Time to go in a different direction

[benhillboy]

46 minutes ago, Lurker said:

I'm meaning eat some of the money on Bazemore's contract. He is untradeable if you don't...well maybe not. Maybe call Indiana and ask for a swap of bad contracts of Bazemore and Eillis.

Yup.  Moving Baze should be priority # 1.  But I fear our GM group ain't shrewd enough to do so.  We need one of them Sam Presti Fleece Specials where you get a Taj Gibson for D-League Cameron Payne lol.

[Lurker]

10 minutes ago, benhillboy said:

Yup.  Moving Baze should be priority # 1.  But I fear our GM group ain't shrewd enough to do so.  We need one of them Sam Presti Fleece Specials where you get a Taj Gibson for D-League Cameron Payne lol.

hah good luck, the best choice would be kill two birds with one stone with a bad contract swap straight up of Bazemore and Ellis. Ellis may be able to be a decent backup PG.

the main thing that I'm really getting at is versatility needs to be gained along with shooting, and no, Tristan is a poor comp to this team because A: He's a willing hard roller on PNR and B: The Cavs are a superstar team. If you want to have a traditional center, fine, if they're poor on the perimeter, fine. If they don't want to roll hard on the PNR, not fine.

[macdaddy]

17 hours ago, Lurker said:

I'm meaning eat some of the money on Bazemore's contract. He is untradeable if you don't...well maybe not. Maybe call Indiana and ask for a swap of bad contracts of Bazemore and Eillis.

I would be totally on board with trading baze for ellis.   Our total lack of offensive ability needs to be addressed.    So I get trading our bad contract for another, but there isn't a way to eat money on an NBA contract.   It's not like baseball where you can partially pay a guys salary when he's on another team.     I guess we could buyout but he'd have to agree to that.  

[Guest]

2 hours ago, macdaddy said:

I would be totally on board with trading baze for ellis.   Our total lack of offensive ability needs to be addressed.    So I get trading our bad contract for another, but there isn't a way to eat money on an NBA contract.   It's not like baseball where you can partially pay a guys salary when he's on another team.     I guess we could buyout but he'd have to agree to that.  

@macdaddy  He can be waived and the stretch provision used on his contract (similar to what Pistons did with Josh Smith). The balance of his contract can be spread out over twice times the number of years left on his contract plus 1 year.  The option year would have to be included.  So he has 3 years at $54 million left.  

So using the stretch provision $54 million divided by (3 years x 2) + 1 year = $7 million counting against the cap for the next 7 years.

[macdaddy]

42 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

@macdaddy  He can be waived and the stretch provision used on his contract (similar to what Pistons did with Josh Smith). The balance of his contract can be spread out over twice times the number of years left on his contract plus 1 year.  The option year would have to be included.  So he has 3 years at $54 million left.  

So using the stretch provision $54 million divided by (3 years x 2) + 1 year = $7 million counting against the cap for the next 7 years.

That seems extremely unrealistic in Baze's case.   But i guess you never know. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

That seems extremely unrealistic in Baze's case.   But i guess you never know. 

It is unrealistic. Just giving you what other options are available to reduce Baze's cap number if he cannot be traded. 

The new CBA doesn't have an Amnesty Provision.  Being bought out is also not an option with 3 years left.

[macdaddy]

12 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

It is unrealistic. Just giving you what other options are available to reduce Baze's cap number if he cannot be traded. 

The new CBA doesn't have an Amnesty Provision.  Being bought out is also not an option with 3 years left.

I do think he's tradeable but the truth is I don't see Bud parting with him.   I think he'll be a good player again if we can ever get the offense functioning.   

[hazer]

Hawks are only 3 games from the lottery. Go for it!

[JTB]

23 minutes ago, hazer said:

Hawks are only 3 games from the lottery. Go for it!

lol watch us beat the Wizards tonight 

[ISOJOE]

Do you think that D8 has the value of a late lotto pick if he has very good POs (he usually stepped up in the POs). If we just get a ~20 pick out of him, we should use the minny and cavs pick to trade up. Something like Dennis-THjr-Prince-Rabb-Hartenstein or Dennis-THjr-Prince-Hartenstein-Adebayo would be fun to watch (not immediately but long-term). I think this year's draft is a very good opportunity to complete our potential retool.

Edited March 22, 2017 by ISOJOE

[Lurker]

16 minutes ago, ISOJOE said:

Do you think that D8 has the value of a late lotto pick if he has very good POs (he usually stepped up in the POs). If we just get a ~20 pick out of him, we should use the minny and cavs pick to trade up. Something like Dennis-THjr-Prince-Rabb-Hartenstein or Dennis-THjr-Prince-Hartenstein-Adebayo would be fun to watch (not immediately but long-term). I think this year's draft is a very good opportunity to complete our potential retool.

Nice idea, who knows if it'd work though, I think my mind is starting to compile a real idea of what to do for the summer and 2018 although some won't like it. If you move Howard or ask him to come off the bench, you might be able to rehab Bazemore's value. 

There will be more to my story though.

[BrazilianHawk]

4 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

@macdaddy  He can be waived and the stretch provision used on his contract (similar to what Pistons did with Josh Smith). The balance of his contract can be spread out over twice times the number of years left on his contract plus 1 year.  The option year would have to be included.  So he has 3 years at $54 million left.  

So using the stretch provision $54 million divided by (3 years x 2) + 1 year = $7 million counting against the cap for the next 7 years.

Where do I sign?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, hazer said:

Hawks are only 3 games from the lottery. Go for it!

Wait...what are we doing? I want the 6th seed but let the chips fall where they may. Only thing is making the playoffs with a 16th pick sounds bettter than no playoffs with the 14th pick. I understand it's the lottery but the 12-14 teams almost never move up into the top 3. 

 

Whatever though we have flaws and big ones so lets just ride this weird a$$ season out.

 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Lurker said:

There will be more to my story though.

Sadly ...

[BrazilianHawk]

22 minutes ago, Spud2Nique said:

Wait...what are we doing? I want the 6th seed but let the chips fall where they may. Only thing is making the playoffs with a 16th pick sounds bettter than no playoffs with the 14th pick. I understand it's the lottery but the 12-14 teams almost never move up into the top 3. 

 

Whatever though we have flaws and big ones so lets just ride this weird a$$ season out.

 

People act like "oooooooh it's the lottery!". Millsap was a second rounder. Same for Jokic. Kawhi, #15. Gobert, #27. Look, Nurkic was drafted after Payne, I'm sure we could use him. I could go on and on. So many really good players, not in the lottery. The lottery is full of busts. The draft is a crap shoot, and I won't hold my breath for it.

Anyway. I, for one, don't gamble, so I have no desire to be in the lottery, as if Hawks would win something by gutting the team. See, the best Hawks pick in the last 15 years was the green b!tch. We had #2, #3, #5, #6, #11 and so on... Hawks won nothing but the Laughing Stock label. What makes people think it'll be different this time?

The Hawks play in the offseason for how many years in a row now? A lot of them, and I truly enjoy it. It's FAR BETTER than watching sh!tty-ball for a decade like those seasons before Joe and the drafting of the traitor. We are not the Sixers or the Kings. I want to be respected.

I want the Hawks in the playoffs every single year. Life's short, folks. Don't waste it.

 

GO HAWKS!

[Bankingitbig]

1 hour ago, ISOJOE said:

Do you think that D8 has the value of a late lotto pick if he has very good POs (he usually stepped up in the POs). If we just get a ~20 pick out of him, we should use the minny and cavs pick to trade up. Something like Dennis-THjr-Prince-Rabb-Hartenstein or Dennis-THjr-Prince-Hartenstein-Adebayo would be fun to watch (not immediately but long-term). I think this year's draft is a very good opportunity to complete our potential retool.

I don't think Howard has that much value, especially in the offseason. He would probably have more value around the trade deadline for a potential contender that is missing a solid center/rebounder or maybe their center gets injured or something. If you seriously look at every team - there aren't many that would want Howard. Maybe the Bucks if Monroe doesn't take his player option? But would you seriously want Howard at his ~$23.5M. There is no one else. Center is a relatively stacked position.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Spud2Nique said:

Sadly ...

[Lurker]

It's not time to fully start over, but it is time to get back to the drawing board. What was done last summer went completely away from the norm for the team. Bud needs to be stripped of his presidential duties and an actual GM outside of Wilcox the puppet should be hired and better assistants are needed.

Dwight Howard went so far away from the norm, it makes you wonder if it was pushed by someone else other than the GM/president.

Here are two things that need to happen:

1. A philosophy change in the draft. I think the draft picks will be fine, but there is no chance that they'll be legitimate star talent. There needs to be more chances taken on young talent in the draft. If this isn't done, I already know who the Hawks are taking with their pick (Josh Hart). No offense to him, but he has a ceiling. Look more to the Patton's/Hartenstein's/Collins' (both)/Rabb's/Ferguson's/(and more) of the world.
2. Doing a better job of mixing the tools players with the skills players. This team does not do a good job of it.

And please, please, get an actual backup PG. Doesn't matter who. Most backup points aren't good but Delaney is well below average.

[Thomas]

15 hours ago, BrazilianHawk said:

We are not the Sixers or the Kings. I want to be respected.

Well said. Hoping to just stay in any game at all and keep from losing by more than ten points during the season was not much fun. So bad just about the only satisfaction back then was watching Josh slam one home with force. 

[macdaddy]

16 hours ago, BrazilianHawk said:

People act like "oooooooh it's the lottery!". Millsap was a second rounder. Same for Jokic. Kawhi, #15. Gobert, #27. Look, Nurkic was drafted after Payne, I'm sure we could use him. I could go on and on. So many really good players, not in the lottery. The lottery is full of busts. The draft is a crap shoot, and I won't hold my breath for it.

Anyway. I, for one, don't gamble, so I have no desire to be in the lottery, as if Hawks would win something by gutting the team. See, the best Hawks pick in the last 15 years was the green b!tch. We had #2, #3, #5, #6, #11 and so on... Hawks won nothing but the Laughing Stock label. What makes people think it'll be different this time?

The Hawks play in the offseason for how many years in a row now? A lot of them, and I truly enjoy it. It's FAR BETTER than watching sh!tty-ball for a decade like those seasons before Joe and the drafting of the traitor. We are not the Sixers or the Kings. I want to be respected.

I want the Hawks in the playoffs every single year. Life's short, folks. Don't waste it.

 

GO HAWKS!

I agree with some of your points but the bigger picture is that most of the league's gm act like 'ooooh it's the lottery'.   They make trades to move up 2 picks.   So there is a huge difference between picking 17th and 12th.

So a 1st round lottery pick this year is extremely valuable to make trades with.   We may have no hope of finding Kawhi ourselves but if we can trade our 1st for an already established player then i'm all for it.