The Official NBASupes, Sothron, and theCampster Insider Thread - NBA 2022-23 Season

[TheNorthCydeRises]

On 5/22/2023 at 11:48 AM, REHawksFan said:

I'd love to have JB on the Hawks, but I'm not paying market value for him.  Not with all the other issues the Hawks have.  The ONLY way this would get done is if Boston had no choice but to trade him for less value or let him walk for nothing.  

You can't gut the team just to get JB.  He's not Giannis, Joker, LBJ in his prime.  Those are guys you give up whatever the opposing team wants.  But I'm not trading AJ, JJ, OO, and DJM plus picks for JB.  

 

We were a .500 team though.

[Diesel]

6 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

Nobody wants AD OR Lebron

Nobody wants to trade Trae either.. but you keep suggesting it. 

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

6 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

Hachimura and Reeves currently have cap holds which may or may not effect this trade as far as Boston wanting to possible add a 4th team to the mix in a sign and trade.  Beasley is under a team option.  This is the deal:

Atlanta trades Trae Young to the Lakers for Hachimura, Beasley, Reaves and the Lakers 1st round pick at 17 in this draft.  

Atlanta trades Hachimura, Beasley, Reaves and either their 1st round pick at 15 or the Lakers 1st round pick at 17 for Jalen Brown.  The cap numbers work for all three teams.  The Lakers are dealing from zero leverage as far as assets.  This is the best trade possible for the 3 teams involved.  Every one of these trades is about shaking up the status quo, which all three teams may be wanting to do this off season.  

This is a very preliminary look at this three team trade.  Boston and Atlanta might have options in this trade to substitute for instance, Beasley for Collins IF the numbers work with Collins. I like the deal straight up as is because the Hawks would be essentially trading Young for Brown and can reaccess the roster after that trade is done.

 

 

 

Looks like the Trade Machine values Trae more than you do.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

6 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

The three teams involved shaking it up and the Hawks get a bigger defender to pair with Murray in the backcourt. Murray slides to point guard and you change the offense to more of a motion offense and get away from the isolation sets in the backcourt. I got ahead of myself, this trade is mainly about shaking it up which the three teams involved most likely want to do this off season.

 

As much as you hate isolation basketball, the 4 teams that made the conference finals all had great ISO players in their offense, with ball movement able to get role players wide open shots.

Even this Boston - Miami game tonight, the game turned when Brown and Tatum started to make shots going ISO, which opened things up for the role players when the ball moved.

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

3 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

I didn't realize it until Skip Bayless brought it up:  Trae Young ranked 131st in the league in 3 point shooting percentage this past season.  I looked it up and saw that he also was 30th in 3 point attempts.  Thats a lot of clankers.  Combine that with leading the league in turnovers and folks wonder why the Hawks ownership told the front office that anybody can be traded from this current Hawks team?

 

Well why does everyone supposedly want a PG who can't shoot and turns the ball over?

[TheNorthCydeRises]

1 hour ago, Diesel said:

If the deal were say DJ/OO for JB...

 

Trae, JB, DH, JC, and CC...

is a group that I believe would be very competitive in the East.  With AG, JJ off the bench.. we're not that bad. 

We'd need a really good BU C..

 

 

Say no more . . .

It's supposed to be his spot anyway.

 

[Spud2nique]

4 hours ago, kg01 said:

Is Kyrie talkin' again? 

Kymeeeee is trying to flip Trae to the Lake show. That’s just what I need, a couple of my Laker friends trolling me for life. 

[AHF]

11 hours ago, Hawkmoor said:

I didn't realize it until Skip Bayless brought it up:  Trae Young ranked 131st in the league in 3 point shooting percentage this past season.  I looked it up and saw that he also was 30th in 3 point attempts.  Thats a lot of clankers.  Combine that with leading the league in turnovers and folks wonder why the Hawks ownership told the front office that anybody can be traded from this current Hawks team?

Did you just realize that Trae was the leading shot taker for Atlanta this season or just realize that he struggled with his shot this season?  As usual, Skip’s points have been covered in all kinds of detail already on this site with Trae having had a dismal first few months of the year and having had a better but still (for him) subpar second half of the year.  This was his career worst season shooting the ball other than his rookie year.

[macdaddy]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

Did you just realize that Trae was the leading shot taker for Atlanta this season or just realize that he struggled with his shot this season?  As usual, Skip’s points have been covered in all kinds of detail already on this site with Trae having had a dismal first few months of the year and having had a better but still (for him) subpar second half of the year.  This was his career worst season shooting the ball other than his rookie year.

And rankings aren't that meaningful.  What's the % difference between the 131st ranked shooter and the 80th?  I'm guessing about 1%

[AHF]

1 hour ago, macdaddy said:

And rankings aren't that meaningful.  What's the % difference between the 131st ranked shooter and the 80th?  I'm guessing about 1%

 The difference is actually pretty big.  
 

#87 is kind of where you hit the good 3pt% mark of 37% (80 is 37.2%)

So you are talking a roughly 3.7% gap between 130/131 at 33.5% and 79/80 at 37.2%
 

The reason for this is that only 1 out of 4 NBA players is on this list since it is limited to those with sufficient volume to qualify for league leaders by %.  (That list goes from Paolo Banchero at 29.8% to Luke Kennard at 49.4%).  So the differences are much bigger than if you include all NBA players.  On the “all player” list it is much closer to what you were thinking where moving up 50 spots from Trae is a less than 2% gap.

[Spud2nique]

Something is off about our roster. As I look at it, there’s no way we can come back without 2-4 players swapped out for others. We need vets. The thing is though I look at the depth chart and love the young talent in OO AJ and JJ, but they need to grow up super fast with the Trae timeline. I mean, I guess it’s not a timeline to worry about as far as age but as far as winning, we gotta start winning 50+ games starting next season. Full summer under Quin and get vets in here!

 

GO HAWKS!!!

[Diesel]

9 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Something is off about our roster. As I look at it, there’s no way we can come back without 2-4 players swapped out for others. We need vets. The thing is though I look at the depth chart and love the young talent in OO AJ and JJ, but they need to grow up super fast with the Trae timeline. I mean, I guess it’s not a timeline to worry about as far as age but as far as winning, we gotta start winning 50+ games starting next season. Full summer under Quin and get vets in here!

 

GO HAWKS!!!

Coaching and shooting are very big factors.   You say that there's something off about our roster...  How does our roster stack up with Miami?

After Jimmy and Bam, what exactly do they have?

When you have figured out what else they have, compare it to what we have. 

"but, but, but..."

Miami has beaten Milwaukee and NY and they have Boston down 3-1.   I can't say that they have many better players than we do.. in fact, I won't.   But they are in the ECFs.... have beaten good teams... and I believe it comes down to the little talent they have PLUS... Great coaching and good shooters. 

We got to the ECF with something similar. 

I don't think we're that flawed or that we need some great superstar.  We have a good coach.  We need to improve our shooting.   AJ, Bey, and Bogi are killers from outside.  Our coaching has to buy into that. 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

7 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Coaching and shooting are very big factors.   You say that there's something off about our roster...  How does our roster stack up with Miami?

After Jimmy and Bam, what exactly do they have?

When you have figured out what else they have, compare it to what we have. 

"but, but, but..."

Miami has beaten Milwaukee and NY and they have Boston down 3-1.   I can't say that they have many better players than we do.. in fact, I won't.   But they are in the ECFs.... have beaten good teams... and I believe it comes down to the little talent they have PLUS... Great coaching and good shooters. 

We got to the ECF with something similar. 

I don't think we're that flawed or that we need some great superstar.  We have a good coach.  We need to improve our shooting.   AJ, Bey, and Bogi are killers from outside.  Our coaching has to buy into that. 

 

Miami has guys that 1. Know their role 2. Accept their role and 3. Play their role.

For the Hawks:
1. Sometimes it's about having a better approach to developing the players on the current roster, so COACHING.....in 4 years when we owe the last of our picks to SAS in 2027 - we still have so many of our current roster still under 30, ..... just the bench guys in Bey, OO, JJ, AJ will be 27, 26, 25 and 24 years old respectively.
2. Sometimes it's about finding a diamond in the rough in the 2nd round or an undrafted guy and finding a role for them to excel in.
3. Make real use if the GL to develop guys

[Diesel]

Just now, JayBirdHawk said:

Miami has guys that 1. Know their role 2. Accept their role and 3. Play their role.

That's coaching. 

I was explaining just that to a friend of mine.   Miami has on Blinders and they focus on one thing.   Every situation, they know what they are supposed to do.  

That's why I'm eager to see us under Snyder with a full camp and his coaches and schemes. 

All of us here talk about the Hawks in Nate terms.   We talk about what our players do with Nate...  But I think everything will be different. 

 

[sturt]

2 hours ago, Diesel said:

After Jimmy

Based on Koonin's comments, this is the crux of his concern... a championship team needs a Jimmy.

Now, who shares his concern?

Does the owner? (The easy hunch says "hell yeah"... but we don't know that.)

Does the GM? (Well, so far, he sure does seem to talk a lot like the owner... ie, "we have to define what it is to be a 'Hawk'")

Most critically... does the coach? (That one, I defy anyone to offer strong evidence either way... he never let himself really be committed to much beyond a seeming conviction that the Trae/DJ experiment is going to be successful.)

 

Then again, we've had the discussion in another thread at some point... even if Quin shares Koonin's take... who's out there that is a legit comparison, and available, and plausibly still young enough to perform at that level...?

Not seeing anyone who checks all those boxes.

 

So, whatchagonnado?

Next best thing would seem to be to identify a player who has a lot of those bulldog traits with a lot of talent, but who for whatever combination of reasons, isn't there yet... and see what price would be necessary to pluck him from his current employer.

 

I've nominated one. And I nominated another one. I'm inclined to think that, regardless of whether either of the specific ones I've nominated would be pursued, that's the most likely most significant acquisition of this off-season... someone who can be envisioned to develop into a Butler-like profile.

[Gray Mule]

STURT:   Perhaps that missing piece is out there, waiting for the Hawks to draft him.  In the draft, sometimes we get it right and sometimes we get a lemon and then can't make lemonade.  Lately our draft has been good.

I know.  Hawks can't just draft a player and then throw him out on the floor and expect greatness.  This only happens to those high lottery picks (Of which we have none) but this "new" team under Quin is going to take a little time.

I expect our regular season win total to fall somewhere between 45 and 50.  Anything above this would be great!

[bleachkit]

On 5/23/2023 at 2:23 PM, Dean Walker said:

Oh I absolutely agree! I want no parts Of Anthony Davis on our hawks!

Why not? He's one of the most impactful defenders in the NBA. He was giving Golden State absolute fits. He's on and off again on offense like a lot of guys, but when he's on he can get you 30 points on good efficiency. He's arguably still a top 20 player, certainly top 30. 

[AHF]

7 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Why not? He's one of the most impactful defenders in the NBA. He was giving Golden State absolute fits. He's on and off again on offense like a lot of guys, but when he's on he can get you 30 points on good efficiency. He's arguably still a top 20 player, certainly top 30. 

I'd love him in a JC+something for AD type of deal.  Not in a Trae for AD type deal.

[bleachkit]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

I'd love him in a JC+something for AD type of deal.  Not in a Trae for AD type deal.

Agreed, but some of the statements made here such as "nobody wants AD" are laughable. 

[HawksNWaffles]

12 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Agreed, but some of the statements made here such as "nobody wants AD" are laughable. 

 I'm more concerned of how much of AD would we get back in return