Rudy Gay to Hawks in 4 team trade rumor????

[AHF]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

Everybody who's made it to the NBA "wants to".  I didn't explain my point well.  That's what I get for being a wise guy.

They don't all have the "want to" in the sense it is being used here.  They don't all want to succeed in the NBA enough to work on their faults, to play the game the right way, to put in the extra hours above and beyond just practice and games, to sacrifice off-the-court fun for on-the-court success, etc.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

They don't all have the "want to" in the sense it is being used here.  They don't all want to succeed in the NBA enough to work on their faults, to play the game the right way, to put in the extra hours above and beyond just practice and games, to sacrifice off-the-court fun for on-the-court success, etc.

Maybe not but (as I shift my moving target yet again) are you taking a bunch of hustle guy/gym rats over a couple of transcendent talents you may have to cajole a little?

[AHF]

2 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Maybe not but (as I shift my moving target yet again) are you taking a bunch of hustle guy/gym rats over a couple of transcendent talents you may have to cajole a little?

Want to is just one component of a player's profile.  No one area trumps everything else.

[Guest]

50 minutes ago, AHF said:

Want to is just one component of a player's profile.  No one area trumps everything else.

Cop out.

[AHF]

21 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Cop out.

It's true.  It is like toughness when we were talking about it.  Rudy might have the most "want to" of anyone in the NBA but if his talent isn't there that isn't enough to even sniff the league.  Josh Smith had all the gifts and the want to improve but his ego was so big he didn't want to be successful more than he wanted to be a 'star' as he envisioned it - which meant dominating games with his jumper.  Eddy Curry could have been a superstar beast but didn't have the "want to" needed to escape from a wet paper bag let alone fulfill his potential.  Jordan had the physical gifts but how much more so than Isiah Rider or Harold Miner, etc.?  Jordan's "want to" was so great it elevated him waaayyyy past a dozens of wing men with similarly amazing physical gifts who will never be what he was because they don't have his absolute and unrelenting "want to" win.  

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

It's true.  It is like toughness when we were talking about it.  Rudy might have the most "want to" of anyone in the NBA but if his talent isn't there that isn't enough to even sniff the league.  Josh Smith had all the gifts and the want to improve but his ego was so big he didn't want to be successful more than he wanted to be a 'star' as he envisioned it - which meant dominating games with his jumper.  Eddy Curry could have been a superstar beast but didn't have the "want to" needed to escape from a wet paper bag let alone fulfill his potential.  Jordan had the physical gifts but how much more so than Isiah Rider or Harold Miner, etc.?  Jordan's "want to" was so great it elevated him waaayyyy past a dozens of wing men with similarly amazing physical gifts who will never be what he was because they don't have his absolute and unrelenting "want to" win.  

Yeah, we don't disagree really.  I just don't push that "want to" thing too far.  We've had a "want to" team the last 9 years of making the playoffs but have never really been a contender because of the fact that the top-end talent has been lacking.

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

Deron Williams could have been Steph Curry or Chris Paul-great but couldn't stay away from the cheeseburgers and is/was notorious for leaving the  the gym early to go home and play 2k.  Desire to be great has to be higher than the desire to do whatever they please and make a paycheck.

[AHF]

24 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Yeah, we don't disagree really.  I just don't push that "want to" thing too far.  We've had a "want to" team the last 9 years of making the playoffs but have never really been a contender because of the fact that the top-end talent has been lacking.

You can't contend without top-end talent.  I agree you can't push it too far but you can't just ignore it either or we'd be counting double digit rings on Wilt's fingers at the end of his career instead of one in his prime and one after his prime when he finally committed to doing some dirty work.  (I.e., less 'dirty work' and more focus on his game earlier in his career should have seen him with more rings than Shaq or Duncan).

[pimp]

21 hours ago, deester11 said:

I'm just tripping cause KG has my avatar. In any case I would like Gay but feel it's a pipe dream. 

I don't know what your old avatar was, but i approve of the current one. 

[Guest]

21 hours ago, deester11 said:

I'm just tripping cause KG has my avatar. In any case I would like Gay but feel it's a pipe dream. 

It's my avatar now, A-Bro-ham Lincoln. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Do most of you trust Bud in his development and use of players?  If you do, why don't you believe he could maximize the abilities of a good offensive conplimentary player like Rudy Gay?

At the very least, you're talking about a guy who would be a tremendous 6th man off the bench to provide scoring for the 2nd unit.  Right now though, he'd be the best wing player on the team.

Despite the addition of Dwight and the rookies, the Hawks still don't have a guy who can offensively close out a game or consistently create AND make a shot.

Rudy can do both.

Let's understand one thing about this team.  Our "window of opportunity" to even remotely be a championship level team, is 3 years ... unless Dennis or one of the rookies rapidly develop into All-Star level talents.

Because in the 19 - 20 season, both Millsap and Howard will be 34 yrs old ... and need new contracts.   They still may be be good big men, but more than likely not All-Star level talents.

Honestly, if the opportunity arose to trade scrubs for an established player like Gay, you do that in a heartbeat.

Edited August 9, 2016 by TheNorthCydeRises

[Germantor]

1 hour ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Do most of you trust Bud in his development and use of players?  If you do, why don't you believe he could maximize the abilities of a good offensive conplimentary player like Rudy Gay?

At the very least, you're talking about a guy who would be a tremendous 6th man off the bench to provide scoring for the 2nd unit.  Right now though, he'd be the best wing player on the team.

Despite the addition of Dwight and the rookies, the Hawks still don't have a guy who can offensively close out a game or consistently create AND make a shot.

Rudy can do both.

Let's understand one thing about this team.  Our "window of opportunity" to even remotely be a championship level team, is 3 years ... unless Dennis or one of the rookies rapidly develop into All-Star level talents.

Because in the 19 - 20 season, both Millsap and Howard will be 34 yrs old ... and need new contracts.   They still may be be good big men, but more than likely not All-Star level talents.

Honestly, if the opportunity arose to trade scrubs for an established player like Gay, you do that in a heartbeat.

I concur 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Do most of you trust Bud in his development and use of players?  If you do, why don't you believe he could maximize the abilities of a good offensive conplimentary player like Rudy Gay?

At the very least, you're talking about a guy who would be a tremendous 6th man off the bench to provide scoring for the 2nd unit.  Right now though, he'd be the best wing player on the team.

Despite the addition of Dwight and the rookies, the Hawks still don't have a guy who can offensively close out a game or consistently create AND make a shot.

Rudy can do both.

Let's understand one thing about this team.  Our "window of opportunity" to even remotely be a championship level team, is 3 years ... unless Dennis or one of the rookies rapidly develop into All-Star level talents.

Because in the 19 - 20 season, both Millsap and Howard will be 34 yrs old ... and need new contracts.   They still may be be good big men, but more than likely not All-Star level talents.

Honestly, if the opportunity arose to trade scrubs for an established player like Gay, you do that in a heartbeat.

It's the cost to get him - who and/or what of value are you proposing trading him for considering he's making $13 mil and has a player option for next season.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

It's the cost to get him - who and/or what of value are you proposing trading him for considering he's making $13 mil and has a player option for next season.

In my opinion, the only untouchables on this team are Dwight, Millsap, Dennis, Baze, Prince, and Bembry.

Everyone else is expendable.

Splitter, because of his salary, has to be involved in any move.

So it's Splitter + ( 1 or 2 Hawks )

Salary cap goes up again next year as well.  Possibly up to 102 million - 105 million.

 

Edited August 9, 2016 by TheNorthCydeRises

[Guest]

2 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

In my opinion, the only untouchables on this team are Dwight, Millsap, Dennis, Baze, Prince, and Bembry.

Everyone else is expendable.

Splitter, because of his salary, has to be involved in any move.

So it's Splitter + ( 1 or 2 Hawks )

Salary cap goes up again next year as well.  Possibly up to 102 million - 105 million.

 

I'd have to add Korver just because of what he brings to the table. The way he spreads the floor is almost invaluable. Also his leadership and what he can teach to the youngsters as well as his awesome salary. I just doubt we could get anywhere close to that back if we traded Kyle.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

51 minutes ago, Spud2Nique said:

I'd have to add Korver just because of what he brings to the table. The way he spreads the floor is almost invaluable. Also his leadership and what he can teach to the youngsters as well as his awesome salary. I just doubt we could get anywhere close to that back if we traded Kyle.

If that were the case, we'd be more successful in the playoffs.  Kyle's impact on the team is overrated, especially against top level teams.

Kyle is impactful when he's making shots.  When he's 1 - 5 FG while playing 30 minutes, that's not having an impact.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

If that were the case, we'd be more successful in the playoffs.  Kyle's impact on the team is overrated, especially against top level teams.

Kyle is impactful when he's making shots.  When he's 1 - 5 FG while playing 30 minutes, that's not having an impact.

Lol, oh he's having an impact all right.  Some would say he was the MVP of our Cavs' series ... their MVP (ohhh).

  "F*ck you, kg.  I was the Cavs' MVP the las' 2 years."

Touche, mutha-f*kr.  Touche.

 "The h3ll I don't have an impact, kg!  I've been hearing that crap ever since I was in Chicago.  I'm out there busting my buns every night!  Tell NorthCyde to drag LeBorn 'n them up and down the court for 48 minutes!"

[benhillboy]

Does Gay do anything great?  Contested jumpers off the dribble maybe?  One of the more underachieving players of his era.  He has the size and skill profile of Paul George.  He ain't no effin Paul George to put it mildly.

Edited August 9, 2016 by benhillboy

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

If that were the case, we'd be more successful in the playoffs.  Kyle's impact on the team is overrated, especially against top level teams.

Kyle is impactful when he's making shots.  When he's 1 - 5 FG while playing 30 minutes, that's not having an impact.

I dunno about that. I think you are neglecting the fact that he came off a significant injury. Remember how good he was the year before? He was an all star. I have a hunch this season will be more like 2 years ago. Also, name a trade that would make sense involving Kyle, it's impossible. Lol.  A trade where the salaries and talent match. It's like saying a word that rythmes with orange.

[AHF]

Let's also keep in mind that basketball is a team game.  Korver did have an impact on the game - he got the Cavs to overcommit to paying defensive attention to him.  His defender was pretty much utterly incapable of helping because he was crammed up Korver's ummm posterior.  Why didn't they defend the whole team like that?  Because it creates liabilities in team defense.  The problem we had was that no one other than Dennis was able to exploit the impact of his defensive assignment.  Korver can't do it on his own.  At all.  That is what the playoffs made clear.  What the rest of the team was unable to do was essentially exploit a 4 on 4 situation - which should be an advantage for the offense but wasn't because of how timid most of our guys played and how physically dominated they were by their counterparts.

I'll totally agree that I wanted to see Korver benched a lot more than series because of his lack of impact but one element of that is that his teammates couldn't exploit the adjustments the Cavs made to religiously blanketing Korver.  When you can't exploit that, it loses value but that is on his teammates as much as on Korver.