The ultimate answer at the PG position is...

[Lurker]

Likely neither Jeff Teague nor Dennis Schröder.

You see here's what the real problem has been offensively in the playoffs: Neither of their jump shots are respected (and the sad thing is, Jeff Teague with a 40% three point shot is being hilariously unrespected on it still all season and into the playoffs), so teams go way under on both and it clogs the PNR up and totally shuts down the Hawks offense.

That's all that's really happening here. The offense is being clogged up due to both PGs inability to shoot a jump shot.

This problem won't be solved until one of them gets a jump shot that teams respect. Do we really thing that Teague going on 28 now is going to find one? And Schröder's looks completely hopeless right now.

If this ends up in a Boston backdoor sweep, it's time to move on from both PGs.

[macdaddy]

I understand your point but to me it speaks more to our total lack of offense on the wing.   When you depend on your PG for all your backcourt scoring then you're going to have problems in the playoffs.   Put someone with handles and the ability to get a shot and draw fouls on the wing and both Dennis and Teague are good options.

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

PG is set for the Hawks. Teague/Schröder is a great 1-2 punch. The problem isn't PG for the Hawks... It's SG/SF.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[kurupt]

Both don't play well, but in todays NBA, if your Bigs play as soft as Al Horford on Pick&Rolls and cannot hit an open jumper, it just becomes so much harder for the point guards.

Horford rolls to the basketbet agressively in like every 10th game. The other 9 he just shoots mid range jumpers and if they don't fall, goodbye P&R. And without P&R, your offense is shit in todays NBA.

It is still a team game and the whole team has been struggling for a while now.

[AHF]

Our pgs can improve but they aren't a problem for a chip.  It is the superstar we lack.  

[Jody23]

4 hours ago, macdaddy said:

I understand your point but to me it speaks more to our total lack of offense on the wing.   When you depend on your PG for all your backcourt scoring then you're going to have problems in the playoffs.   Put someone with handles and the ability to get a shot and draw fouls on the wing and both Dennis and Teague are good options.

Putting a better wing scorer on the floor isn't going to stop teams from going under screens on Teague and Schröder.  Bud's offense runs alot of point guard pick and roll.  So having a point guard who can shoot is important.

[macdaddy]

Just now, Jody23 said:

Putting a better wing scorer on the floor isn't going to stop teams from going under screens on Teague and Schröder.  Bud's offense runs alot of point guard pick and roll.  So having a point guard who can shoot is important.

Agree with that but PG pnr is our main weapon simply because we have no wing scoring threats.    

[Jody23]

3 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Agree with that but PG pnr is our main weapon simply because we have no wing scoring threats.    

When we talk about "wing scoring threats", exactly what kind of player are we talking about?  Are we talking about the Nic Batum type guys who basically are spot up shooters or are we talking about a real shot creater and maker like a Jimmy Butler?  I ask because better spot up shooters won't make that big of a difference imo.  If we're talking about a guy who can create and make shots, then that's different.

[macdaddy]

8 minutes ago, Jody23 said:

When we talk about "wing scoring threats", exactly what kind of player are we talking about?  Are we talking about the Nic Batum type guys who basically are spot up shooters or are we talking about a real shot creater and maker like a Jimmy Butler?  I ask because better spot up shooters won't make that big of a difference imo.  If we're talking about a guy who can create and make shots, then that's different.

Exactly.   The last 3 years it's been a team full of spot up shooters.   When they knocked down shots like Korver and Demarre did last year then we look pretty good but when it falls back to more normal numbers then we struggle.   In the playoffs we have to have someone who can create their own shot, get to the hole, get to the line.   It's why Bud wanted Hardaway despite his very average shooting numbers.   That hasn't panned out but it was the right idea.  

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Jody23 said:

When we talk about "wing scoring threats", exactly what kind of player are we talking about?  Are we talking about the Nic Batum type guys who basically are spot up shooters or are we talking about a real shot creater and maker like a Jimmy Butler?  I ask because better spot up shooters won't make that big of a difference imo.  If we're talking about a guy who can create and make shots, then that's different.

Yes

Let me add:

We need a wing who can dribble the ball period. Ours suck big time.

Baze, the Lord knows he  tries but....

Korver can't, he's  afraid of the ball except carch n release.

Thabo - hawkward

THJr - ????

We have enough spot up shooters.

Having another competant ball handler eases the pressure on Jeff/Dennis from ALWAYS having to initiate the offense for themselves and everybody else.

[Jody23]

30 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Yes

Let me add:

We need a wing who can dribble the ball period. Ours suck big time.

Baze, the Lord knows he  tries but....

Korver can't, he's  afraid of the ball except carch n release.

Thabo - hawkward

THJr - ????

We have enough spot up shooters.

Having another competant ball handler eases the pressure on Jeff/Dennis from ALWAYS having to initiate the offense for themselves and everybody else.

Agreed.  But even with a guy whose a shot creator, you still need point guards who can make perimeter shots when defenses collapse.

[Peoriabird]

This thread helps me understand why there is so much hate directed at our point guards!  I guess in some people eyes, if your starting and backup point guards aren't Steph Curry then they can't help a team win.  I don't want to be insulting but your statement is absolutely asinine.  1st of all there is no history backing up the op's claim that you need a point guard who shoots better than 40% from the 3 point line to win championships.  And secondly, both Teague and Dennis have improved their 3 point shooting every year. 

Lastly, I need the OP to come up with a list of these great shooting point guards he is so high on for comparison!

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, Jody23 said:

Agreed.  But even with a guy whose a shot creator, you still need point guards who can make perimeter shots when defenses collapse.

All they'll  need to be is decent. 

What's league average  for PGs?

Where does Tesgue rsnk amongst starters,  where is Dennis amongst  backups.

[benhillboy]

Not saying they're "better" but I've enjoyed watching Walker and Lin more than our duo and appreciate what they bring to the table a little more.  Just raw numbers say we would've won 5.5 more games with Charlotte's backcourt instead of Jeff and Dennis.  A betting man would put the odds on the Hawks being up 3-1 right now.

Besides being the better pure-shooting pair by a considerable margin, Kemba's aggressiveness never has to be called into question like Jeff and Lin's size and decision-making is far superior to Dennis'.

I'm in total agreement with @Lurker.  Both of their jumpers have been and always will be broken.  It's hard to watch PG play like that at times, no matter how quick they are. Jeff shoots like a middle schooler and Dennis like an expecting mother.  Marcus Smart's shooting percentages are awful and I'd still want him taking a pressurized jumper over either of them any time.  No coincidence Stevens still allows him to shoot more threes than Jeff, who shoots a great percentage for a three-happy coach!

[Lurker]

3 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

1st of all there is no history backing up the op's claim that you need a point guard who shoots better than 40% from the 3 point line to win championships.

I'm not meaning good three point shooters, I'm meaning at least respected mid-range, and neither are. Sorry, they aren't.

[Peoriabird]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

I'm not meaning good three point shooters, I'm meaning at least respected mid-range, and neither are. Sorry, they aren't.

Where is the list?

[ATLien_]

14 hours ago, Jody23 said:

Putting a better wing scorer on the floor isn't going to stop teams from going under screens on Teague and Schröder.  Bud's offense runs alot of point guard pick and roll.  So having a point guard who can shoot is important.

Bingo! This  is also why Horford struggled in the last  two games. Celtics are doing a soft hedge on Teague and Schröder and staying connected to Al  to take away the roll and the pop play. It's usually Crowder shading Horford.  They can do this because our PG's either try to drive all the way to the basket or shoot  the three; they have no other variation and are anemic to the mid range shot. Soft hedge takes  away the driving lanes and they are daring  our PG's to take the three. 

If I was Bud I would start the pick above the 3 point line instead of just inside the 3 point line giving  the PG more space to drive around a bad defender in Thomas before the help gets there. We need to make the help defender have to scramble further. We need to find ways to create space so the Celtics can't pack the paint and have to move on defense. 

Thomas has  been able to do this for the Celtics which is why our  defense looks like a different team compared to game  1&2. We are out  of control scrambling around trying to stop his pick plays. In the first two games Thomas couldn't hit shots so we were able to do what the Celtics are doing to us now.

Edited April 26, 2016 by ATLien_

[Diesel]

14 hours ago, Jody23 said:

Putting a better wing scorer on the floor isn't going to stop teams from going under screens on Teague and Schröder.  Bud's offense runs alot of point guard pick and roll.  So having a point guard who can shoot is important.

Our PGs can shoot well enough, however, if you have a wing that's killing it from outside, it makes that PNR a lot more effective.  That's why we won 60 last season... Korver was killing it and DMC wasn't bad.  Teams couldn't just focus on the PNR as easily...  Horf played a little more tough too.  Horf maybe our greatest strength and greatest weakness all at the same time.   When he plays like a scared little girl, we are more reliant on the three.  Our three ball shooting hasn't really come around like that.

 

[Jody23]

3 hours ago, Diesel said:

Our PGs can shoot well enough, however, if you have a wing that's killing it from outside, it makes that PNR a lot more effective.  That's why we won 60 last season... Korver was killing it and DMC wasn't bad.  Teams couldn't just focus on the PNR as easily...  Horf played a little more tough too.  Horf maybe our greatest strength and greatest weakness all at the same time.   When he plays like a scared little girl, we are more reliant on the three.  Our three ball shooting hasn't really come around like that.

 

The Hawks' point guards don't shoot well enough.  As well as Korver and DMC shot in the regular season last year, in the playoffs, the Nets, Wizards and especially the Cavs forced the Hawks point guards to consistently make shots from the outside.  And when they couldn't, the offense struggled because it takes away driving lanes.

As an example, even though it was one regular season game, when the Hawks blew the Cavs out early last season, it was largely due to Shelvin Mack making seven threes which eventually forced Clevelands defense to expand, giving the Hawks opportunities to attack the basket.

[Lurker]

4 hours ago, Diesel said:

Our PGs can shoot well enough

Then the game plan to let both of them take as many J's as they want absolutely should not be working like it has. It's working.