Hawks looking to trade

[deester11]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

lol Dre as a possible ball handler.....

 

Heel naw! That's.....

[kg01]

15 minutes ago, deester11 said:

And that would be the best defense he ever played.

*gasp*

(Don't you laugh, kg.  It was fkng hilarious butchu you can't let him do meth-B like that...  hold it ..  ... hoooooldddd it ....  )

[TheNorthCydeRises]

15 minutes ago, terrell said:

lol Dre as a possible ball handler.....

 

 

He would play the 2 much like a Tyler Herro.  He wouldn't handle the ball until he's ready to score the basketball.

Not going to ask him to facilitate or anything like that.  Just score the basketball.

Let someone with a more active and aggressive mentality play the 3.

[JeffS17]

25 minutes ago, AHF said:

It is absolutely flawed and the 9-15 spots on the roster are a big flaw.

Said no contender, ever.

[Gray Mule]

Which Hawk brings the ball up the court?  It's not always one of the guards.  Nope.  Jalen Johnson has been seen doing this at least once in every game he plays.  And, no, he doesn't automatically dribble it off his foot or throw it away.  He just don't.  

[ATLien_]

Came up with a trade that I think helps both teams. @Sothronhas said the Wolves will struggle with cap once Kat's new deal kicks in next year. With the way they are playing they are unlikely to move Kat. I'm of the mind to make this two guard lineup work you need a center that can shoot. Capella clogs the paint which keeps DJ and Trae from getting to the paint. See Lively vs Dallas. If the trade us Reid they get a win now player that still stretches the floor but with a contract that expires freeing up ~13m when Kat's new desk kicks in. Matthew's is an expiring that is a salary filler. I would even throw in second if we needed to, but I think this is fine as is. You can play him with Capela and Onyeka interchangeably. What's Reid's availability insiders? What do you think will Minny go for it? 

 

 

[Diesel]

4 hours ago, Vol4ever said:

The whole NBA doesnt play defense

That's inaccurate.  Have you seen Denver play?  They are the anti-Modern NBA team.  I watched them last night.   They picked away at Milwaukee...  They have mastered coming down and efficiently scoring in the midrange or at the goal... and being opportunistic with the three.  People say it's all about Jokic... I say... no.. he's a big part of the machine but those guys are a working machine.  Picks.. Rolls, Pops, Pindowns... Slashing..  it was beautiful basketball..  Then I look at the BS that the modern NBA drivel has everybody trying to do...  Denver understands the fundamental premise of basketball.  Outscore your opponent.  That's what they do.  They are not fancy.. they are down right yeoman-like.

 

[thecampster]

1 hour ago, terrell said:

lol Dre as a possible ball handler.....

 

Dre has developed the ability to ISO, handle the ball for himself and score. I mean nothing more than that with him.

[Diesel]

I educated myself earlier today.  I suggest that you do likewise or hear my summary.   I watched Windhorst talk about our team on the day we hired Quin Snyder.  It cleared up a lot of things for me.

I didn't remember, but Landry said that Quin was our top choice before we had signed Quin.   Windy talked about how Quin negotiated with us with all the leverage because we had an inexperienced front office.  They made mention that Quin has final say on all player movement.  They chuckled.   Basically, Quin is the GM.  So when you read that Quin doesn't want to move DJ...  DJ is off the table.   That sounds final.   Feb 8 or no. 

They also talked about his Meticulousness.   It was a running comparison with him and Rick Carlisle.   In both cases, Quin and Carlisle took over young teams.  IN both Cases Quin and Carlisle got final say on personnel attached to their coaching deals.  Both, Quin and Carlisle are #1 and #2 in meticulousness.  Bottom line both guys will mold the team that they want. 

When they spoke, they believed that JC would be a Hawk but understood that we had been trying to get rid of JC for a long time.   They made mention that Huerter trade was a part of getting DJ even though it was some time in between... and they said that our roster can't be sustained without cutting salary.   They didn't know who but somebody was going to be moved. 

Then Windy said this nugget...

Do you want to pay draft picks who may not make it and will take up a roster space or would you rather have a vet who is proven.  This was his statement in reference to the DJ deal.   He said that the Charlotte pick will probably never be a first.   And the other two picks were supposed to be mid draft picks that may never make it and that we had other picks that would take up roster space and 1st round money that we may have to get rid of anyway. 

But they agreed if given the time and his way that Quin could change the culture in Atlanta. 

I'm waiting to see it. 

 

 

[Diesel]

9 minutes ago, thecampster said:

Dre has developed the ability to ISO, handle the ball for himself and score. I mean nothing more than that with him.

I've seen him dribble it off of his foot too many times this year to agree.   But if it makes you feel better.. I hate the fact that Bey steps out of bounds or travels every game. 

 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, JeffS17 said:

Said no contender, ever.

I am taking this as a concession that you agree you were wrong about how bad our bench is since you are switching from "they aren't that bad because Win Shares is just a team metric" to "these players don't matter."

But let's address the merits of this argument.  Let's look at the best post-season run in Atlanta Hawks history and test that theory.

Did these guys play important minutes in the Hawks' run?

#13 Lou Williams - Absolutely.  Stepped up when we had injuries and played some big minutes in the playoffs.  

#9 Cam Reddish - Yes.  Played several big games in the playoffs.

#12 OO - Yes.  His defense on Giannis was very impactful.

These guys all played key roles for us in very big games.  I will grant that Reddish was a starter when healthy so feel free to remove him from the list and include Solo who was higher on the list after he stepped up when we had injuries and played a key role in making the season a success.  

 

How about Duncan Robinson and Kevin Love on last year's Heat?  Think they were useless to that team?  Does Miami make the finals if you replace them with what we've gotten from our 9-15 players?

The 2022 Warriors got over 37 mpg in the playoffs from their regular season 9-15 people and they were very good minutes with GPII at a team leading .235 WS/48; Moody, Bjelica, and Kuminga outperforming starters like Green and Thompson, etc.  They were quite important to that championship run.  

Etc.

Plenty of playoff runs have been bolstered or undermined by team depth.  Of course your core players are more important but these guys are not trivial to every team and we have played the majority of our season missing at least one starter which pushes all those guys up in the rotation and when they have so little to give it hurts.

 

[swanlee]

So is DJM pretty much off the market now? Hope so, no reason he can't work out here

[AHF]

Just now, swanlee said:

So is DJM pretty much off the market now? Hope so, no reason he can't work out here

My personal guess (and it is only speculation on my part) is that this was sending a message that we aren't giving DJM away.  It was a pushback on some of the crappy deals that have been out there to drag his value in the mud.  I suspect he is still very much on the market at least if the price is right but hopefully not a "we'll take the best of whatever offers we get" situation.

[JeffS17]

3 minutes ago, AHF said:

I am taking this as a concession that you agree you were wrong about how bad our bench is since you are switching from "they aren't that bad because Win Shares is just a team metric" to "these players don't matter."

It's not -- I started to type up a rebuttal starting with the definition of win shares then decided it's really not worth my time to debate the merits of a stat that does not matter for a group of guys (9-15 on the bench) that are the least of this rosters worries.  But I'm fine if you want to take the W there.  This team has a flawed starting roster and that is orders of magnitude more important than our end of bench depth.

[kg01]

3 minutes ago, AHF said:

My personal guess (and it is only speculation on my part) is that this was sending a message that we aren't giving DJM away.  It was a pushback on some of the crappy deals that have been out there to drag his value in the mud.  I suspect he is still very much on the market at least if the price is right but hopefully not a "we'll take the best of whatever offers we get" situation.

Perhaps also a message to the player that we're not gonna deal you just to get him gone so no need for actin' up. 

[Diesel]

10 minutes ago, swanlee said:

So is DJM pretty much off the market now? Hope so, no reason he can't work out here

If Quin is saying it and he sticks to it.. Yeah.

 

[Diesel]

10 minutes ago, swanlee said:

So is DJM pretty much off the market now? Hope so, no reason he can't work out here

Next thing you know.. Orlando offers Joe Ingles, Suggs, and a 1st and we're happy to take it. 

 

[AHF]

12 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

It's not -- I started to type up a rebuttal starting with the definition of win shares then decided it's really not worth my time to debate the merits of a stat that does not matter for a group of guys (9-15 on the bench) that are the least of this rosters worries.  

If you can name a worse bench from 9-15 from any era then please share the metric you prefer and let's jump in.

Our #9 player by BPM is -4.1.

Our #9 player by VORP is -0.2.

Our #9 player by PER is 6.8.  

Our 9-15 spots cumulatively are much worse.  I'm up for looking at any metric you want to use.  

Using PER, for example, here is our comparison against the Pistons 9-15 slots (ranked highest to lowest and excluding Gallo because he has only played 2 games for them as he otherwise would have blown everyone away because they were two games with really good numbers):

Bruno 12.9 vs Bagley 18.0

Mills 7.5 vs Wiseman 15.2

Forrest 6.9 vs Morris 14.8

Garrison 6.8 vs Sasser 14.1

Wesley 4.7 vs Umude 13.4

AJ 2.1 vs Muscala 12.4

Lundy 0.1 vs Knox 10.6

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

Hawks have 12 contracted players for next season at $163,292, 574. (does not include Bey). Add in the #8 and #21 picks we are getting close to the dreaded LT.

So we are over the salary cap by $22 million, but we are also under the Luxury Tax $8.8 million.

[theheroatl]

8 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

 

Hawks have 12 contracted players for next season at $163,292, 574. (does not include Bey). Add in the #8 and #21 picks we are getting close to the dreaded LT.

So we are over the salary cap by $22 million, but we are also under the Luxury Tax $8.8 million.

We just have to wait until Centennial Yards is done….

Edited January 30 by theheroatl