Horford has been Garbage

[TheNorthCydeRises]

14 rebounds and 6 assists and people are saying he is "garbage"? Well then last night Josh Smith was "CYO League" bad. At times Josh Smith did things that made it look like he was throwing the game. But at least he removed the headband so we knew he was upset. He took bad basketball to dizzying heights last night. A total detriment on the floor.

But hey, let's bash the guy who actually did something positive for the team.

The problem is . . Al played well in very short stretches last night. 4 of Al's 6 assists came in the 1st quarter. He grabbed 9 rebounds in the 2nd half . . but only shot 1 - 7 FG during that time. And in a game in which a ton of jumpers were missed on both sides, the 14 rebounds he grabbed is even diminished somewhat.

The problem with Al is that he's our BIG . . but he's playing like a 2-guard. The only thing he's doing like a big, is defensive rebounding. But he's not mixing it up in the paint at all, he can't hit his patented jumper, and he's getting outworked by the opposing big.

I guess if we'd come back to win the game, you could give Al more credit for the rebounding he did do in the 2nd half. And if he made a key play down the stretch, the inadequate play of most of the game could be overlooked somewhat. But to see the activity of the Chicago frontline, combined with what we did, was just atrocious. Yes, Smith was definitely CYO or Rec League bad. No doubt on that. But Horford wasn't much better. Smith's mistakes stick out like a sore thumb, but it's the "softness" of Horford that's starting to show itself more and more throughout these playoffs.

I want the guy back that used to flex on people when he made a play on the inside, not this Mehmet Okur clone.

In order to run a pick and roll the big man has to roll to the basket which Horford doesn't want to do. I have seen countless passes where the passer led him with a pass expecting him to roll to the basket and it winds up being a turnover because Horford doesn't roll.

I sure don't see any Karl Malone in Horford. Malone would be killing that soft front line for Chicago. Horford is having trouble backing down Noah lol.

And I have to give you credit, because you've been talking about this very thing for 4 years. That, and the fact that he refuses ( or can't ) take people off the dribble and drive to the hole. It's almost like the lane is painted with kryptonite paint, and it zaps all of his power if he gets inside of it.

I though a guy like Horford would step up during the playoffs, many of you guys throughout the season were saying he was our best player...

And I'll +1 you for that sir. A lot of people were ready to abandon JJ, and give all of the leadership and responsibility to Horford. But in these playoffs, he's shooting a dredful 22 - 72 ( 31% FG ) on shots not directly at the rim. He's not making his midrange jumper, nor is he making the very few shots that he takes in the paint. If it isn't a layup or dunk, he's been dredful in these playoffs offensively.

[benhillboy]

I wouldn't say garbage. Recycle bin maybe. I don't hinge on numbers with Al, it's just a look thing. Sometimes you don't realize he's on the floor more often than I can ever remember, which happens to everybody on the team when they're standing around watching each other shoot jumpers. I don't buy the injury being much of a factor either. I just think his head is swollen just a bit with all the positive national articles, his jumper percentage, second All-Stat bid, and seemingly premature assertion from many (including myself) that he is the singular leader of this team. If I give him a pass and chalk his lowered level of play to a few nagging injuries here and there and still being young, then I'm gonna have quite high expectations for improvements in his post-up and dribble-drive game next season, no exceptions, because both are lacking considerably for his size and accolades now. His jumper is too much of a crutch now. He pumped Boozer and went to the hole for two I think once last night, something that occurs way too seldomly.

Edited May 5, 2011 by benhillboy

[MaceCase]

Numbers CAN lie... the man he was guarding and being guarded by all game went for 20 and 10 with half as many shots and pure hustle (which is suppose to be what Al does). and that guy going against him was JOAKIM NOAH... GTFO! That's garbage play if you ask me.

As far as Josh... I'm one of his bigger critics sometimes but at least he showed up defensively and in the fourth quarter...again.

I could of sworn Noah was Josh's assignment? It would just seem as if he was Al's because Al was the only redshirt in the paint hitting the boards so I see where the confusion comes from.

[Sothron]

Numbers CAN lie... the man he was guarding and being guarded by all game went for 20 and 10 with half as many shots and pure hustle (which is suppose to be what Al does). and that guy going against him was JOAKIM NOAH... GTFO! That's garbage play if you ask me.

As far as Josh... I'm one of his bigger critics sometimes but at least he showed up defensively and in the fourth quarter...again.

Um, no. Did you watch the game? Josh was defending Noah, Horford was on him only a few times. Horford was on Boozer more often. Josh's complete lack of blocking out on rebounds is what got us killed on their offensive rebounds. Trying to blame Horford for Josh's crappy play is hilarious.

[Rattler4life000]

Um, no. Did you watch the game? Josh was defending Noah, Horford was on him only a few times. Horford was on Boozer more often. Josh's complete lack of blocking out on rebounds is what got us killed on their offensive rebounds. Trying to blame Horford for Josh's crappy play is hilarious.

Horford...................... S - O - F - T. until I see other wise, you can punk him easily. It would be nice if he had some of the Zaza attitude to go with his talent

[AHawks89]

I've been saying this for a while, but no one wants to believe it.

[DJlaysitup]

I've been saying this for a while, but no one wants to believe it.

OK we all know AL s_cks balls. As a 6-9 1/2 Center he is too small...as a PF he relies on the mid-range jumper. He is an All-Star basically due to his lack of tattoos..he is a "Stern" all-star. Occasionally he has a good game but it can't be counted on.

Actually AL (at 6-9 1/2) plays like a 6-8 guy...the only guy who plays smaller is Marvin (6-9 and plays like 6-6) :angry:

[BrazilianHawk]

I'm not just talking about last night, his overall play the last couple months has been spotty. People are saying he is injured, but I don't buy it at all.

I felt this way for awhile now, even before the playoffs started.

Really, Al has been shooting terribly. But he's still finding a way to not harm the team too much. I believe he's injured. People get hurt often.

Tell me, wouldn't you believe Josh had his head injured when he was a baby? I would certainly believe it! :saythat:

[BrazilianHawk]

Numbers CAN lie... the man he was guarding and being guarded by all game went for 20 and 10 with half as many shots and pure hustle (which is suppose to be what Al does). and that guy going against him was JOAKIM NOAH... GTFO! That's garbage play if you ask me.

As far as Josh... I'm one of his bigger critics sometimes but at least he showed up defensively and in the fourth quarter...again.

Dude... have you even watched the game? During the first half Noah was being checked by Smoove, not Al. Al was on Loozer and feel free to take a took at what Boozer did in the first half. Go ahead and check who was on Noah when he got that many offensive rebounds in the first half.

LD put Al of Noah on the second half, because Smoove wouldn't get it done, and I can tell he did a way better job than Smoove did.

Edited May 5, 2011 by BrazilianHawk

[atlbraves93]

Looking at the stats, it would appear that Horf had a far worse game than Smoove. Anyone who actually watched the game could tell you that the exact opposite was true. First of all, take a look at the field goal attempts. LD has said all year long that bad shot selection has killed this team. It looked to me like Horf was killing the team with his shots, and Josh was actually attempting good shots. The one thing that Hawks fans have criticized Josh for all year long is settling for low-percentage mid-range jumpers. Well, in this game, he didn't do that - 9 of his 14 field goal attempts were in the paint.

Horford took horrible shots in this game - 8 FG attempts from 18+ feet away... what is he thinking? He is our big man, and part of the reason why we only scored 73 points is because there is no threat of a low post game. When you constantly rely on jump shots, your shooting percentage is not going to be very high. You have to be able to work the ball down low and get some high percentage shots from your big man - just look at what Noah did. Al was worthless on offense this game, and not much better on defense. Sure, he got 14 defensive rebounds because he had a lot of opportunities, but he also conceded offensive rebound after offensive rebound to Noah. Not to mention he never fought for a single loose ball - there were a lot of these, and they definitely hurt the Hawks. Overall, Game 2 was a poor performance for Horford.

[99PROBL3MS]

I am just upset with the fact that we held a team to 86pts on 39% shooting and still found a way to lose. I am so sick of not just Smoove, but EVERYONE on this team taking bad shots all freaking game. It is like they are too stupid at times to realize how good they can be if they just don't play like idiots. We clearly have more talent than CHI. Deng and Rose are the only two Bulls who would even play for us. If I didn't feel like we could win this series, then maybe I wouldn't be upset. Teague has kept Rose in check. JJ has outplayed CHI's SGs by a ton. We have to get more from Marvin, Smoove and Horford. If they would just hit their AVERAGE numbers, we win this series easily. Also Craw has to try and at least get better shots off instead of chucking terrible shots. It is frustrating to watch even if they go in sometiems. Okay......./rant.

[Joker]

In order to run a pick and roll the big man has to roll to the basket which Horford doesn't want to do. I have seen countless passes where the passer led him with a pass expecting him to roll to the basket and it winds up being a turnover because Horford doesn't roll.

I sure don't see any Karl Malone in Horford. Malone would be killing that soft front line for Chicago. Horford is having trouble backing down Noah lol.

Someone doesn't understand the perplexity of the PnR what it takes to run a successful PnR in the NBA. It's one of the reason why the PnR PG's is the second most coveted players in the NBA outside of the true Center. As much as Bibby isn't a threat on the dribble drive and can't play defense, his ability to run the PnR is seen as very good in the NBA even though he's not even close to the same league as CP3, Nash, Stockton, and Deron who are elite at it. It takes timing, vision, BBIQ, and passing ability to run a successful PnR. Horford will not cut if there is nothing there to cut for. The PG sets up the PnR, not the other way around. This is an overall ignorant a$s post to someone like me who has played the position and can run a successful PnR with regularity.

Malone would be doing the same thing Al is doing on this team. I hate when people talk out there *ss when a player ISN'T in the ideal situation for their talent. I remember the whole Randy Moss is trash and washed up when he was in Oakland talk. I told people he wasn't in an ideal place and they didn't have the pieces to play around him. Got traded to New England and crushed almost every WR record there was.

I don't know what you are trying to prove but I will give you this. You sounded like a jackass and pissed me off with it. I haven't been pissed at a poster for a dumb post in years on this site. Congrats on that.

Edited May 6, 2011 by nbasuperstar40

[Marvin24Williams]

Horfs been garbage in the playoffs. Can't create his own shot, horrid post moves, and decent rebounding with average defense.

Jeff "floater specialist" teague is the future.

[exodus]

Someone doesn't understand the perplexity of the PnR what it takes to run a successful PnR in the NBA.

and that person is you. Time and again Bibby would lead Horford with a pass on a pick and roll and would get a turnover because Horford wouldn't roll to the basket. The same thing would happen with Smith. Smith would lead Horford with a pass and would get a turnover because Horford wouldn't roll. Horford hasn't ever rolled to the basket consistently since he has been here.

You can't run a pick and roll with a big man who doesn't roll no matter who the point guard is. If Malone was on this team he would be killing the Bulls with his physicality inside. Horford looks like he is scared to go inside. He is playing like a shooting guard.

Given your lack of basketball knowlege i can certainly understand your confusion. What's Brandon Wright up to lately?

:sarcastichand:

Edited May 6, 2011 by exodus

[exodus]

Horford setting a new standard for suck in the beginning of game 3.

[TRUEINTELLECTPLAYA]

Horford and Smith are soft as butter rolls

[Sothron]

Al's not the only guy refusing to cut to the basket. I freeze framed and went back to show my wife and our friends watching the game here at my house seven times in the first half alone that our big men (Al, Josh, Collins, Zaza) had CLEAR PATHS to the basket and refused flat out REFUSED to attack the basket which would have resulted in an easy layup, dunk or forcing the Bulls to foul.

This is coached to all our big men. Josh and Al get the most heat being the starters but its our backup bigs as well. They simply pass out of the high post even when given CLEAR PATHS to the basket.

[BudBall]

:oops:

Edited May 7, 2011 by ISOJoe

[wfhawkfan]

Al's wool pulling ability :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: