an nba top tier talent. You seem like overly negative on anyone not named in the top 10 all time.

 

Understanding your position Peoria would solve a lot. I don’t even pretend to know how you would construct a championship level roster.

[Peoriabird]

2 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

No there’s a chance they won’t out perform those. I don’t even know what you qualify as an nba top tier talent. You seem like overly negative on anyone not named in the top 10 all time.

 

Understanding your position Peoria would solve a lot. I don’t even pretend to know how you would construct a championship level roster.

It may not involve Trae Young.  Y'all think that Trae is some key ingredient to success.  I just haven't seen it yet.

[kg01]

4 hours ago, warcore said:

I would start bringing your own water bottles. Don't use the jug on the table. 

I just think it's unfair everybody gets to use the dippin spoon but me.

[JeffS17]

8 hours ago, bird_dirt said:

 

It will be really funny if so much time and energy is spent by folks here debating Siakam and he doesn’t get traded here. 

 

Most of the energy right now is basically just ppl saying “We didn’t want him anyways” because the Raptors have been skittish to take our (likely low ball) offer, so the interesting thing will be if hes traded here, and how quickly everyones narrative shifts around his fit into the roster, his talent level, and his willingness to re-sign.

[kg01]

10 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

Most of the energy right now is basically just ppl saying “We didn’t want him anyways” because the Raptors have been skittish to take our (likely low ball) offer, so the interesting thing will be if hes traded here, and how quickly everyones narrative shifts around his fit into the roster, his talent level, and his willingness to re-sign.

Untrue.  The 'energy' here is that we shouldn't overpay.  That energy will never change. 

[georgia]

If the hawks trade capela- who in the world is gonna back up OO.    No way we think Bruno or Javale McGee in a trade from Dallas is the way to go.   
 

Detroit has to let someone go one would think btw wiseman, bagley, duren and stewart 

[Spud2nique]

5 hours ago, kg01 said:

I just want it to be over so me and @Spud2nique can be friends again. 

I've been getting death threats after outsiders meetings.  The police say it's not him, but I know spud's handwriting.  

 

 

 

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

•  Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the finals?
• Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the ECFs?
• Do you believe that the spacing on our offense will be helped by any of the proposed trades?
• Do you not see potential in AJ or JJ or Bey?

 

Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the finals?

Of course it doesn't guarantee us a trip to the NBA Finals, but it dramatically improves our chances.

• We would acquire a player that is a top 10 PF in the league and arguably a top 25 player overall
• We would be able to assemble a starting unit with 3 of the top 40 players in the league
• We would be able to attack our opponents in multiple ways, putting maximum pressure on them at all 3 levels on the court
• We would be able to throw this lineup at people
  • Trae
  • Murray 
  • Bogi
  • Siakam
  • Okongwu

That is a well balanced group of players, with 4 of them having the ability to create their own shot off the dribble.  The bench could be filled in with low cost vets who know how to play the game, and with talented undrafted rookies.     Our starting unit could be one of the top 5 best in the league

• NBA Finals chance:  15%

 

Do you think Siakam guarantees us a trip to the ECFs?

Once again, there's no such thing as a guarantee in sports, but it dramatically improves our chances.  Siakam gives us the ability to run offense through him as a scorer and as a facilitator. That could completely unlock our guards as spot up shooters, as well as give Okongwu easy opportunities for baskets along the baseline.  And this is a group that you couldn't load up and double someone.  The days of sending double and triple teams at Trae will be gone, because you'd have both DJ and Siakam that could handle the ball, or cut to Trae to receive the ball.

And who do you fear in the East?  With Siakam, I don't know if Boston is better than us. Miami will not be better than us. Milwaukee ( maybe ), only because they're such a big team. Philly ( maybe ), because they have the league MVP . . but he can't get out of the 2nd round.

• EC Finals chance:  25%

 

Do you believe that the spacing on our offense will be helped by any of the proposed trades?

Spacing will not be affected AND we'll be more dangerous on offense.  The thing that is overlooked about Siakam, is his passing ability.  That means that a guy like Trae gets more spot up opportunities from 3, instead of creating his own 3 point shots off the dribble.  That could dramatically improve his efficiency from 3.  DJ is an average 3 point shooter who actually showed some improvement this season.  With Bogi still on the team, we know he can shoot in the high 30% - low 40% from 3

Spacing?  You mean like we've had in past seasons with John Collins at the 4?  Siakam at least shoots just as well if not better than Collins.  And even Okongwu wouldn't be rooted to just being under the rim under Quin.  Our spacing and our ability to create easier lay up and dunk attempts may be even better with 3 guys on the court who can pass the basketball.

 

Do you not see potential in AJ or JJ or Bey?

Those guys have good potential and are good prospects.  But do they have All-Star / All-NBA potential that can be realized within the next 2 years?  AJ, JJ, and Bey being decent and serviceable players may not be enough to take the Hawks to the next level, as is.  One of those guys are going to have to start showing "star level" talent.  So do you want to wait for the kids to develop into stars?  Or do you want to acquire a star right now?

I mean, it's not like we haven't been disappointed lottery picks or talented 1st round picks that we thought could become stars, but just didn't quite make it to that level.

• Stacey Augmon
• Jason Terry
• Marvin Williams
• Josh Smith
• Jeff Teague
• Dennis Schröder
• John Collins

Out of that list, only Teague made an All-Star team. And that was only because the team was playing at a historic level at the time.  His numbers definitely didn't "scream" All-Star worthy ( 17 ppg - 7.5 asst - 46% FG before the 2015 All-Star break )

So the question REALLY is . . . if AJ, JJ, or Bey only become as good as the players above, will that help the Hawks get to championship level in 2 - 3 years?

Edited July 30, 2023 by TheNorthCydeRises

[TheNorthCydeRises]

And all of those players above good to very good starters for us.  They just didn't turn into All-Star level talents.

 

59 minutes ago, georgia said:

If the hawks trade capela- who in the world is gonna back up OO.    No way we think Bruno or Javale McGee in a trade from Dallas is the way to go.   
 

Detroit has to let someone go one would think btw wiseman, bagley, duren and stewart 

 

Both Bruno and McGee can play a backup center role, in which we're asking them to play 10 - 16 minutes a game to rebound, rim protect, and score off lobs and offensive rebounds around the rim.  No offense will be ran for those guys, so their worth will strictly be on the defensive end.  Anything we'd get offensively from those two, will be a bonus.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

3 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

It may not involve Trae Young.  Y'all think that Trae is some key ingredient to success.  I just haven't seen it yet.

 

He actually posed a great question.  Construct a championship roster.

Here are your restraints:

• You can only use 2 guys who are All-NBA talents
• Your 3rd guy has to be a best, a fringe All-Star talent . . ( no more than 1 All-Star appearance )
• The remaining 2 starters cannot be All-Star talents
• And you cannot use more than 2 guys off of the same team to construct your team.  This means that you can't simply take Jokic, Murray, and Gordon, and add 2 more people to round out the team.

Build what you think would be a championship level team.

 

If Peoria isn't willing or able to do this, how about someone else take a crack at this.  Should be pretty easy, right?

Edited July 31, 2023 by TheNorthCydeRises

[marco102]

1 hour ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

He actually posed a great question.  Construct a championship roster.

Here are your restraints:

• You can only use 2 guys who are All-NBA talents
• Your 3rd guy has to be a best, a fringe All-Star talent . . ( no more than 1 All-Star appearance )
• The remaining 2 starters cannot be All-Star talents
• And you cannot use more than 2 guys off of the same team to construct your team.  This means that you can't simply take Jokic, Murray, and Gordon, and add 2 more people to round out the team.

Build what you think would be a championship level team.

 

If Peoria isn't willing or able to do this, how about someone else take a crack at this.  Should be pretty easy, right?

You'll never get a response to this because someone just wants to argue about Trae Young's talent.  I'm glad y'all have matured enough not to take the bait and just let some people be miserable as they root against their star player.

Edited July 31, 2023 by marco102

[Carmine]

This Siakim Mania makes no sense to me?!?! His team's own fans don't even want him

[Diesel]

6 hours ago, theheroatl said:

Talent over spacing

Really?  If you talent decreases spacing, then that's not really the talent you need. 

 

[AHF]

2 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

He actually posed a great question.  Construct a championship roster.

Here are your restraints:

• You can only use 2 guys who are All-NBA talents
• Your 3rd guy has to be a best, a fringe All-Star talent . . ( no more than 1 All-Star appearance )
• The remaining 2 starters cannot be All-Star talents
• And you cannot use more than 2 guys off of the same team to construct your team.  This means that you can't simply take Jokic, Murray, and Gordon, and add 2 more people to round out the team.

Build what you think would be a championship level team.

 

If Peoria isn't willing or able to do this, how about someone else take a crack at this.  Should be pretty easy, right?

How about this:

PG: SGA (1x AS)

SG: OG (0x AS) 

SF: Mikal Bridges (0x AS)

PF: Giannis (All-NBA)

C.:  Jokic (All-NBA)

[marco102]

15 minutes ago, AHF said:

How about this:

PG: SGA (1x AS)

SG: OG (0x AS) 

SF: Mikal Bridges (0x AS)

PF: Giannis (All-NBA)

C.:  Jokic (All-NBA)

Can you make that work under the salary cap or are we just using @TheNorthCydeRises criterion?

[AHF]

Just now, marco102 said:

Can you make that work under the salary cap or are we just using @TheNorthCydeRises criterion?

I was just doing TNC rules.  It is not a realistic lineup.