Let's Talk Trade Ideas!

[sturt]

  

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Clarification to the Oladipo contract situation with Indy. They're offering a NEW contract 4yrs/$80 mil. ($20 mil per). Seems Dipo wants his current contract extended - 120% of his current salary plus 8% annual raises which equates to $25/$27/$29/$31 million over 4 years. This makes it even easier to pass on with the uncertainty of the future status of the NBA salary cap implications.

 

Any move represents a risk. We pay the GM to decide which ones are better ones to take than others.

Maybe Oladipo represents too much of a risk.

The difference between us often boils down to the fact that one of us openly makes room in his comments that his thoughts might not be aligned with the GM's risk/reward assessment and tolerance.

Again, for me, it's not about one particular player because how can I even really peer into Schlenk's brain to decipher who is specifically on his target list. All I know is what he's told us. So my posts reflect my attempts to follow those cues and offer up some ideas, some of them more likely than others, some of them more appealing than others. But hey, it's what we do.

I'm not sitting here talking about jags who won't really move the needle in the big picture as potential additions to the roster, because jags aren't going to challenge for starting jobs. Simple as that.

[Buzzard]

5 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I'm not calling them a champion core. They're the core on which the rebuild is taking place - 5 guys 22 and under.

All I'm saying, I'd like to see them play more than less than a quarter of the season together and healthy before moving them for high priced players. I would like for us to have a usable/adequate bench to supplement their skills.

Cam starting next to Trae, with Huerter off the bench is a real possibility next season.

Not a lot has changed since I joined this board close to 20 years ago. Back then it was the Dieselputer with his constant off the wall trades to fix our team. Fantasy trades can be fun,  entertaining to read, a good laugh for the most part; but some people take themselves way to seriously.

I agree that no one is untouchable. The rumor mill of Collins for JJJ was intriguing. But Schlenk is not going to move any of our core easily. Even with the addition of Capela, our team is still way to young in the development process and also friendly on the books to be using up our assets and cap on players like Horford ( 33 ),  Aldridge ( 34 ), Oladipo ( 28 this month and coming off a major injury ) etc.

Schlenk said he wanted some young vets with potential who were being used as reserves; he has also stated he is not opposed to paying a superstar ( AD anyone ) if he can land one. But I have never heard him say he needs to fix this team ( his core ) other than misjudging our depth.

My agenda in these types of threads has never changed. Read. smile, laugh, even shake your head at the childishness when people start becoming Diesel like. Fantasy trades are nothing more than fantasy. There is nothing reasonable about them; other than they work on the trade machine or Dieselputer.

Edited May 3, 2020 by Buzzard

[Spud2nique]

3 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Moving on.

Any interest in trading #1 for Jaylen Brown and #17 from the Celtics. (You know my thoughts about trading with the Sees).

This past offseason, rumor that Schlenk would offer RFA offer to Brown if Celts didn't.

For the #1 pick? No. If we fall outside top #5, under consideration.

I love Jaylen Brown and think he’s the perfect fit with us. I would love to bring him home and would trade for him ...

But like you, I hate dealing with the Schmelts. If he was on 28 other teams I’d make an offer for sure. I just cannot deal with the Celtics after our miserable history with them as far as trades.

[Spud2nique]

4 hours ago, sturt said:

 

So, I see how this works.

I quote the GM.

Or someone who is a paid reporter who is him/herself purporting to quote the GM, assuming we can trust him/her (?).

 

You quote... um... who did you quote?... yourself?... Jay?...

 

Okay, so... just for future reference... here's a quote that seems to be relevant suddenly, in case you haven't heard or said this one yourself at some point...

 

 

 

Huh ???

Until you understand that your ideas aren’t Schlenk’s ideas, it’ll never work. I’m getting a feeling that perhaps you aren’t being heard and that might be irking you inside a bit. Couple that with the fact that you never read anyone’s posts, just skim over it and put your twist on it, it’s really getting hard to take your posts seriously Sturt. May need to go back to the lab . #strivetobebetter

[Buzzard]

3 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

I love Jaylen Brown and think he’s the perfect fit with us. I would love to bring him home and would trade for him ...

But like you, I hate dealing with the Schmelts. If he was on 28 other teams I’d make an offer for sure. I just cannot deal with the Celtics after our miserable history with them as far as trades.

Is Hayward and Tatum enough to put the Celtics over the top in the East? Ainge has some tough calls coming up real soon.

[Spud2nique]

3 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

Is Hayward and Tatum enough to put the Celtics over the top in the East? Ainge has some tough calls coming up real soon.

Ya he certainly does. I’m guessing he wants to keep Brown over Hayward. Gordon is a fav of the coach but Jaylen directly impacts winning to me. He plays really hard on both ends. He’s probably one of my fav non Hawks, but then again he’s a C.

 

While we are on the topic of the C’s, I’d love Smart as well. Jaylen and Smart I’d go after any day. To me, they are the reason the Celts are good, not so much Kemba and Tatum.

[Buzzard]

18 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Ya he certainly does. I’m guessing he wants to keep Brown over Hayward. Gordon is a fav of the coach but Jaylen directly impacts winning to me. He plays really hard on both ends. He’s probably one of my fav non Hawks, but then again he’s a C.

 

While we are on the topic of the C’s, I’d love Smart as well. Jaylen and Smart I’d go after any day. To me, they are the reason the Celts are good, not so much Kemba and Tatum.

Hayward is having the most efficient season of his career. He is flat out balling on the offensive end ( 17.3 PTS and .593 TS% ). Someone is going to pay him this year, if he opts out, or next.

Ainge needs to shore up his interior in my opinion. I agree about Tatum but the Celtics have a good core. I just don't think together they are a Championship core. To soft on the front line with Hayward, Tatum, and Theis or Kanter.

Edited May 3, 2020 by Buzzard

[sturt]

52 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Huh ???

Until you understand that your ideas aren’t Schlenk’s ideas, it’ll never work. I’m getting a feeling that perhaps you aren’t being heard and that might be irking you inside a bit. Couple that with the fact that you never read anyone’s posts, just skim over it and put your twist on it, it’s really getting hard to take your posts seriously Sturt. May need to go back to the lab . #strivetobebetter

 

Quit stealing my lines.

Like this one that you evidently failed to read, since it debunks everything you said in your first sentence... that is, for those who actually read it... self-evidently, not for you.

  

22 hours ago, sturt said:

 

You. Just. Refuse. To get it.

It's.

Not about Ingram.

Not about Davis.

Not about Wood.

Not about Oladipo... or anyone else.

It's difficult to have an intelligent conversation with someone whose responses keep pretending that I'm just tossing out pet cats of his (like you at least are self-aware to acknowledge that that's what you do)... and whose responses give no indication that he understands the actual core premise here is to identify legitimate or potentially legitimate opportunities for Schlenk to add a high tier talent to this roster.

We all like this core. Or, at least you do, and I do.

But Schlenk himself has told you... as much as you seem to ignore it... he's not done adding to the core.

It is a direct and recent quote, and it's showed up in many, many posts by now, so ignoring it serves no purpose but to make a person seem purposefully obtuse and closed-minded.... or, alternatively, just doesn't read.

 

In that same conversation with reporters, he specifically indicated, in direct contrast to what you just said when you said...

... that he will not avoid adding one or even two players who can challenge the current core for minutes... and it doesn't take an Einstein or even merely a sturt or a Spud to figure out that of the five positions, those are least likely to be PG or PF... so that leaves you with the other three.

 

So, don't argue with me. Go argue with the GM. Or, better, follow what he tells you he's going to do, and respond to posts as-if you are fully aware and comprehending what he's said.

Shouldn't be too much to ask, but post after post after post and like after like after like, it's clear who among us is actually reconciling our conclusions with what the GM has said and who just is dog-determined to turn a blind eye/deaf ear.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[sturt]

@AHF .... yep... just as noted in recent PM exchanges, there goes that camouflage thing again, taking those personal shots.

I've never taken a personal shot at him. Never have, at least to my knowledge. If I have, I'd be happy to apologize.

No one--me, him or anyone else--should ever have to apologize for shooting down what others say. And it's been mighty convenient for him to have confounded my doing that with what he's doing, ie, personal shots.

I'm pissed, again, because I feel completely fooled. I thought he was better than this for all these years. Actually, I'm sure he is. But he's sunk into this feeling-sorry-for-himself funk, and unfortunately, he's got the affections of the clan just encouraging that. Maybe it's just the covid thing that's gotten him off his game. Dunno. Hope it's not permanent.

[sturt]

1 hour ago, Spud2nique said:

I love Jaylen Brown and think he’s the perfect fit with us. I would love to bring him home and would trade for him ...

This probably is gonna bother you, but just know... indeed, this does follow that Schlenk would pursue it... just make sure that the others in the clan don't think you're serious, because they're on-record as being dead-set against adding talent that might threaten a current Hawk starter's minutes.

 

 

EDIT: Wait. Am I being punked here?

Sorry. I failed to pick up on your sarcasm.

[Spud2nique]

20 minutes ago, sturt said:

@AHF .... yep... just as noted in recent PM exchanges, there goes that camouflage thing again, taking those personal shots.

I've never taken a personal shot at him. Never have, at least to my knowledge. If I have, I'd be happy to apologize.

No one--me, him or anyone else--should ever have to apologize for shooting down what others say. And it's been mighty convenient for him to have confounded my doing that with what he's doing, ie, personal shots.

I'm pissed, again, because I feel completely fooled. I thought he was better than this for all these years. Actually, I'm sure he is. But he's sunk into this feeling-sorry-for-himself funk, and unfortunately, he's got the affections of the clan just encouraging that. Maybe it's just the covid thing that's gotten him off his game. Dunno. Hope it's not permanent.

Oh no what did kg say about you now? You do understand that if I don’t agree with your posts that it’s not a personal attack right?  

 

21 minutes ago, sturt said:

But he's sunk into this feeling-sorry-for-himself funk, and unfortunately, he's got the affections of the clan just encouraging that. Maybe it's just the covid thing that's gotten him off his game. Dunno. Hope it's not permanent.

If anything, this is more of a personal attack than anything anyone has said about your posts lately. 

[sturt]

5 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Let me repeat....you said I MADE IT UP....I did not....take your L and move on, I have!

Hold everything.

First, my friend, I take pride in taking my L's when they happen.

Far be it for someone, ie who rarely if ever has let herself concede a point, come to the table, and then pretend I have a problem with taking a L when it's deserved.

Second, lest anyone take your twisting remarks about twisting seriously, if I've failed at all in this vein of conversation, it's that I failed to remind folks what your original words actually were...

Quote

I think Schlenk's focus as he's indicated is in shoring up our bench and depth around the Core 5 and Capela. 

 

1) Schlenk said he's ideally going to add to the core, and without any concerns about adding anyone too good who might threaten minutes of the current core....

Yep, no denyin that... try as you and others have tried.

 

2) Pierce has indeed spoken about his current "core 5"...

Yep, no denyin that... indeed, that wasn't even part of the discussion.

 

3) When I called you on your core-5 reference, it had everything to do with #1, nothing to do with #2.

 

5 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Twist it to make it about who actually said it,

 

And yes, this is me right now... don't miss those big pearly whites smilin and the lighthearted laughter behind the wagging finger.  

[sturt]

9 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Oh no what did kg say about you now? You do understand that if I don’t agree with your posts that it’s not a personal attack right?  

 

If anything, this is more of a personal attack than anything anyone has said about your posts lately. 

kg?

you?

Silly rabbit.

But... once again... hehe... you keep taking my lines.

[sturt]

5 hours ago, sturt said:

  

Any move represents a risk. We pay the GM to decide which ones are better ones to take than others.

Maybe Oladipo represents too much of a risk.

The difference between us often boils down to the fact that one of us openly makes room in his comments that his thoughts might not be aligned with the GM's risk/reward assessment and tolerance.

Again, for me, it's not about one particular player because how can I even really peer into Schlenk's brain to decipher who is specifically on his target list. All I know is what he's told us. So my posts reflect my attempts to follow those cues and offer up some ideas, some of them more likely than others, some of them more appealing than others. But hey, it's what we do.

I'm not sitting here talking about jags who won't really move the needle in the big picture as potential additions to the roster, because jags aren't going to challenge for starting jobs. Simple as that.

 

@Spud2nique before you post yet another post that steals my lines, please make sure you've read this one... might save you any new unnecessary embarrassment, ol friend.   Wasn't written in reply to you originally, but size 7 feet normally fit size 7 shoes, right?

 

[sturt]

re: Gordon and Victor... some thoughts from ~2 weeks ago...

 

I was wrong.

There does appear to be growing curiosity about Victor's availability. As Jay posted earlier, Victor's agents are working on getting a commitment now, not later, and that essentially was the prompting for the thought that maybe IND, SAS and ATL could come together on a deal.

Hayward still would represent an interesting option for reasons already highlighted above, and in the context of the "wikileaks" thread that bore this here exchange b/t me and AHF.

[Buzzard]

1 hour ago, Spud2nique said:

Oh no what did kg say about you now? You do understand that if I don’t agree with your posts that it’s not a personal attack right?  

 

If anything, this is more of a personal attack than anything anyone has said about your posts lately. 

Maybe its me he is talking about but I am not sure Sturt posted all three of the Horford, Aldrige, amd Oladipo trade scenarios. If he did, it still does not change my mind. I think all three are pretty far fetched given the cap they would cost.

Collins is younger than all three, he has never been seriously injured, and he is arguably more productive than all three. Schlenk is rumored to be on the fence about paying or trading Collins. Why anyone would think he would be all in on any of these three players is beyond what I would call reasonable expectations. Even more ridiculous if it cost us valuable cheaper assets on top of the cap.

Its fine to like all three of those players, they are very good players; but its pretty far fetched in my opinion to think Schlenk likes them that much ( assets plus cap ).

Edited May 3, 2020 by Buzzard

[Peoriabird]

50 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

Maybe its me he is talking about but I am not sure Sturt posted all three of the Horford, Aldrige, amd Oladipo trade scenarios. If he did, it still does not change my mind. I think all three are pretty far fetched given the cap they would cost.

Collins is younger than all three, he has never been seriously injured, and he is arguably more productive than all three. Schlenk is rumored to be on the fence about paying or trading Collins. Why anyone would think he would be all in on any of these three players is beyond what I would call reasonable expectations. Even more ridiculous if it cost us valuable cheaper assets on top of the cap.

Its fine to like all three of those players, they are very good players; but its pretty far fetched in my opinion to think Schlenk likes them that much ( assets plus cap ).

Plus, what would those guy do for the team? 6th seed ceiling? I don't get it either.  The prudent thing to do is to see whether or not the younger players with a higher ceiling can reach their potential rather than going the Bud route of having an older team going no where.

[thecampster]

8 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I'm not calling them a champion core. They're the core on which the rebuild is taking place - 5 guys 22 and under.

All I'm saying, I'd like to see them play more than less than a quarter of the season together and healthy before moving them for high priced players. I would like for us to have a usable/adequate bench to supplement their skills.

Cam starting next to Trae, with Huerter off the bench is a real possibility next season.

Huerter next to Teague, who is much better at setting up a 3 point shooter right now but not as good at penetration as Trae is my preference. Teague could really use Huerter and his ball handling ability, ability to muscle penetrate.

If Huerter does one thing well, it is that dribble to the middle stop and pop or stutter and lean. Huerter is deceptively strong as a controlled driver to the basket. He can't blow by people but catch left of elbow, controlled drive to the middle of the lane is a very, very good 2nd move for him and makes you respect him spotting up from 3. So playing next to Teague for extended stretches and only spot next to Trae is how I see him.

Edited May 3, 2020 by thecampster

[sturt]

10 minutes ago, thecampster said:

next to Teague

You think Teague's back, then?

[sturt]

14 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

The prudent thing to do is to see whether or not the younger players with a higher ceiling can reach their potential rather than going the Bud route of having an older team going no where.

 

2 hours ago, sturt said:

We all like this core. Or, at least you do, and I do.

But Schlenk himself has told you... as much as you seem to ignore it... he's not done adding to the core.

It is a direct and recent quote, and it's showed up in many, many posts by now, so ignoring it serves no purpose but to make a person seem purposefully obtuse and closed-minded.... or, alternatively, just doesn't read.

 

In that same conversation with reporters, he specifically indicated, in direct contrast to what you just said when you said...

... that he will not avoid adding one or even two players who can challenge the current core for minutes... and it doesn't take an Einstein or even merely a sturt or a Spud to figure out that of the five positions, those are least likely to be PG or PF... so that leaves you with the other three.

 

So, don't argue with me. Go argue with the GM. Or, better, follow what he tells you he's going to do, and respond to posts as-if you are fully aware and comprehending what he's said.

Shouldn't be too much to ask, but post after post after post and like after like after like, it's clear who among us is actually reconciling our conclusions with what the GM has said and who just is dog-determined to turn a blind eye/deaf ear.