Seeing a Lot of "Coach Killer" Sorts of Posts Lately

[AHF]

And wanted people to put their stake in the ground on this.  A coach killer to me is a player who negatively undermines a coach who would otherwise have been successful had the player not "killed" them.  So for me, you can't be a coach killer with someone that ownership fires because they are not doing a good job or for bad behavior from the coach or for other reasons that aren't caused by the player.  A player isn't a coach killer simply because their team makes changes at that spot - like Michael Jordan isn't a coach killer simply because he had 3 different coaches his first 3 seasons or 4 different coaches in his first 6 seasons.  

So here is what I'd like to get people's views on:

Lloyd Pierce 

(1) How good of a coach is he?  If you were starting a brand new franchise today and you could hire anyone who isn't currently a head coach, would you hire LP to be your coach?  Also, how many current head coaches would you fire today to replace them with LP if you owned their team?

(2) How good of a job was he doing as a coach during the season leading up to his firing in Atlanta?

(3) Why do you think he was let go and who do you think made that decision?

 

Nate McMillian

(1) How good of a coach is he?  If you were starting a brand new franchise today and you could hire anyone who isn't currently a head coach, would you hire Nate to be your coach?  Also, how many current head coaches would you fire today to replace them with Nate if you owned their team?

(2) How good of a job was he doing as a coach during the season leading up to his firing in Atlanta?

(3) Why do you think he was let go and who do you think made that decision?

 

[kg01]

Nobody that calls our guy a coach killer is willing to hire either of the coaches he allegedly killt. 

Mic droppeth. 

[Final_quest]

I don't think the current coach killer comments are really about LP or Nate.  It stems from Trae's inefficiency last year and in the opener.  

What I hear in the critique is that we keep trying to find the right players and system to work with Trae.  He may have given attitude to LP or Nate in the past, but that isn't being seen or reported with Quin. 

I think anyone calling Trae a coach killer now believe that Trae is trying his best without much of an attitude problem, but his game is the problem.  He's not a winning player.  He's inefficient.  Therefore a team built on Trae is going to lead to a coach getting fired.  

If Trae can't get it going this year, people are gonna start to turn on him and they will want to rebuild with Quin from the ground up.  

[NBASupes]

That's usually from people who don't like Trae

[theheroatl]

16 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

That's usually from people who don't like Trae

Exactly. 

I can't stand those people.. tell me people who you gonna replace Trae with eh?

Yeah I don't think you want that.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

And wanted people to put their stake in the ground on this.  A coach killer to me is a player who negatively undermines a coach who would otherwise have been successful had the player not "killed" them.  So for me, you can't be a coach killer with someone that ownership fires because they are not doing a good job or for bad behavior from the coach or for other reasons that aren't caused by the player.  A player isn't a coach killer simply because their team makes changes at that spot - like Michael Jordan isn't a coach killer simply because he had 3 different coaches his first 3 seasons or 4 different coaches in his first 6 seasons.  

So here is what I'd like to get people's views on:

Lloyd Pierce 

(1) How good of a coach is he?  If you were starting a brand new franchise today and you could hire anyone who isn't currently a head coach, would you hire LP to be your coach?  Also, how many current head coaches would you fire today to replace them with LP if you owned their team?

(2) How good of a job was he doing as a coach during the season leading up to his firing in Atlanta?

(3) Why do you think he was let go and who do you think made that decision?

 

Nate McMillian

(1) How good of a coach is he?  If you were starting a brand new franchise today and you could hire anyone who isn't currently a head coach, would you hire Nate to be your coach?  Also, how many current head coaches would you fire today to replace them with Nate if you owned their team?

(2) How good of a job was he doing as a coach during the season leading up to his firing in Atlanta?

(3) Why do you think he was let go and who do you think made that decision?

 

 

Pierce

• Had a good offensive system, but not a very good coach. He has to get some credit for Trae's PnR development after the horrendous start he had to his career.
• LOL . . heck no I would not hire LP as my coach of a new team
• I would maybe only fire Wes Unseld Jr in Washington, and replace him with LP.

 

• Hawks were blowing game after game in the 4th quarter.  I think we had a league leading 11 blown 4th quarter leads when LP was fired.  Bogi wasn't with the team due to injury, so maybe that was a part of it. Actually, that was a big part of it. But as the coach, he had to figure out what was going wrong, or what would be the solutions to keep this from happening. He didn't come up with any solutions.  Grade at the time of firing ... C-

 

• I think Schlenk started to feel the heat from Ressler to make a change from LP, to a more experienced coach like Nate.  After 2.5 seasons, and Trae playing at All-Star level, Ressler wanted to start winning.

 

Nate

• Nate is a slightly above average coach, that tends to play a conservative brand of basketball. His philosophy is a little too old school and out of date for the modern pace of basketball. His conservative approach is more suited for the more closely called and physical brand of play that you see in the playoffs, than what you see in the regular season, which is more wide open.
• No, I would not start a new franchise with Nate as my coach. I'd get an assistant coach from a top playoff team.
• Nate is probably better than at least 5 - 8 current head coaches, so if I were looking to replace a failing coach with a guy that would give me more stability, Nate wouldn't be out of the question for me to hire.

 

• With the Hawks winning and losing a game and being a .500 team, it's hard to tell if Nate was doing a good or bad coaching job. Some things he could control, but the bad shooting and off and on play of some of our players were out of his control.  But it goes back to his use of Jalen Johnson for me.  He was showing flashes of producing good minutes, when given a chance to play. But Nate didn't consistently play the guy, despite him showing the he could be an impactful player.   So for me, Nate's grade at the time of firing = C

 

• Once again, I think Tony Ressler made this call.  I think Landry had a candidate in mind back in January, in case things failed at the end of the season. But I forget the game, but it was a particular game that Ressler attended in which the Hawks blew a game stupidly.  Camera would routinely pan to Ressler, who had a disgusted look on his face by the end of the game.   LOL . . it may have been the Charlotte game in which Rozier went crazy, now that I think about it.  Even though the Hawks were .500, I think at that point he was done with Nate.

[bleachkit]

Hawks aren't going fire Snyder. They are all in on him. If he can't fix Trae, then it's probably a lost cause. 

[macdaddy]

Pierce firing was long overdue.  We know that Travis wanted to fire him sooner but we had that shortened season.  Trae wasn't the only guy with an issue with Pierce.  

Pierce hasn't gotten an interview, at least publicly, for any of the many HC spots that have come open despite the fact that old farts like Pop and Carlisle think he's the greatest thing.  Why i wonder?  Because his track record is poor and everyone now knows that he's kind of a jerk as a HC despite how great he is off the court. 

Nate's time has just passed.  He was a decent coach but if his own staff is openly fighting with him then that's a problem.

How either of these things are on Trae i have no idea.  Yeah he had one issue with Nate.  That's minor.  You're probably hard pressed to find another star player who's played as many games and minutes as Trae in the last 5 years.  He shows up, in shape, doesn't act out, doesn't get in the news.  Does he  have an ego.  Yeah i'm sure he does.  You need one to be a star in this league. 

[AHF]

I appreciate the engagement but I hope we hear from some of the posters who think that Trae was the reason management fired LP and Nate.  I'm not sure if we are using different definitions of what it means to be a "coach killer" and hope we can flesh that out.

[macdaddy]

Just now, AHF said:

I appreciate the engagement but I hope we hear from some of the posters who think that Trae was the reason management fired LP and Nate.  I'm not sure if we are using different definitions of what it means to be a "coach killer" and hope we can flesh that out.

I just had this debate with a friend and the only evidence really presented was Trae not showing up for that game last year when he was injured.  That's weak in my opinion but that was what they thought. 

[Sothron]

On 10/28/2023 at 7:27 AM, bleachkit said:

Hawks aren't going fire Snyder. They are all in on him. If he can't fix Trae, then it's probably a lost cause. 

Trae will be traded before they fire Snyder. I don't see either happening. Trae is 100% bought in on Quin. He's more into Quin's coaching than he has been to any NBA coach. 

I agree with you is what I'm saying but I think the fear Trae is going to butt heads with Quin is misplaced.

[Sothron]

Not get back on last night's Nate/JJ derailment but LP and Nate are both not head coaching anywhere. I think Nate is done as a HC in the league with his coaching style. I think LP will never get a chance to HC again because he's just not cut out for it.

[macdaddy]

Some coaches need to get killed (figuratively) some don't

 

 

[Spud2nique]

Ty Lue is on the hot seat as of an hour ago..