The Mega Super Rumor Thread (Part 2)

[RandomFan]

1 minute ago, ShooterSays said:

Shams retweeted this ^^^

I bet he probably goes to Philly, but would be great to bring his toughness to ATL.

He's a perfect fit on this roster at the 4, considering all factors but primarily the cost. He provides the skills needed at that spot without overpaying for the skills that aren't required, or even being taken advantage of, unlike JC. 

[AHF]

18 hours ago, JeffS17 said:

Not sure I want Ayton right now.  CC is integral to our offense and swapping for Ayton would be too much noise at once imo... 

First, let me say that I don't think CC is remotely integral to our offense.  The PnR is integral but Trae can run that very effectively with JC and only doesn't because of CC's offensive limitations.  Moreover, I think Ayton would be more effective as a PnR partner for Trae.  CC is notable for his low conversion rate at the rim.  They are still very high% shots so even a subpar conversion rate is still good offense overall but I think it is an obvious  offensive upgrade if we made that trade.

Second, the real loss with giving up CC is to our defense.  He is integral to our D and Ayton would not fully replace that or be an upgrade as he would on offense.  That is where the performance risk really lies for me in an Ayton/CC trade scenario.

[Mikey]

2 hours ago, NBASupes said:

My guy refuses to tell me but I've read Vegas and Seattle 

Bill simmons has been saying this for over a year now. Pretty sure these two are locked in and Lebron will be in the owernship group for the vegas team

[Final_quest]

12 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

They SHOULD be in Finals or Bust mode.  Thats the bar.  Why must they be in a continous rebuild mode?  A analogy is Mark Richt at Georgia.  He always won 10 games or more but couldn't win the National Championship.  Kirby Smart was brought in for one reason and one reason only: To get Georgia past Alabama and win a National Championship.  I'm not saying that if the Hawks don't win a championship in the next two years that they should bust it up. I'm saying that the mindset should be Finals or Bust.  When Lebron would stack those Miami, Cleveland and Laker teams, the mentality was Finals or Bust.  The mindset wasn't lets go through this long drawn out rebuild.  Schlenk might not be saying it out loud but I know that he and Ressler are of the same mindset.  They want a chip and waiting 3, 4 years is out of the question.

That's not what I mean.  There are more options apart from rebuilding and Finals or Bust.  To me a two year period of Finals or Bust means that you are mortgaging your entire future to win the title and rebuild afterwards.  We have only given up two first round picks.  If you get another one by trading Collins you are almost back to par.  

I would characterize our position as building a legit contender playing for a championship.  We are still not even battle tested.  We have lots of young players developing.  We are capped out for the moment, but if you move some players we will be in a better position in the next several years.   I'd say we are positioning ourselves to be long term contenders and still able to make a lot of tweaks and adjustments in the coming years.   

Finals or bust would mean our window to win is short, but I think we are in a more long term position.  

[theheroatl]

I hope the PJ news isn't just making a market for him but he seriously will hear the FO out. He would be a GREAT pickup.

[Hawkmoor]

2 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Bill simmons has been saying this for over a year now. Pretty sure these two are locked in and Lebron will be in the owernship group for the vegas team

And then Lebron will be the first PLAYER/OWNER and folks have to listen to the talking heads brag about him being the goat of owners the next 30 years.

[NBASupes]

The Gallinari contract change gives us a lot of flexibility that we didn't have before that deal

[AHF]

3 hours ago, bleachkit said:

Murray last year had 9.2 assists to 2.6 turnovers. That's as good as it gets. He should absolutely at the very least be given the chance to run the starting unit. Let Trae sulk. It's about winning

We should make that adjustment if it will result in a better offense but my default position is that this is unlikely to be the case.  First, both Trae and Murray have run the offense on some bad and mediocre teams but the overall offensive rating for those teams has been better for Trae.  By way of example, this year Atlanta was a 43 win team (which isn't great) and SA was a 34 win team (which also isn't great).  Neither team was great or terrible but Atlanta's offense was ranked #2 in ORTG while SA's was ranked #18.

That was a consistent trend the season before that 2021 ATL #8, SA #21.  Prior to that season, ATL's offense had the split of basically being elite when Trae was on the floor and near all-time worst when he wasn't.  (I haven't looked into whether SA's had similar splits with Murray running the show or not.)

In short, I think Trae has shown himself to be the engine of an elite offense in the absence of elite non-Trae weapons (unlike GS with elite options in Curry, Thompson, and Durant for example) and Murray has not (and I'd consider SA's 2021 lineup of DeRozan, Murray, White, Aldridge, DJ, Gay to be a similar pool of supporting talent to what Trae has had in Atlanta's best seasons).

 

What I am interested in seeing is if we can situationally have Murray run the offense with Trae on the floor and start doing things to spring Trae free for great looks and building from there to evaluate whether we can be better with that as a base offense.  But I would start with that as a minority/situational lineup as opposed to trying to force a wholesale change from Trae being the conductor when on the floor.  (I will also just note that Trae has been pretty terrible in terms of off ball movement career to date and that is a developmental opportunity for growth for him.)

[DS5]

21 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

Shams retweeted this ^^^

I bet he probably goes to Philly, but would be great to bring his toughness to ATL.

S&T for JC? Otherwise there is nobody (available) in the Heast roster that interests me

[terrell]

Hawks pursuing PJ Tucker in FA? We could use his toughness..

Edited June 30, 2022 by terrell

[JayBirdHawk]

@thecampster @Sothron @NBASupes

The biggest question I have is "Are the owners willing to go into the tax this year or not?"

[marco102]

 

[akay]

4 hours ago, sturt said:

You've went all-in with the Murray acquisition.

His contract is two years.

You almost certainly have to be in "NBA Finals Or Bust" mode for the next two years.

It's hard to understand any logic in making obtaining FRPs any priority whatsoever.

Whatever else you trade, it's got to be vet talent for vet talent, and at that, you're really only looking to reallocate your resources... a stronger set of assets in the roster in exchange for addressing a weaker set of assets on the roster.

I can't say they'll follow that logic... every season it seems Schlenk ends up doing some head scratcher. Ordinarily, though, that's involved the finishing touches on the roster... not a primary piece. I'm cringing as I await the very real possibility we're going to have another head scratcher but this time for a more significant roster piece.

 

Almost any Collins trade will be a head scratcher. Almost without question, you'd end up with a lesser talent at PF, and potentially neutralizing the overall gain you just made by acquiring Murray. *sigh*

What production from Collins do you expect we'll miss? 

We'll definitely miss his shooting, but spending $25 mil on a stretch 4 when they don't get used all that well doesn't really make a lot of sense.

Whatever we do to replace John, I'm not really worried about the team falling off much from losing him.

He's a great complimentary piece, and perhaps if we had a bigger and stronger defensive 5, John could be a core piece, but he's shown that he's not necessary for us to win games.

JC the person is wonderful and I never want him to leave, JC the player is good, but has to be on a team where his strengths are amplified, and it's not really fair to him to keep making him play some limbo role where he doesn't have things called for him.

My point being, I think we are fine if we trade him, fine if we don't. We get some more flexibility that Travis and Landry can use to fill out the roster, or we can run it back hoping for good health + Murray.

My only concern with running it back is how unhealthy this team is, and trying to hope we can avoid the random tweaks and wear and tear of the season is unrealistic 

[BangHolman]

1 hour ago, hawkman said:

Not sure about Vegas but Seattle should get their team back. 

Vegas makes sense; every league wants a piece of Vegas right now. They have an arena they can share with the NHL team too.

[bird_dirt]

4 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

I was gonna let you slide.  Its VERY interesting that you been on this @JayBirdHawk defense party, trying to throw me under the bus using that poster, and bragging about her saying the Hawks should draft Murray before I said it ( why you so concerned?)  I went back to that thread where I suggested the Hawks draft Dejounte Murray and @JayBirdHawk spent that whole thread clowning me about the deal, especially the Kyrie part.  Not ONCE did she mention anything about Murray.  If she "got her man", she never ONCE mentioned Murray in that thread. At least say the Murray part was good for the Hawks, but nothing, na da.

Jaybird and @Spud2nique spent that entire thread clowning me.  THATS why I patted myself on the back for mentioning at LEAST the trade for Murray part because I was making a point.   Then YOU, a ADMITTED LURKER BY YOUR OWN WORDS, sits back and try and destroy my character.  I'm the guy that KNOWS that most of my posts are not popular, especially when it comes to Trae Young.  I KNOW I'm gonna be clowned but it takes a MAN to stand his ground and say what he feels when he knows its not gonna be popular. YOU on the other hand, a ADMITTED HIDING IN THE BUSH LURKER, who is NOT gonna go against the grain but instead be a follower, gonna try and come out and attempt to destroy my character.  See, a lurker is DIAMETRICALLY OPPOSED to being a man.  Thats your REAL PROBLEM WITH ME.  Now, you take this truth and go back into the bushes.

Dear @Hawkmoor,

I don’t agree with anything you say here. However, I will admit that my post had extra snark tossed in that wasn’t necessary. 

So, I would like to publicly apologize in front of everyone on the Squawk for hurting your feelings. 

I’m sorry. 
Please feel free to DM me if there is anything else you would like to discuss further so our conversation doesn’t take up any more space on this thread. 
 

[terrell]

2 minutes ago, marco102 said:

 

Is this guy legit?

[ShooterSays]

3 minutes ago, marco102 said:

 

I want it to be true, but I don’t trust the source. 

[marco102]

Just now, ShooterSays said:

I want it to be true, but I don’t trust the source. 

Chris is a legit media person though.  I just don't know if he has sources. 

[akay]

3 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

Agreed, the point is neither are a great fit together. Murray not great off the ball because his shooting. Trae just doesn't like playing off the ball and plus it would diminish his impact on offense.

Trae played off ball with Mpj on his Aau team, and Ray has been saying Trae wants to play more offball.

Don't think this is an issue 

[Hawkmoor]

4 minutes ago, bird_dirt said:

Dear @Hawkmoor,

I don’t agree with anything you say here. However, I will admit that my post had extra snark tossed in that wasn’t necessary. 

So, I would like to publicly apologize in front of everyone on the Squawk for hurting your feelings. 

I’m sorry. 
Please feel free to DM me if there is anything else you would like to discuss further so our conversation doesn’t take up any more space on this thread. 
 

Apology accepted.  No need to further the conversation.  Lets keep it about basketball. Go Hawks!!!

Edited June 30, 2022 by Hawkmoor