Trae Young - The Man, The Viper, and The Prosecution aka The MVP aka Ice Trae

[enrique]

38 minutes ago, benhillboy said:

I hate to break up the love fest but I’m obligated to lend career perspective and balance (courtesy of statmuse):

 

And that my man is why plus/minus is worthless. At least do on/off and compare to team overall. You will find Trae stand extremely tall. 

[Diesel]

1 minute ago, enrique said:

And that my man is why plus/minus is worthless. At least do on/off and compare to team overall. You will find Trae stand extremely tall. 

 

Tyrese Haliburton is -503...   I think @benhillboy is on to something.  Tyrese should not be allowed near an allstar game.

Yeah.. THESE BS STATS.  Stop Littering!!!

 

 

[benhillboy]

On 12/23/2023 at 12:25 AM, enrique said:

And that my man is why plus/minus is worthless. At least do on/off and compare to team overall. You will find Trae stand extremely tall. 

His career on per 100 is -.5, squarely in the middle of what  I’ve been declaring his true impact is for 3 years.   His on/ off is a mediocre +3.3 mainly due to horrible BU PG options outside of Delon.  But “Superstar!”

Anyway, back to some real original analysis.  Trae takes a corner three once every 4 or 5 games shooting a whooping .464.  When is his IQ gonna level up to taking advantage of arguably the game’s most valuable shot?

[benhillboy]

On 12/23/2023 at 12:28 AM, Diesel said:

 

Tyrese Haliburton is -503...   I think @benhillboy is on to something.  Tyrese should not be allowed near an allstar game.

Yeah.. THESE BS STATS.  Stop Littering!!!

 

 

I’m fully aware of Haliburton’s and SGA’s poor career +/-.   You know I don’t rely on one metric.  Check their WS/48, on/ off, and net ratings this season.  Most are out of reach of anything Trae is capable of with far younger and/ or lower paid teammates.

And when yall laugh/ dismiss serious basketball conversation (and stats that every outlet follows) it just reeks of deflecting hurt.  But I’m talking to folks who totally dismiss the fact that he leads the entire planet in turnovers since he arrived yet has none of the size or athletic advantages that all the other players who turn over a lot have.

I know yall live and die with other peoples opinions of Trae but just ignore me instead.

Edited December 24, 2023 by benhillboy

[benhillboy]

I can accept and rationalize stats for my favorite players good and bad, y’all should do the same. Jimmy’s playoff +/- is only +26 as dominant as he’s been the past couple (career regular +/- +2128)  Steph is on pace for his worst healthy on/off by far this season at -7.2 (career +5691).

You +/- and advanced metrics non-believers will come around at some point trust me.  After Trae retires most likely.

Edited December 24, 2023 by benhillboy

[NBASupes]

22 hours ago, benhillboy said:

I’m fully aware of Haliburton’s and SGA’s poor career +/-.   You know I don’t rely on one metric.  Check their WS/48, on/ off, and net ratings this season.  Most are out of reach of anything Trae is capable of with far younger and/ or lower paid teammates.

And when yall laugh/ dismiss serious basketball conversation (and stats that every outlet follows) it just reeks of deflecting hurt.  But I’m talking to folks who totally dismiss the fact that he leads the entire planet in turnovers since he arrived yet has none of the size or athletic advantages that all the other players who turn over a lot have.

I know yall live and die with other peoples opinions of Trae but just ignore me instead.

[]. I don't like this team at all. Everyone can go to me if it makes us a potential contender. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

16 hours ago, benhillboy said:

His career on per 100 is -.5, squarely in the middle of what  I’ve been declaring his true impact is for 3 years.   His on/ off is a mediocre +3.3 mainly due to horrible BU PG options outside of Delon.  But “Superstar!”

Anyway, back to some real original analysis.  Trae takes a corner three once every 4 or 5 games shooting a whooping .464.  When is his IQ gonna level up to taking advantage of arguably the game’s most valuable shot?

Stop this. It has nothing to do with his IQ level.  He's literally creating tons of wide open corner 3s for his teammates.  Will they do the same for him?

How many point guards in the league park themselves in the corner, and shoot corner 3s?

If the offense is designed for him to be in the corner, and his teammates pass him the ball there, he will get more shot opportunities.  But to do that, it has to be within the scheme of the offense.

Stop acting like Trae has control of him taking corner 3s, when he's literally the conductor of the offense.

# of total Corner 3 FG attempts by the other top PGs in the league:

• Curry:  28
• Brunson:  19
• Fox:  18
• Maxey:  16
• Lillard:  15
• Mitchell:  9
• Luka: 7
• SGA:  5
• Booker:  5

Your high assist guys don't park themselves in the corner.

[Diesel]

21 hours ago, benhillboy said:

I’m fully aware of Haliburton’s and SGA’s poor career +/-.

If you knew that, then you would realize that the stats that you paraded around this thread and littered this thread with is totally meaningless.  So now you want to bring in more stats that I haven't shot down yet.  Instead of jumping from meaningless stat to meaningless stat.. Let's have a proper funeral for this one.

[Final_quest]

23 hours ago, benhillboy said:

I can accept and rationalize stats for my favorite players good and bad, y’all should do the same. Jimmy’s playoff +/- is only +26 as dominant as he’s been the past couple (career regular +/- +2128)  Steph is on pace for his worst healthy on/off by far this season at -7.2 (career +5691).

You +/- and advanced metrics non-believers will come around at some point trust me.  After Trae retires most likely.

How about Steph Curry was getting insane plus minus numbers from a few years playing with HOF teammates.  The first year he played without Klay and KG he was -43 and Warriors only won 15 games.  Trae Young's first year playing with better players, no allstars, he was +267.  

It's almost like who you play with matters.  Give Trae prime KG, Klay, and Draymond and see what happens.  Then give Curry Trae's supporting cast from the past two years.  I think plus minus is meaningful, but definitely needs context.  

[Spud2nique]

23 hours ago, benhillboy said:

You +/- and advanced metrics non-believers will come around at some point trust me.  After Trae retires most likely.

Nope , I’ll never go!!!! Nevaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!  

[macdaddy]

Really bums me out that all this is just meaningless.  Stupid garbage stats. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

On 12/24/2023 at 8:58 AM, benhillboy said:

I can accept and rationalize stats for my favorite players good and bad, y’all should do the same. Jimmy’s playoff +/- is only +26 as dominant as he’s been the past couple (career regular +/- +2128)  Steph is on pace for his worst healthy on/off by far this season at -7.2 (career +5691).

You +/- and advanced metrics non-believers will come around at some point trust me.  After Trae retires most likely.

Who is the best player Trae Young has ever played with?

[NBASupes]

12 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Who is the best player Trae Young has ever played with?

Hopefully Kevin Durant and Bradley Beal.

[NBASupes]

I agree with some of you boys on Trae. Put him with KD and he's probably 1st Team All NBA and a MVP candidate. But he's not with KD. He's with Hunter and another PG named Dejounte Murray. It is what it is. 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

[RedDawg#8]

For the Trae-tors:

 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

 

shameful we only managed 4 wins. 

 

[benhillboy]

28 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

 

shameful we only managed 4 wins. 

 

Yeah these past 8 games were a soft spot in the schedule before a gauntlet in January.  The strength of schedule before the Cavs game was 7th.  It’s now 20th and the Hawks still lost significant ground

The 4 game losing streak didn’t do them any favors at all.  If they can somehow beat OKC to start the new year though I’ll damn near forgive all of the losing (2 losses to the hampered heat most notably)

Trae has been at 40 minutes per the last 5 games.  Hawks gotta get a capable BU in here asap.

Edited January 1 by benhillboy

[benhillboy]

Looking at this brass though I’m not holding my breath on any significant, obviously improving moves.  Need more yachts and land acquisitions!

Most teams have a couple players at the end of their bench with great metrics.  I need a barf bag looking at how the Hawks fleshed out their roster.  On what planet should Patty be making $7 milly?  Thank goodness for Jalen wildly outplaying his rookie deal.

 

Edited January 1 by benhillboy